Drifting front sight M1917

Hey I've been wandering around this forum for a couple of months now and it has helped me alot with my milsurps so thanks for that I couldn't find a thread that answered my question about the 1917 so here goes.

I took my 1917 to the range a couple of days ago and fired off a couple of shots at 100 m but didn't hit the paper, so i moved closer to 50 m to get a better idea of where my shot were landing and found out that they were landing about 15 cm to the right of center so i decided to try and drift the front blade to the right, but when i looked at the front sight I saw that it had been installed with the taller end of the post faceing forward, I got out a punch and a hammer to try to move it a bit but the thing wouldn't budge. I decided not to use brute force to move it as I don't want to damage it, I thought to myself that the groove that is cut in the front sight assembly for the driftable part (sorry can't remember what it is called) might be deeper at the front or back so the sight might be wedged in there because it is on backwards.

So my questions to you guys is has anyone here had a similar problem and come up with a solution to it, and was the front sight install in this way on the 1917 rifle or did someone just screw up?

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Originally Posted by trosturleo

So my questions to you guys is has anyone here had a similar problem and come up with a solution to it, and was the front sight install in this way on the 1917 rifle or did someone just screw up?

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Yes, someone screwed up. But thanks to "Eddy", who posed for the following shots, your problem can be solved!

A foresight block, without blade, looks like this: Note the hole for the fixing pin.

Attachment 52038
A correctly assembled and mounted foresight should look like this, from the side:

Attachment 52039

Note that you can see a sliver of daylight below the dovetail base and the recess in the block. They were made like that so that the blade is located on the top face, and does not bottom in the dovetail slot. And note that the block was pinned in position (more later).

From the front, the sight assembly should look like this:

Attachment 52040

M1917 connoisseurs will observe that the foresight blade was staked. Staking will make it more difficult to move the blade - but not impossible.

You need some carefully applied force - a small C-clamp is good:

Attachment 52036

Which you then apply to the foresight assembly like this:
Attachment 52037

You should be able to push the blade so far to one side (from left to right, looking down on the foresight) that it is nearly falling out of the slot, and can finally be pushed out with a BRASS NOT STEEL drift.

As your blade is the wrong way around, it is possible that it will snag on the ear and cannot be pushed out completely. In this event, you will have to drive out the pin and drift off the foresight block. Something that is not easy to do without marring the finish on the barrel.
I hope that will not not necessary!

if your rifle is that far out, chances are the barrel is out of index..remove the weapon from the stock, look on bottom of the receiver ring, you will see a witness mark, they should be dead on.

I overlooked one small point:
The screw on the C-clamp will mark the dovetail on the blade, and will tend to push the clamp sideways. It is a good idea to insert a sliver of brass between the C-clamp screw and the blade. This will avoid marking the blade AND the C-clamp screw will be easier to turn!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trosturleo

so the sight might be wedged in there because it is on backwards.

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As this photo indicates, that will not be the case:

Attachment 52047
The clearance beneath the dovetail on the blade will not permit such a jam.

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Originally Posted by chuckindenver

you will see a witness mark, they should be dead on.

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I removed the weapon from the stock and had a look at the witness mark they look dead on to my untrained eyes.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo.../2rxwcvp-1.jpg

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trosturleo

I took my 1917 to the range a couple of days ago and fired off a couple of shots at 100 m but didn't hit the paper, so i moved closer to 50 m to get a better idea of where my shot were landing and found out that they were landing about 15 cm to the right of center

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Some elementary points to check:
1) Take a very close look at the muzzle. Preferably with a watchmaker's eyeglass. Are there any signs of damage, nicks in the crown etc? Touching up a crown is a simple 5-minute job for any gunsmith.
2) Are the system screws properly tightened up?
3) Is the barrel binding in the channel at any point?

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Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick

Some elementary points to check:
1) Take a very close look at the muzzle. Preferably with a watchmaker's eyeglass. Are there any signs of damage, nicks in the crown etc? Touching up a crown is a simple 5-minute job for any gunsmith.
2) Are the system screws properly tightened up?
3) Is the barrel binding in the channel at any point?

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I looked at the muzzle when I bought it and didn't see any damage, still had sharp rifling.
I did not check that the screws were properly tightened up but they should be not after I reassembled it. I checked to see if the barrel was binding at some point and might have found the reason why my 1917 was shooting to the right
it looked like the foreend of the stock was putting some sideways pressure on the barrel from the left at the very front of the stock where the metal piece slides over the tip of the stock. I took some very fine sandpaper and took a couple of mm off the inside of the channel where I think the stock was pressing against the barrel. Unfortunately I can't get to the range for at least two weeks so I won't know if my hunch was right.

Would sideways pressure on the barrel cause such a large difference in point of impact at 50m or am I just way off here. I also ordered a c-clamp online so I should be able to move the front sight when I get back home.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trosturleo

I looked at the muzzle when I bought it and didn't see any damage, still had sharp rifling.
I did not check that the screws were properly tightened up but they should be not after I reassembled it. I checked to see if the barrel was binding at some point and might have found the reason why my 1917 was shooting to the right
it looked like the foreend of the stock was putting some sideways pressure on the barrel from the left at the very front of the stock where the metal piece slides over the tip of the stock. I took some very fine sandpaper and took a couple of mm off the inside of the channel where I think the stock was pressing against the barrel. Unfortunately I can't get to the range for at least two weeks so I won't know if my hunch was right.

Would sideways pressure on the barrel cause such a large difference in point of impact at 50m or am I just way off here. I also ordered a c-clamp online so I should be able to move the front sight when I get back home.

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I would say 15 cm is certainly possible with forend pressure. I built a frakenmauser a couple of years ago for hunting with an RC barreled action and a mystery beech stock. I had to fashion a handguard because the stock was 5/8" too short. When I assembled it for testing didn't notice the handguard was touching the barrel on the left causing it to shoot fat right. I drifted the front sight far to the right before I realized the problem.

Good luck

Sounds like the whole front sight assembly was simply installed backwards.

Yeah it is, I had a look at it once I got back home and the whole assembly in on backwards. I,m not sure if I should remove it and put it on again facing the right way, I think it's a bit out of my skill range.

I drifted the sights so my point of impact is pretty close to point of aim at 100m good enough for plinking I'm not sure how much it will effect my point of impact at longer ranges seeing as my sight radius is shorter because of this screw up.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by trosturleo

I'm not sure how much it will effect my point of impact at longer ranges seeing as my sight radius is shorter because of this screw up.

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The difference will be undetectable. And if the blade is back to front, i.e. the higher corner towards the muzzle. then the sight radius is actually a couple of mm longer than if it was the right way around. But if it is indeed like that, your problem will rather be that you are looking up the slope of the top of the blade, reducing the contrast of the blade silhouette, and so the sight picture will not be as sharply defined as it would be with the blade the right way around.

It is therefore highly advisable to get the whole setup corrected. You'll have to do it one day, so why not right away?

Yeah I might as well get it over with, the only thing I'm nervous about is scratching or marring up the finish around the front sight.