Was outside taking care of a few things on the "to-do" list today and .....
The Avro Lancaster flew right over head.
Wish I had my camera ready!
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Was outside taking care of a few things on the "to-do" list today and .....
The Avro Lancaster flew right over head.
Wish I had my camera ready!
That would be from the Rockcliff Air Museum?? In Ottawa?
Hamilton.
http://www.warplane.com
However I am in the Long Branch area, so I figure it was on its way "home" heading across the lake.
Very cool. That happened to me once with a B-17. By the way, that Lanc flies into the museum airfield near me here in Virginia about once a year.
Bob
Beautiful! I've seen it at Willow Run air shows.
At what AGL? Not that it really matters, just wondering ...
20+ years ago I was walking across the long field on the east side of the farm when a new spray plane arrived ... Gypsy Moth Larva in the surrounding forest was the target.
Prior to that I had only seen the little, specialized, broad-wing spray planes used.
I heard a rapidly growing roar, turned toward the sound and, at that moment, over the forest & field came an old DC3 (a.k.a., RD4, C47, Gooneybird) at what appeared to be no more than 100' ... right over my head! WHOA! Impressive. It took a long while for me to get the smile off of my face.
The mere sight of any of the old warbirds has that effect on me, but that close fly-over was especially memorable. :D
I remember as a youngster in my schoolyard at Blytheswood Ontario hearing a loud engine above my head. I looked up to see a Spit Mk9 (I think) doing a barrel roll directly above at maybe 1000ft. Full colors and all...I looked around and realized I had no one I could tell about this experience. They were all just children. The Spit belonged to Don Plumb of Windsor Ontario, 30 miles away and I later saw it when I was 15 and attended an airshow at the Sandwich airfield in Windsor. Lots of other good warbirds there too...F6F, P38, two dozen P51s, same for Harvards...
Niiiiice! I envy you that memory.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bob Womack
Assuming that there would be a number of such warbirds taking off periodically, my mind turns to a picnic blanket, basket with lunch, video cam, binoculars ... and hearing protection. ;)
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One quiet Sunday in Fall'08 I was driving my Dad east on Rt17 towards Fredericksburg, retracing part a 2005 Nightmare Trip (8-Hour-Traffic-Jam).
Straight head in the distance I saw 3 biplanes slowly float into view (y'know how they look like they are going 10mph until you get really close). They were obviously operating out of the little local airport near there.
The delightful "airshow" probably lasted only 5 minutes before we ultimately drove under them, but it seemed like 10 times that to us. We were thoroughly entertained, especially my Dad since he wasn't driving. One of my many good memories with him during his final year with us. :)
I read in my National newspaper that an 'original and unrestored' Mk9 spitfire, last used in 1969 has been found in a barn in Texas. Anyone else read this. It COULD be one of those long lost Spitfires that were lost in Burma! Just joking chaps!
Hey......... (added at 11.23hrs 14/7) Just heard a muffled roar overhead and watched a Catalina flying boat flying in an easterly direction over my house. Probably from the Fairford air show.
Are there many of thjose still operating on the show museum circuits?
We had two sitting at our Nanaimo airport for years as old water bombers. They both disappeared and one re-appeared at Victoria...I didn't see it but I doubt they drove them. Don't know where the other went. It'll probably re-appear at the airshows in original colors.
Hadn't heard about it.
WW2 Spitfire that starred in Battle of Britain film to be sold for £1.5m | Mail Online
Now I just need to win the lottery.
I got to fly as Crew Chief for the CAF R4D for ten years. Most fun I ever had! Several times flying across longer stretches flying to shows they let me fly her. In this photo as crew chief we were flying IFR through clouds and rain - the R4D is the only CAF aircraft certified to fly IFR.
