Before:
Attachment 48658
Attachment 48659
After:
Attachment 48660
Attachment 48661
The complete rifle:
Attachment 48662
The toughest wood repair job I've done up to now. More some other day, when I've recovered!
Printable View
Before:
Attachment 48658
Attachment 48659
After:
Attachment 48660
Attachment 48661
The complete rifle:
Attachment 48662
The toughest wood repair job I've done up to now. More some other day, when I've recovered!
Nice Monkey Tail you have there Patrick. What caliber? Looks like the wood woims made lunch out of the stock but you did a fine job of repairing it, can hardly see it.
Outstanding work, bravo!!!
Very nice work, that looks great!
What tipe of glue do you use? Did you dowel the repair? Lovely job!
Well done Patrick!.....Frank
Par excellence and great skill
I use Ponal Express - a modern PVA glue from Henkel (makers of Pattex). I have looked at various resin-type glues, but they all harden far too quickly for mending breaks - you have no time to adjust the pieces after applying the glue. On the container it claims that significant strength is already obtained after 5 minutes. Not true with hardwoods, where the dense structure means that you MUST leave the joint clamped overnight, better 24 hrs.Quote:
Originally Posted by HOOKED ON HISTORY
And resins can be quite brittle when they harden. PVA remains slightly elastic, but is strong enough that if you glue two pieces of softwood together, and then deliberately break the joint (no hearsay - I tried it myself before starting on the Monkey Tail) the wood will fail rather than the glue.
The joint was not dowelled, but a 4mm stainless steel threaded rod was inserted to provide some continuous compression. Full explanation with pics will be provided in a later post.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vintage hunter
No doubt about that - it's marked on the receiver!
Bore diameter 450
Attachment 48674
Groove diameter
Attachment 48675
Slugging the bore confirmed these values.
Quote:
Originally Posted by vintage hunter
Yeah, them woody woims is a pest!
If there are any Monkey Tail or Portuguese rifle experts out there, perhaps someone could help me with the markings?
The two attached photos show a number above the trigger that may be a Portuguese rack number, with a small triangle to its left.
To the left of that, above the sling swivel, there appears to be stamped "FA" (maybe PA) over 1886??? Portuguese arsenal mark ???? The marking is so faint, but the integrating power of the eye in "joining the dots" is so strong, that you can make this out more or less if you move your head around while looking at the screen. Weird but true!
Any explanation for the markings would be most welcome.
My dad was a custom cabinet maker and I apprenticed under him in my youth. I chose a different path in life but a few things stuck with me. A glued joint is always stronger then the wood itself if done properly.
I use good old Elmer's wood glue or depending on the repair 2 part epoxy with dowels,biscuits,SS threaded rod and fiberglass where needed. Wanna get your adhesive deep in a crack? Use a vacuum bag they sell for clothes storage. Glue it, clamp it, put it in the bag over night.
That's what I would call a really well stippled trigger, no slippage there by cripes.
Here is a photo of the test piece:Quote:
Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick
Attachment 48682
There is also a great variation in the quality of PVA glues available. The best stuff I have ever used is this Yella Tera: http://www.sunshinecoasttoyshobbies....7&category=111
I always thought it was PVA anyway... Aliphatic resin... absolutely magic stuff.
I generally use the old "slow" Araldite.
Plenty of time to tweak positions with that stuff, especially in cold weather.
A couple of tricks when using it:
Cut these into long (at least a metre) strips about half an inch (12-13mm) wide and store in a plastic bag with "French Chalk" or any "Talcum" powder; scent is optional.
Cut these into long (at least a metre) strips and store in a plastic bag with "French Chalk" or any "Talcum" powder; scent is optional.
CAREFULLY apply a hot air gun (Paint-stripper on "low" setting) to drive out moisture AND old oil from the damaged area.
THOROUGHLY degrease the wood: "Carburetor Cleaner" works a treat.
If you think the repair requires "hidden" dowels, fit them now: have fun!
Apply a thin coat of epoxy to both parts.
Carefully line up the pieces.
And now for the "tricky bit".
Wipe off any oozing excess glue NOW.
Slowly wrap the rubber strips around the repaired area, stretching it as you go. This applies surprisingly high pressure to the join but leaves no nasty clamp marks and doesn't require fancy jigs.
Put the job somewhere warm (next to the water heater is OK) and go away for 24 hours (like it says on the instructions for the glue). The stock has probably been broken for decades; what's another day?
