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Hi Guys I have a no 1 mark 3 1915 Lithgow not all matching numbers im afraid, but I love it anyway. After a lot of years she was looking a bit sad, so I re-oiled her, blued the trigger guard, and nose cap which came up great. Is the any reason for me to not re blue the bolt, receiver, and mag?
Cheers
If you've already done the other parts, then go ahead. Besides, it's your rifle so...
no reason not to as it stands now
Would I need to pull the bolt apart to blue it, I figured when I rinse it off to just use boiling hot water so I font get any rust inside the bolt then re oil. Would this be ok?
I'd strip it for sure.
Agreed. Otherwise the salts will get into the inside and maybe stay causing bleed after.
Thanks guys, is there somewhere on the forum to show me how to do this? sorry for being a pain. Id rather ask first than stuff it up.
Cheers
Unscrew the bolt head and remove the extractor screw, extractor and spring. Simlicity itself
Remove screw from rear of cocking piece
Make special tool shown in 'home made tooling for your Lee Enfield' thread and unscrew striker. Remove striker and spring
Make sure you note the exact position of the rear of the striker in relation to the rear of the cocking piece so that it goes back in the same relative position.
Easy as that.......
Whitey,
What kind of blueing are you doing ?
The problem with blueing the bolt is that it was never intended to be blued overall.
The top of the "long" RH lug and the very rear end of the bolt, including the bolt handle are all that were blued on the originals.
If you want a fancy "high-gloss" blue, you have to do a lot of polishing before it goes in the tank(s).
Unless you have a bit of experience and the right tools, you may end up with a somewhat "sloppy" bolt, especially if it is already a bit "pre-loved".
Polishing the receiver / body without altering the profile of the edges or "softening" the markings is a bit of an art.
Any blue on the "running" surfaces, (most of the bolt body) will get scruffy in short order.
As for the receiver, if the bolt "raceway" is blued, it is probably less critical: it won't stay "blue" for long.
If you leave the barrel in place during the blueing, you need to be VERY thorough in neutralising the salts that WILL be left behind in the breech thread.
If your rifle is a bit scruffy and has suffered a bit of surface rust here and there, there is an alternative to "conventional" preparation.
Hie thee to a GOOD bead-blasting facility and have them work the pieces over with glass beads at a moderate pressure. Avoid garnet grit at high pressure, unless you want a very matt finish and soft edges everywhere. If your blueing shop has this blasting facility on site, whack it in the tank immediately. If you have to go somewhere else, coat the bare metal with a LIGHT oil to stop corrosion and get it cleaned and blued as soon as possible, preferably the same day.
If you have an exceptionally well-equipped backyard shed, so much the better.
:lol:Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
Attachment 49904
Hi guys this hopefully is a picture of my favourite rifle, this was before I blued any of it. After reading Bruce of Oz post Im now thinking of not doing it and just enjoy it the way it is. It looks much better now than in the photo, ill see if I can take a finished photo. Big Duke im not sure what the bluing stuff is called, I think it might be pitric acid, I think. It come in a bottle, to do your self but im sure it wouldn't be as good as what the professionals use.
Whitey,
A do it yourself blue is normally a wipe/rub on application then clean the area with a wet cloth then repeat until required result etc, the rougher the finish the darker and a more matt finish as Bruce mentions.
Original blueing was produced by controlled rusting then steamed/boiled and then the black oxide formed was removed (carding) there is a bit more to it but it was a basic procedure.
More modern methods, are Hot Bluing, Parkerizing, phosphate and black oxide (cold). Like they say about painting 90% is preparation.
Well... at the risk of causing a bit of irritation to you... I for one would not re-blue any more of the rifle. In fact, I wouldn't have re-blued any of it. From the photo, your rifle had a perfect "100 yr old look" to it in the first place, and personally I would have kept it that way. Whatever my personal view, there is the objective reality that (1) any re-finish will decrease the historical value of your rifle and (2) Rapid bluing solutions from a bottle do not give professional results, and the streaky greyish finish is usually pretty obvious for what it is. Sorry if the above opinion is not what you wanted to hear. It is your rifle, after all.