The CAF had a large show every year near near where the present DFW Airport is now located today and I used to watch the bombers combing in on Fridays every year from my back yard when I was a Jr High kid in the seventies. It was SO excited because our home was near where the planes flew their finals. I have seen most all WWII aircraft or flow in them, but I have never seen a 'Lanc' even on the ground. :crying:
There are a few here in the U.S. There is a wonderful flying example of a PBY-5A amphibian quartered about ten miles from my home at a museum. She gets out and about. Interestingly, this particular plane was based here doing submarine patrol duty for a period during WWII.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...21catbob-1.jpg
Bob
I'm all for preserving historical aircraft, and can appreciate when they can be seen in their element of flight. I live in the direct path between the local airport and Santa Catalina Island. There is an airfreight outfit that operates DC-3/C-47s, as I suppose it the most suitable and economical type for that operation, that frequently fly over my house. I always look when I hear the engines which I recognize without looking.
I was walking at the beach enjoying the solitude, when I was startled by loud engine noises directly over head. This was on a day the city here hosts an annual Grand Pre auto race that I hate enough as it is. The B-24, obviously had just overflown the race course, was flown so low that it disturbed my peace was a bit much. When I looked up I could clearly see people looking down from the starboard open waist gun position and I'm sure they were thinking "bet you wish you were here." Well little did they know I would have just as soon shoot those SOBs out of the sky for disturbing me and it's an experience that I don't cherish.
BTW shouldn't that be written "AVRo" rather than "Avro."
Catalinas...... I mentioned a few years ago of an underwater graveyard for them in Loch Earne in N Ireland. Punctured and allowed to sink as former lend lease stuff.
I would offer that more likely their thoughts were of grandfathers, great-uncles, even distant relatives., many long dead, who - young men, many still in their teens, in the 1940s stood at the waist gunner positions of countless bombers lumbered low over Britain taking off to face death at high altitude or returning worn, weary and scarred.
---------- Post added at 11:32 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:28 AM ----------
Peter, many decades ago I worked with a bloke who had been a "Bootneck" in one of H.M.'s aircraft carriers in the Pacific Campaign at the end of WWII. One of his memories was pushing the ship's complement of Lend Lease Grumman fighters off the deck and into the Tasman on their return to Sydney when the war ended.
I seem to recxall that recently or so the Aust/State Government set about destroying or levelling those wrecks as they were destroying the fishermens nets and harming the local economy
Far be it for me to encourage tourism in the Southwest, but if anyone is traveling in Arizona or So. California, there are some interesting aviation places visit. This area was desirable to the aviation industry because of weather for both building and flying, and military aviation from early on. Curtis, Ryan, Douglas, Grumann, North American, Consolidated, Northrup, Hughes, and others had workshops or factories in the area. Many of the WWII aircraft thought of so nostalgically now were designed and built here. North Island Navel Air Station has a history of navel aviation that goes back to 1911, when it was used by both the Army (Rockwell Field) and Navy. March ARB was March Field during WWII.
For locations to visit collections of aircraft: Pima Air Museum (east of Tucson, Az.), March ARB, John Wayne Airport, Chino Airport, San Diego Aviation Museum. Of these mentioned the Pima and Chino locations were selected to receive aircraft for storage and salvage at the end of WWII. Pima became a museum site by simply dragging aircraft from the nearby storage facility. Chino became a restoration facility, and has an annual airshow of military aircraft.
I have to say that I have not visited any of these locations except the Pima air museum years ago,which I understand has developed into a great place to see some unusual aircraft, and I went to the Chino airshow once many years ago. As to the airfreight business that operates DC3s out of Long Beach airport they only have 2 or 3 of them and they are painted mostly white, with little decoration, and certainly nothing that hints they were ever military. When Douglas was building C-17s here we used to see them towed across the street to Long Beach airport, but that's all gone now.
If I ever see that B-24 again operating so low I'll complain to the FAA, although what I really would like to do is shoot the SOB nostalgia riders down.
I have not heard much more on the crated & buried Spitfires in Burma, I hope it is not bullyang and they exist but in what state I gather is the millions of $ question knowing how they store things the metal should be good but the crates made of wood buried in what could now perhaps be a swamp they may be beyond anything............
Cinders, you won't here about them, Peter L bought them off so he wouldn't lose his bet:rofl::lol::rofl:
Crikey! and I had a tenner that Paul Ghetty would buy them first. Gadzooks Batman foiled again........:madsmile::rofl::rofl::madsmile:
There's a group in Kansas that is hoping to get the second flyable B-29 into the air this fall. B-29 'Doc."