After a nervous 24 hours, unwrap the goodies. There will probably be the odd spot where the epoxy has bonded rubber to wood; whip out your best scalpel and CAREFULLY trim it back. If necessary, apply heat using a small soldering iron to soften the epoxy under the offending rubber remains and then use the scalpel.
After that, the usual "tidying-up" is required before applying your oil of choice to the very thirsty timber.
I think your talking about rubber hose Bruce correct? I use the stuff they wrap around your arm to draw blood, I get it at medical supply store.
Rubber hose? Do you mean like surgical tubing, the pale brown stuff that is also handy for sling-shots etc?
Being a cheapskate, I use long strips of vulcanised rubber, cut by hand from old vehicle inner-tubes. Your local tyre shop should have a few out the back. The other useful thing about inner-tube rubber is that you can cut it as wide or narrow as you need for a particular job.
I would think you would have to be very careful around solvents and such with surgical tubing, as it is not "vulcanised", hence the translucent brown colour.
Yup, surgical tubing, No, never had a problem but then again I don't remember ever mixing the two either. Inner tube...hmmmm..my boys over the years have built a stockpile of them in my shed. Wish I thought of that..:(
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce_in_Oz
Good idea, the trick is to find it around these parts. And the rubber strips are an A1 idea! (Yes, I did have to apply some "jiggery-pokery")
It is a bit odd that you have trouble finding "the good stuff' in Germany. After all, Araldite was invented just "over the fence" in Switzerland, just after WW2.
I guess everyone is in a hurry these days, but the "5 minute" varieties don't allow time for "soaking into" the wood or "fine adjustment" of the pieces.
HUGE improvement on the dodgy old casein-based adhesives, though.
"Interesting" glue is apparently why some Mosquito bombers had problems with engines "falling off in flight" whilst serving in "tropical" places like India; VERY exciting if you were driving one at the time. Pretty exciting for the locals on the ground too: " Look mum, it's raining Merlins!"
I didn't know that about the Merlins, but, trying hard to remain serious, I read somewhere in a book on material strengths and adhesives, referring specifically to gliders, that in WW2 there was trouble with glued joints in wood because the components were being finished very smooth before assembly. This was a well-meaning error, on the assumption " the smoother the surface the closer the joint the better the bond". Wrong assumption. Microscopic examination revealed that the smoothing results in tiny fibre hairs on the wood surface that take up the glue and tear off (relatively) easily under load. A straight cut (or a clean break) bonds better. Not trusting my memory to be perfect, I shall dig it out and correct the above if I am wrong.
I used to swear by the old hot animal glue we were taught to use during my apprenticeship. Lasts a lifetime. BUT then learned about aircraft quality woodworking adshesive that you have to use if you are building your own aircraft. In the UK samples are taken for trest and destruction before you can go onto the next stage. If it's good enough to pass for a C of A, then that's good enough for me.
Ah, hot animal glue. That brings back memories, it is good stuff. Peter, did you ever walk back into the shop the next morning after someone (hopefully not you) forgot to turn off the double boiler containing the glue the night before? Whew, the burned odor permeated everything and, if you didn't have a window to open - several actually - it would be there for a while. Always good for a few words from someone in charge...... and everyone else! :bitch:
I tried to find some of that old anjimal glue stuff but it seems to have gone completely. The trouble is that I forget the smell now! Some smells just stay with you. Overalls that permanently smell of XG279 or Oil, OX52 and a mix of linseed.
Good heavens, what have I done? Started a glue-sniffers thread, it seems:madsmile:
Patrick, there is nothing like the smell of scorthed animal (hide) glue, it will knock you off your feet! Imagine the odor of burned fingernails, hair and leather combined......
Peter, here is a source:
Antique Restorer's Veneer Hide Glue - Lee Valley Tools
When I was still working as a theater technician we used to buy it in 25 pound bags since we used it for sizing scenic flats, but almost no one does that anymore. After switching to work as a theater electrician I have lost track of the sources we used to use, many of them are long out of business. Still, artists use it to prepare their canvases so there are probably other sources as well.
Of course you will need an electric glue pot as well but I'm sure Lee Valley has that too. :cheers:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce_in_Oz
I never thought about that possibility. A definite AW ****! I do remember that when I was a kid just post WWII, you could get either indoor or outdoor plywood. I later saw plywood advertised as "indoor with outdoor glue". Apparently the modern idea to just use phenolic resin always was not practiced then.