Kind of too late for that...Quote:
Originally Posted by RobD
Looked rather good before you began, but not to worry. Many people 'restore' to a slightly tidyier version of what they started with. Presonally I always clean a lot of the old dirty linseed oil/gun oil/cosmolene mixture from my gunstocks, which some people regard as 'patina' but I just see as 'accumulated grime'. On the other hand I'd NEVER sand handling marks out of an original stock. Everyone has their own view on this issue. Military finishes were always 'sacrifical' to some extent, and heaven knows the British Army were happy to Suncorite everything in sight when the old finish was worn out.
If I was you, since you have already embarked on the road, why not strip it down and just have it bead blasted and phosphated as per the FTR programme
That's it, Im convinced to leave it alone now. Yes it was just the rub on wash off stuff, I never realized that real blueing was that complicated, and I certainly don't want to ruin it. It shoots really well, but is missing just a couple of bits. A butt swivel, stacking swivel, and a screw that goes under the nose cap, I also really want to pick up a bayonet for her. Just cleaning 100 years of grime has made it look better, no sanding just cleaning and oiling. When the sun comes up a bit more ill take a photo as it is now. I really appreciate all your input.
The bayonet won't be that hard to find.
Thanks Jim I just sent an email to a re-enactment group to see if any of there members wanted to swap any gear. I thought I might pick a bayonet up like that. I offered to them a NCO WW2 samurai sword, a WW1 infantry tunic (repo) and a WW2 1942 Daylight short range signalling light. So ill see what happens. The sword is dear to me but if it get me what I want so be it.
Here is a photo of my rifle as it is now.
Before you send off your Katana, get it checked out by someone who knows them.
Every so often you find a basic "issue" sword that can hide surprises.
Quite a few Japanese troops went to war carrying the "family" sword, with the traditional handle and guard (tsuka and tsuba) left at home for safe storage and replaced by "ordnance-grade" items.
I have even seen a few fitted with what look like oversized, cutlass-style baskets and guards; probably for IJN service.
The ONLY way to tell is to CAREFULLY remove the retaining peg (menuki) and slide off the handle.
A competent expert will be able to interpret the markings hidden there.
Engineering-wise, there is nothing wrong with "government issue" katanas.
Family blades can run to the truly exotic in character and value.
I have heard that there is a roving team of Japanese Katana gurus traveling around, buying up and "returning" (no doubt for a fee), any family blades for which they can find proper owners.
There are several good books in English in the subject, but with really old blades, apparently it helps if you can read "old", pre Kanji script.
Thanks Bruce, I have been collecting samurai swords for about 10 years and am aware what this one is worth, You are exactly right what you say. There must still be some wonderful treasures to be found in some back yard sheds.
You should be able to find a 1907 sword for reasonable money...with a good scabbard we have them around here for $100 more or less...maybe a frog on it too. Lithgow bayonets are easy to find hereabouts...
A handy "starter" book on the subject is:
"The Samurai Sword, A Handbook", by a California native, John M. Yumato, first published in 1958. Last heard of as being available from Tuttle Publishing
After many detailed pages on the technology etc. of the blades, in the back of the book is a table of "relative points values, listed by maker".
Let's see, a nice Yukihira from 1200AD; 190 "points" as opposed to a Yukihira blade from 1688 at 5 points. However, if you have a 1455 vintage Masumune from the wonderfully named "Bingo" province, it only scores 15 points.
Relative and absolute values have probably changed a bit since first publication.
Thanks Jim, the blade I would swap is worth about $350-400 So I would expect a very good condition swap if I do it.
Bruce the books I use are by W.M. Hawley 1966, one book alone has a collection of over 13,500 sword smith signatures used from 700AD to 1900AD plus I have a very good book on WW2 swords which helps me on Showa swords. The "Honjo Masamune", is the sword I would like to stumble onto like everybody else, It is believed to be the finest sword ever made. The Tokugawa family were the last to hold it and handed it over when Japan was occupied at the end of the war. Where it went is a mystery to this day, the sword is priceless and was made a Japanese National treasure in 1939. So it was either destroyed, dumped at sea, in someone's private collection, or someone's backyard shed. I like to think the latter.