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...Ma80jpeg-1.jpg
Bob
I went for a ride out of Owen Field at Columbia, SC in the Collings Foundation B-17 several years ago. It was a fantastic cool, clear and crisp morning. It was a 45 minute flight out to Bomb Island in Lake Murray and back where the Doolittle Raidlers trained for a short time before moving to Eglin Field in Florida. Worth every penny!!
My bucket list contains a flight in a Spitfire in England when we tour there my father(WWII LAC Engine Fitter) always praised the Merlin as a beautiful Aero Engine and the plane it was mounted in and after reading a few books like Geoffrey Quill's along with some others on Caldwell, Bader, Townsend, Hoppy Hopwood (another legless WWII pilot), Finnucane, Johnny Johnson, Roland Tuck, Al'Deere etc I agree.
In fact when Herr Goering asked Adolf Galland what he wanted to defeat the Brittish the famous quote came back "A squadron of Spitfires Herr Reichsmarschall."
The Spitfire held the fort across all of Britains shores in those dark early days along with the Hurri well before the P-51, The Jug and P-38 came along to tip the balance of power in the air.
National Museum of the U.S. Air Force - Virtual Tour
I like the B35 cockpit tour NMUSAF - B-36J Engineer
here's another privately owned one in the UK that will taxi up to take-off speed but (I seem to think....) that for some reason the CAA won't give it a licence to fly. Just think of 3 flying together................
It's the expense that's holding things up, the NDT and parts don't come cheap. I'm only down the road from Just Jane and I've just got a posting back to 41 Sqn at Coningsby, pretty much right next door to BBMF so I hope to see plenty of City of Lincoln and VERA in the next few weeks.
Thanks for that info on the non flying Lancaster chaps but 'tired engines.........' what are these CAA blokes like nowadays.......? My friend Leslie Barham's flying log (he ended the war as a S/Ldr on demob in 1947 and went back into Engineering) shows that his Lancaster returned from Essen/divert Duisberg (? does that mean he was diverted to Duisberg on the trip) on '2 serviceable, 1 out 1 running' engines on 12-13th March 1943. He obviously liked Essen, Duisberg (spelling?) and Berlin as he went there fairly often. Took with him according to the page, TI's, 1x 4000 4 x 500. Would that be spending money perhaps? Probably for a bit of sightseeing and shopping.
I that this piccy was brilliant.
Other words fail me........... MAGNIFICENT!
I understand that both of these are actually post warbuilt aircraft and the non flier is a wartime build. No wonder it's tired. So would you be after a few nights in Berlin!
I have been told that she is to have a total overhaul at Duxford soon, so I can visit the old girl more often. I was on a course with the Mounties Mounted Branch in Toronto a few years back and they took me to the Lanc on the foreshore there on a plynth. Now thats what you call looking after a female beach guard with a view out over the water, well done Canada respect:thup:
Which one is to have a total rebuild Gil? Was the Cdn Lancaster on a plinth the one that's now flying Gil? Or do they have two, a flyer and a non flyer. Do you still have one in NZ you Kiwis? There was an ex French air force one that was flown in from French Indo China to Auckland when I was there in the 60's.
I wonder how many there are still in existance.
I might be wrong (but then that's nothing new) but I seem to remember back in the 70's that a servicable Lancaster was sold to Canada from a private collection in Scotland. The "Strathalen" collection, if thats how its spelt, seems to come to mind...
That is KB796, built in Canada, flown to the UK, war ended and returned to Canada. Bought in 1974 ish by JD Roberts and flown to Scotland (Strathallan collection) in 1975, bought by Charles Smith in 1986? and road moved to BAe Woodford for restoration to airworthiness but unfortunately the roof of the hangar collapsed badly damaging it. Charles Smith died shortly after in a Spitfire crash and so the project stalled and a number of parts of the airframe along with parts from other aircraft ended up with Kermit Weeks in Florida in 2003 and it's sat there awaiting some love ever since.
See the full story here, very sad.
Lancaster KB976 Introduction
---------- Post added at 11:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 AM ----------
The engines run well Peter but as there is no paperwork supporting the history of the engine from a known rebuild, i.e. NDT, Component record cards etc. then they need to have engines with complete records.
