What shoots better A No1 Range Rifle, or the same rifle except with woodwork

I really like the earlier rifles, and I was looking at all the options possible back then, with the kind of order you could place at the army and navy stores, or other places. What you like, flexibility, to a degree, and I was wondering what works better.
A properly stocked Range type rifle with target bands/nose cap, with say a 24"-25&1/4" length barrel, or the same rifle, re:- same action and Barrel, but fully stocked like a No1mk ? basically. Even say a regulated No1 mk1*** or mk3. Very interested, if anyone would give me any info, I'd be most grateful. What was the better rifle, then in Australia and N.Z.

Gads what a question that's like two identical MGB's and the drivers doing different things to them and ones tweaking getting the little bit extra ooompf, Percy Pavey & James Sweet used Mk III's but they could have any number of personal tweaks I think there was a Motty barrel floating around somewhere there as well.
A persons mind set, personal training whos feeling better on the day it is as much the shooter as the weapon, but the only leveller was the ammo I think as they had to use Ball ammo correct me if I am incorrect here guys..

Others may want to expand on this question you have posed............:dunno:

Phew.......... Harlon, that's a teachers worst nightmare question!

Heres my answer to both questions, this one was set up as a response to a target rifle shooter who declared the 303 could never compete with the 308 as a range rifle............although this rifle appears almost normal, it has a motty barrel, rubber nose, epoxy bedding, single stage trigger and the addition of a ring foresight.
Until the change of target dimensions in 2010, this rifle was very competitive.
I often toyed with the idea of putting a heavier target grade barrel in, but that's just too much trouble, the heavy motty barrel that's in it holds minute of angle.Attachment 51754 still shoots possiblesAttachment 51755changed a fools ideas on the SMLE's capabilities and gives me a bit of fun every now and then.
Attachment 51757Attachment 51756Attachment 51758

Can you elaborate on the rubber nose?

Rubber nose refers to the enlarging of the barrel nosecap hole to allow the fitting of a rubber bush to the barrel, ensuring the barrel is cushioned and not touching metal, still supported but with minimal upward tension.Attachment 51810Attachment 51811Attachment 51812

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Originally Posted by muffett.2008

Rubber nose refers to the enlarging of the barrel nosecap hole to allow the fitting of a rubber bush to the barrel, ensuring the barrel is cushioned and not touching metal, still supported but with minimal upward tension.Attachment 51810Attachment 51811Attachment 51812

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Some also were packed with grease. A bit messy when the rubber detoriated and failed during a string . Saw that happen to my Father a little hard not to laugh:lol: can now .

Hi All,
Thanks for your replies, very much appreciated. I love the rifle you have muffett. I've seen it before, but never accompanied by comments on the damage it can do.
I'm leaning more and more to just sticking with wood stocked rifles. Trouble is this project did start as an attempt to build myself a 6.5 or 7mm x 303 cartridge, range rifle.
Then the inevitable happened, and various parts purchased along the way, have cast their shadow on the project.
So as I have no experience building or tuning banded rifles, I thought I would ask the experts. I'm leaning more towards just sticking to wood, but it would be nice to hear from some banded rifle fans, before committing.
Thanks to everyone for the input. Think I'll grab a copy of J Sweets book, that should deal with my questions, shouldn't it.

Mr. Sweet has many interesting things to say on the subject.

Once you start hacking away/ deleting/ adding things to the rifle, it gets a bit random.

Not only that, but ALL of the tricks and tweaks were based on the steady use of "best-grade" Mk7 ammo, a commodity in very short supply these days.

If you are running a standard barrel in .303, the entire rifle was built to perform with one load and one load only; Mk 7. All of those inner bands, springs and plungers, extra "window" in the muzzle hole of the nosecap, etc are there for one reason; to make the thing shoot Mk7 ammo properly. If you are fiddling with a REALLY old SMLE Mk1 to Mk111, that was set up for Mk 6 or earlier ammo, the bedding inside it will be different again.

The Oz pattern heavy barrels were used in service rifles, notably the Lithgow snipers. They had "different" bedding. but they did NOT hack out the nosecap hole with a rat-tailed file and bung in a piece of old rubber hose!!

If you are building a "shooter" in other than .303 (Mk7), then you will introduce a mass of new variables; a 6.5, (try 6.5 x 54R Dutch/Romanian - its just a rimmed 6.5 MS, NOT a Wildcat), will have utterly different recoil and vibration patterns from the original. If you make such a barrel with the external profile of a "standard" SMLE barrel, it will be "heavy" due to the smaller hole up the middle. It should certainly be pleasant to shoot.

I run a "sporter" in 25-303. It likes ONE bullet, the now RARE Super 87gn soft-point. I tried six or seven other bullets of similar weight, and sundry variations in powders, but could never match the old "tried and proven" (and pedestrian-looking) Supers.

And then there are the sights...............

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Originally Posted by CINDERS

Gads what a question that's like two identical MGB's and the drivers doing different things to them and ones tweaking getting the little bit extra ooompf, Percy Pavey & James Sweet used Mk III's but they could have any number of personal tweaks I think there was a Motty barrel floating around somewhere there as well.
A persons mind set, personal training whos feeling better on the day it is as much the shooter as the weapon, but the only leveller was the ammo I think as they had to use Ball ammo correct me if I am incorrect here guys..

Others may want to expand on this question you have posed............:dunno:

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Even in the 60s and 70s in NZ std issue ball was used in no4s, not sure if it was compulsory. A good Q, I'll ask some of the target shooting oldies next time I see them, I suspect it was. BTW No1 range rifles are still shot here and win on occasion, I intend to pick one up in the not to distance future, looking for a tidy one.

Just as an aside, the heavy barrels were an initiative of, and made for the Target Rifle fraternity.
These barrels were designed specifically so that Lithgow could drop the manufacture of Long barrels for the early long rifles, which were shortened by Club Armourers as per Mottons and the Taylor Bros. designs.
They proved so successful that the D of D started to fit them to service rifles.
The same rifle with H barrel was banned from early competition at Bisley because it was considered to be an unfair advantage, until the NRA of England started to import these barrels for their own use, Lithgow only to happy to supply them.

The 303 service round was used up until 1970 and was phased out after the change to 7.62mm as a target rifle calibre.
303 Service Rifle shoots are still held in OZ and the calibre can still be used in open competition, but it's just not competitive.

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Originally Posted by muffett.2008

Just as an aside, the heavy barrels were an initiative of, and made for the Target Rifle fraternity.
These barrels were designed specifically so that Lithgow could drop the manufacture of Long barrels for the early long rifles, which were shortened by Club Armourers as per Mottons and the Taylor Bros. designs.
They proved so successful that the D of D started to fit them to service rifles.
The same rifle with H barrel was banned from early competition at Bisley because it was considered to be an unfair advantage, until the NRA of England started to import these barrels for their own use, Lithgow only to happy to supply them.

The 303 service round was used up until 1970 and was phased out after the change to 7.62mm as a target rifle calibre.
303 Service Rifle shoots are still held in OZ and the calibre can still be used in open competition, but it's just not competitive.

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The 303 round is competitive depending on the platform used. I would like a source of Mk7 projectiles before i am forced to make my own.