The next British sniper rifle?

What rifle do members think should be the next UK sniper rifle???. do you think we should build our own or buy one off the shelf? :dunno:

Typed into search field .. next british sniper

Came up with this old thread which might be of interest ..

Essay on British army new sniper rifle ....

Regards,
Doug

Type in Tracking Point rifle scopes on google this takes all the guess work out of it your observer gets an I-pad to see what you see through the scope so far the have gone from 300-1013 yards with 1st round hits every time (so they say) uses the same technology as fighter air craft weapons system takes into account spin drift, air temp, barometric pressures you tag the target pull the trigger and when your blue dot lines up with the red target tag it goes red as well and the rifle automatically fires and takes out the target.
It is a complete package you cannot just buy the scope, price was in the range of I think $27,000.oo/U.S

Go on to utube and watch this burst TrackingPoint 2013 -- Extreme Distance Hunting, Smart Rifle - Tracking Moving Targets and Extreme Accuracy

Remington just came out with a similar system, there was a article in last months Americian Riflemen. Iirc it's about 5k and doesn't do everything the Tracking point system does but still neat. I had the chance to see and hold the Tracking point at the last fun show. IMHO it's a none starter for military service. For one thing battery life is a joke, it's fragile, and no military is going to take the riflemen out of the equation. It may become another tool in the tool box but no way the primary "target acquisition" platform.

It's a really cool concept but it kinda takes all the fun out of it IMO, and the price has to come way down if it's to be successful in the sporting world.

I have not heard how long the power packs last but as a tool for taking out targets at long range in a sniping guise then it may prove worthy in that respect, if you can get a 1st round hit at 1190 yards then I guess its worth as per review footage.
Our Armies will always need the foot soldier to go in and clean up after the drones and snipers have done their bit, I am not saying the snipers do not go in to protect the forward troops or take out targets of opportunity but the PBI will always get the dirtiest of the jobs.

And like was what was said in an earlier post if your in a tank everyone knows where you are !

From the article,, "The unit runs on two rechargeable, proprietary batteries. It uses one at a time so they can be hot swapped. Expected life is about 1.5 hours for each battery. Of course, that is subject to ambient temperature, Wi-Fi use and other factors."
This is for Remington's 2020 Adopter system not Tracking point. This system is good out to 750, both are limited to only a few very specific loads.

Oh how I wish I was in the Gunsmithing business.
Select the best round for the job, and build a rifle around that regardless of the NATO ammo status. Listen to all concerned who now, after two major campaigns have the "Knowledge" of action using such rifles, and explain any deficiencies their respective weapons had in theatre ie Dust/Debris/Range-Accuracy/Effectiveness.

Most important, to poll all those that would have had been trained and would be using this new weapon, as well as those Technicians who had to support it.
Off my soap box now

The boffins can design things that do stuff well but it is the poor bloke up the front sharp end that finds out the hard way what works and what doesn't, I guess when you look at metal storm placed as a sentry gun that's scary and if say you harnessed NV to tracking point then guess its up to the range of the NV. We in the real world are only seeing an nnnnth of what they have developed so far I mean they have been working on a predator type suit for ages to make the troops invisible to the naked eye.
If I had a weapons system that could out reach the enemies by 500+ yards I would be pretty happy and hit 9-10 times at 1000M then that is a bonus to shoot and scooting.
War fare has changed so much since WWII faster and deadlier I mean you can pilot a drone 1000 of miles away in a nice cosy room and reign nasty stuff on people.....

Alas, the next GSR, the General Staff Requirement has probably already been set down. Indeed, it was being discussed at Infantry level early in 2012. And not even the ammo was finalised. But there was a lot of talk about 7mm or so.

One other thing you ought to consider is that up to what range do you think one man ought to shoot at another? There's a school of thought that 1000 is the absolute max because above that, if you need to take anyone on, then you just call in the mortars. That's what they are there for after all. And 2 mortar rounds are all it takes and cheap too!