17 Airframes remain in existence.
Are they going to be at Goodwood this fall?
What constitutes an airframe? Anything in particular, a big mass of bits or something like the chassis?
Just imagine a 21 y/o in command of a plane with 6 other crew members 0000 's gallons of high octane fuel and at least 6 - 8,000lb bomb load flying at night in a bomber stream, not forgetting flak, engine failures and night fighters at 21 like most I was hell raising on a Z900 and generally running amok I owe so much to all the lads in all 3 services for what I and my family now enjoy.
And there is no sound in the world that is as good or will ever replace a Merlin engine in full song especially eight of them......every now and then I will peruse my fathers Flight Mechanics Fitters books from WWII and look at the drawings and specs of the Merlin Series II Aero Engine
Here you go Peter, there are other 'parts' in existence like cockpit sections etc but these are the most complete.
Lancaster B I W4783 G-George is complete static display in the Australian War Memorial.
Lancaster B X FM213 'Vera' is the airworthy example belonging to the Canadian Warplane Heritage Museum.
Lancaster B X FM159 is in taxiable condition at the Bomber Command Memorial of Canada.
Lancaster Mk 10AR KB839 is complete outside the Greenwood Military Aviation Museum, Canada.
Lancaster Mk 10P KB882, Displayed but almost derelict outside the airport at City of Edmundston, New Brunswick, Canada.
Lancaster B X KB944, Complete at Canada Aviation Museum.
Lancaster B X FM136, Complete at Aerospace Museum of Canada.
Lancaster B X FM104, Under going restoration to Static display standard using remaining parts from FM118 Canadian Air & Space Museum.
Lancaster Mk 10P FM212, Under going restoration to airwothiness, Canadian Historical Aircraft Association.
Lancaster B VII NX664, being restored at La Bourget, France.
Lancaster B III JA914, Wreck recovered and displayed at Deutsche Technikmuseum, Berlin.
Lancaster B VII NX665, preserved at the Museum of Transport and Technology in Auckland, NZ.
Lancaster B I PA474, Airworthy, BBMF, UK
Lancaster B I R5868 S-Sugar, oldest surviving Lancaster, RAF Hendon.
Lancaster B X KB889, Complete, IWM, Duxford.
Lancaster B VII NX611, Under going restoration to airworthiness, Lincolnshire Aviation Heritage Centre, East Kirkby.
Lancaster B X KB976, Composite of parts, in storage at Fantasy of Flight, Florida.
G-George underwent major rebuild(Not refitted) for her new home under construction at the time at the AWM she now resides in all her former glory for the visitors to admire, she will never fly again being to valuable to this nation as a reminder of other Australian Lancaster crews that gave so much for us today......
G for George, back in the day... 044728 | Australian War Memorial
I wish I could see this.........Attachment 55712Attachment 55713
What are the two in the left background? Look like Victor tankers to me
I think they're E-3 AWACS aircraft, Peter.
The Vulcan could it be the one that went to the Falklands as that was a pretty intense mission given the distance flown.
The Falklands Vulcan called Black Buck (?) together with many more Vulcans were scrapped at RAF Abingdon so the local press here reported a couple of years ago. They cut up literally hundreds and hundreds of aircraft here including lines and lines of VC10's. At the Wooton Road junction of Honeybottom lane, the end of one of the runways, old aircraft were piled high virtually up to the day the RAF left here. Most, if not all of the local scrap merchants started their businesses cutting up old aircraft. I remember from the days of the Shackletons and Hastings and Argosy's A lot of the old aeroplanes were used as test beds for the what was called the Battle Damage Repair Flight.
One Shackleton can still be seen in old Nicosia airport, which is now RAF owned and operated. It lies out in the far airfield and is used for firefighting drills. I've been in it...back in 1980. It's still there. Good shape too.
There's still 2 at Paphos.
I just looked at that, didn't know there was an RAF base there. There's two sitting out in the far field with a smaller one, maybe a Blenheim? The one used for firefighting is much smaller. Didn't even know there was an airport over there.
Memories of my early years ...
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0bed72_z-1.jpg
Lancaster B X FM104 was donated to the city of Toronto in 1964 and placed on a pedestal on Lakeshore Drive. After sitting outside for 36 years, the aircraft was removed from the pedestal and placed on loan to the Canadian Air & Space Museum, in Toronto, Ontario, Canada. The aircraft is now under long-term restoration to static display condition. With spare parts from the remainder of FM118, it is planned to be complete as a museum quality piece in 2015.
http://avrolancasterfm104.com/history
Another great project taking place in the Museum workshops by CASM staff and volunteers, is the restoration of the City of Toronto's rare Avro Lancaster Mk. X bomber "FM104", one of 430 built by the 10,000 employees of Victory Aircraft Limited at Malton during the Second World War.
Lancaster FM104 is one of Canada's largest and most complex historic aircraft restoration projects. In 1964, it was dedicated as a Toronto memorial to the 10,000 Canadians who died on wartime RCAF bomber operations. Torontonians will recall it sat atop a pole alongside Lakeshore Blvd, outside of Ontario Place, for many years.
What a shame to see a grand old lady like this outside. It's like seeing a tank outside. They can only deteriorate, slowly but surely that's what happens. Good for those that are restoring it.
I agree with you Peter sad to see when you think of the difference that aircraft made to the allied cause it was a stroke of genius that they re jigged the Manchesters air frame and got rid of the central fin but kept the wingspan to 100' so it could fit in the Hangars whacked 4 Merlins on it with a central spar that left the bomb bay unobstructed and there ya go a Lancaster.
I know there is a lot more to it but basically if you had an engine failure in a Manchester you were going to crash and a Halifax was flat out at 17,000ft though the Hercules engine ones were better, they were called Paddle Steamers by their pilots due to the paddle props they had having air cooled radials made them less prone to losing an engine through flak I.E coolant loss not a factor no radiators.
The Lancaster was the only plane able to carry the 22,000lb Grand Slam the largest non nuclear weapon dropped in WWII
When I was a little boy, lioving at Chiseldon near Swindon in the early 50's (we moved away in 1956), RAF Wroughton was very close by and these old bombers were taken there on low loaders and flown in for scrapping. That's how Coopers the HUGE scrap metal company at Swindon started. We used to ride our bikes along the back fence and see them being chopped up. I swopped a fire escape axe taken from one of them with my friend. It had a rubber covered handle with an axe at one side and a big tapered spike at the other side and A-arrow-M on the steel part.
Coopers of Swindon were the world source of used Merlin engines and used parts from broken engines in the early 70's
One day in the early 50's a low loader ran out of brakes going up hill loaded with a huge bomber fuselage and lost control. It careered down the hill and virtually wrote the village of Wroughton off!
Is the one at Auckland still in good condition. I seem to remember that being flown into Whenuapai (or Wigram?) while I was there.
Lovely old Dakota just flown oner my house, marked in RAF wartime camouflage. Always fancied parachuting from one at 800 ft. but never knew how to go about arranging how to
CodFan, Thats the Lanc I was referring to in Toronto. I was there in 2003 and it had all its perspex in place, that is truly a sad site to see if it has no glass.
It will only be a matter of time before the old girl comes apart and falls off her plynth, and her bomb bay absorbs that tank.
We have a Lanc in an environment that all can enjoy outside our Parachute Regiment and Airborne Forces museum at Duxford..............undercover in the massive Airspace hangar.
Recommended viewing;)
That one at Ontario Place on the lake has been there for many, many years. Is the HMCS Haida still docked there as an attraction? There was another on a pylon in Windsor if memory serves. Not sure if it's still there or not. They built them in Toronto at AVRO. They also ferried them back from England during the war for repairs. We had a family friend, now deceased), who was a proverbial "Rosie the Riveter" except Canadian style! She told stories of the patched up Lancs they rebuilt during the war.
Both the HMCS Haida and FM104 Lanc have new homes ...