We used to hear calls from the armchair press (usually the shooting press too.....) that .50 was the way to this that and the other, for hovering helicopters and gun crews and.......... you know the sort of pure guff they spout. That is, until you ask them where these items feature in the current climate. They don't. That's a job for the mortars (or the SF crews on a good day/night)

The last time we were taking on an enemy at long ranges was in Aden/Radfan and we're learning to do it again. It's no secret that 60's Aden/Radfan era commanders were recently involved in a series of meetings with todays commanders at the Infantry Headquarters to update doctrine to take all this into account. It's also no secret that we are in discussion with ........... anyway...........

New sniper rifle........ Don't hold your breath chaps!

It wont be to long before some one builds a wireless guided bullet that can be guided onto its target by remote, they've done it with artillery, fire it one way and it ends up going the other. Very scary this technology stuff.

With the current .338 LM L115 and maybe a few 7.62 L118 rifles most likely squirreled away somewhere for a rainy day, I'd like to think our cousins in the British Army are pretty well fixed.

The biggest advances in the last 50 years have been in the field of optics. Today's (mil-spec) glassware is infinitely better than the stuff that WW2 snipers squinted through. Compare a Patt. 18 with a Schmidt and Bender. The real challenge is building sufficiently robust / "soldier-proof" / lightweight housings and mechanisms.

The .338 LM is not hugely different, ballistically speaking, than the .338 Win Mag or .340 Weatherby, both from from the early 1960s.

A 7mm? Anyone for a re-run of the .280 Ross! Remember that in WW1, a swag of "big-game" rifles were deployed, mainly by the Brits, for "bashing in" loopholes and other "armoured" features on the opposing trenchlines. The drawback was that every time someone cut loose with one of these canons with its VERY different muzzle blast, it drew a LOT of 7.92mm crabs. Thus, snipers so equipped, were not exactly welcome anywhere near the ordinary foot-slogger.

The basic 7.62 NATO is probably the most "refined" service cartridge on the planet. So what if the bullets go sub-sonic at about 900 yards? If you are harassing vehicles and signals installations, who cares? Being smacked in the chest by a barely subsonic 7.62 bullet WILL ruin your day unless you are wearing decent body armour.

The big "fifties" do all that a lot better and further, BUT, hiding the outrageous muzzle blast is a bit more tricky, especially in dry, open woodlands etc. Not only that, but even if the observer is VERY friendly with the shooter, steady exposure to that muzzle blast will cause health issues; a factor noted in several "official" documents. Silencers for the .50 cal? Yes they exist. Yes they work, but at a cost of a significant increase in bulk and weight: users would need a little trailer to drag the thing, and its ammo, around the place. Whilst re-tasked golf carts are handy on the target range, they would tend to stand out a bit on the two-way version.

Furthermore, ALL "mufflers" require regular cleaning and servicing; not something to be attempted whilst trying to look like the shrubbery or hiding in a muddy spider hole.

Yes, I know there have been some spectacular (and verified) shots in fun places like Afghanistan, and such "scores" represent "value for money".

However a light shower of 81mm mortar bombs does it further and much more thoroughly. For the average "digger", distance is good, more distance is better.

Bushnell have produced outstanding optics in plastic in the past, so I then have to assume that today using such a mouldable fabric as a combination of plastic and whatever they use in their final process could be a lot better in providing a clear and definitive picture!!!
One could make an absolutely unbreakable and totally waterproof scope that way, but thereafter the attaching to a given rifle, whatever the calibre would be the real issue in the selection of an appropriate mount.
If we keep this thread up, someone at MOD might use all our ideas:beerchug:

The steerable round has already been developed for the 50 cal it is a sabot round with micro chip and steering vanes they tag you fire and as long as you stay fairly well in view and tagged your toast 3 years to develop much like the 25mm round which you can program to explode behind a wall to get the hiders.
Think the Arty round was called the "Copper Head" 155mm from memory am I correct there guys.

I hear the 375 Cheytac is still supersonic so they purport at 2500 yds any truth in this guys