Even the old base at CFB Toronto (Downsview) has kicked out the onsite airplane museum. The land is being developed ... but I digress.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...08/rec10-1.jpg
http://avrolancasterfm104.com/
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...dsc_0171-1.jpg
http://www.pc.gc.ca/eng/lhn-nhs/on/haida/index.aspx
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...8/haida2-1.jpg
Thanks for that
Thatnks for that too Codfan. Great story re the preservation of the Lancaster
Since I can't see them in person, here's another phot.
Attachment 55850
I think I was six or so when I first went aboard the HMCS Haida. It certainly helped cultivate my interest in military history. I've always visited these type museums over the years and still can't get enough. Where did they move her? I remember several years ago when there was a bit of a stink because the "powers that be" in Toronto wanted her gone from Ontario place. We can't have those nasty old war memorials you know.
---------- Post added at 12:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:40 PM ----------
Ah, I see it's Hamilton. I'll have to visit again some day.
[Re: Haida] It was a bit of that and the fact she was in rough shape below the water line.
The move and restoration was probably a good thing.
Yup - a short drive away.
Sorry to go way off topic .... but as an FYI Ontario Place is defunct now too.
I haven't been down to the waterfront in Toronto for many years. I probably wouldn't recognize it now.
Here's "just Jane" with all four engines running and taxiing.
Attachment 56008
You (in the UK) are very lucky to get to see three Lancs running, 2 flying at the same time. I think that is on par with seeing 9 B-17s in the air at once, that was impressive! Especially flying overhead with their bomb bay doors open.
Here's another of Just Jane and "VERA"
Attachment 56112
Attachment 56113
Avro Lancaster is in the air headed for the U.K. - Latest Hamilton news - CBC Hamilton
Working on Vera: Engine problems delay Lancaster's UK tour | Skies Magazine - Aviation is our Passion.
The second article has a great quote stating that the WW2 Veterans at the show knew that the white smoke from Vera's engine #4 was a blown supercharger. Probably like riding a bicycle for those guys.
Thanks for that. The 2 Lancs in formation with the fighter escort picture is great especially since it includes the much over-looked Hurricane. The second picture with White Cliffs in the background is a classic and worth blowing up to frame for display.
The husband of my wifes friend who lives here in Abingdon is just about to sell an original Battle of Britain Hurricane that he found in India. It was an ex Indian Air Force and had been used as an engineering aid at a University in Benares. I don't know him or her but I'll ask my wife to make him a decent offer.......... In my dreams!
The Lancaster in NZ is still proudly displayed at Aucklands Museum of Transport and Technonogy. NX665 was built in June 1945 and never saw wartime service. Sold to the French she conducted maritime surveillance in French Indochina until donated to NZ in 1964
Recently repainted to represent 'Captains Fancy' the lucky bomber which survived 100 combat missions with 75 (NZ) Squadron
Not that long ago the Police turned up a MOTAT and asked if the 50 cals. were operable. they were and had to be deactivated.
The little aeroplane hanging above the Lancasters middle turret looks like some of the little planes we had as spotters in Malaya. I think they were called Austers (spelling?). You could occasionally get a ride in one if it was going anywhere for an air test. They set fire to one for a fire drill once ans presumably scrapped the rest once we left. What a waste. They flew some of the single Pioneers home.......... What a xxxxxxg nightmare journey that must have been!
Spot on Peter Auster it is...................Single Pioneers and Twin Pioneers were stationed at RAF Seletar when my Dad was based there, spent most of his career recovering aircrew of crashed Hastings from the Malayan Jungle during the troubles.
Now he was a brave man.
By the end of Operation Firedog in Malaya on 31 July 1960, 656 Squadron's AOP.6 and AOP.9s had carried out 143,000 sorties;)
One of the pom/REME air techs called 'bubbles' Thornton (don't ask.....) learned to fly over there and set about buying one. I don't know how he got on as I'd gone back to Oz by then. I only recognise about 3 planes and that's one of them! Someone joked that they repaired them with old dried out Bedford canvas canopies and glue.
For those unfamiliar with the Auster Air Observation Post (AOP) aircraft series --- Auster AOP - Bing Images
I'd gladly buy one if I ever won the Lotto.
These pictures are ..... Well I am speechless.
The Lancs over Derwent Dam
Attachment 56433
Attachment 56434
Attachment 56435
I missed one.
Attachment 56436