Yeah! my first pattern14!

Not 100% sure how genuine it is as its mostly Winchester but has a few parts marked E (bolt release body and a web ring, so far) but it seems to be in great condition. The barrel has military stamps but I can find no date and most of its blue, the bore looks very good, doesnt quite close on a no go gauge. There is a single shot plate still on the magazine top (stamped "MS"? and marks on the left rear side making me think it was used as a target rifle. The front lobbing sight is complete and in good condition, rear lobbing is missing, I have to replace that The stock lacks the makers stamp so has been re-furbished I assume. Front nose loading is very light, 3lbs say (I have to measure it). The metalwork seems very good, most blue/finish still on it.

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Check the tip of the stock, sometimes it's marked either R, E or W on it.

Very, very nice ssj! I would love a Winchester but have not yet come across one (for sale) in any condition. Let us know how it shoots!

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Originally Posted by Promo

Check the tip of the stock, sometimes it's marked either R, E or W on it.

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I did a quick strip last night but not to basic components. The stock I checked externally and internally, I couldnt see anything but I intend to take it carefully apart this evening hopefully and look closer. From the number btw it looks like its one of the last 1000 made...234505 v 235408? I think, does anyone have better figures?

I assume that makes it a 1917 made gun?

---------- Post added at 07:34 AM ---------- Previous post was at 07:28 AM ----------

A friend has a few and his "tip" is they all shoot about the same, dont worry about the maker look at its condition and the barrel in particular. I bought this due to its great condition, paid x3 the others (then they looked bad). I need to replace a few parts as they are stamped E and get the wee arm that is the lobbing sight at the rear as its missing. Ebay is my (expensive) friend.

It has the single shot plate which Im chuffed about as I target shoot.

The nose load is very light, 1~2lbs I think, so yes I intend to take it out once Ive stripped it and made sure its safe to do so. I shot some blanks ie empty brass and primer and I think the firing pin might be protruding a bit far, need to check that and how to correct it if I need to. I will also shim the nose to see the effect.

How about shot it before you shim the tip? My M17 has the same light pressure and it's not been refurbed. From resent conversations on other threads it appears to be intended. My 2cs

The production date of the P.14 rifles is visible on the barrel below the rear hand guard, just remove it.

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Originally Posted by Promo

The production date of the P.14 rifles is visible on the barrel below the rear hand guard, just remove it.

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In the location that Promo states, it'll either show '16 or '17, but given your high serial number it'll show '17 for sure.

There should be at least some markings on the right side of the ID disk like (Patt 14 IW for example). If they aren't there then it's a bit of an oddity. I have recently acquired about 6 P14 stock sets for future restorations and they all have markings there and even the WRS one's that have had the ID disk plugged up and sanded over (in some cases quite heavily so) still show evidence of the original stamping so I can work out what rifle that they originally belonged to. Given the state of the stock, I would think markings should still be clear. What about Weedon Repair Standard markings on the underside of the stock below trigger guard (It will be a Star and a Letter to denote which factory did the work). It if is there then technically volley sights were removed during WRS.

I purchased a similar ex P14 Winchester target rifle that also had a mis-matched rear sight as they tend to get lost when removed and PH5B sights installed. Mine was stocked in a M17 stock, so swapped it out for a P14 W stock.

PM me if you are after any parts.

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Originally Posted by WarPig1976

How about shot it before you shim the tip? My M17 has the same light pressure and it's not been refurbed. From resent conversations on other threads it appears to be intended. My 2cs

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Yep, Im going to make some shims up (5 and 10thou) and go shoot 5 without, then slip them in and see if the MOA gets better, so 5, 10 and 15thou shimming.

---------- Post added at 03:14 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:12 PM ----------

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Originally Posted by Promo

The production date of the P.14 rifles is visible on the barrel below the rear hand guard, just remove it.

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I did that last night and couldnt see it, I will have a closer look tonight.

Yes I'm scratching my head as well. I very carefully looked over the stock expecting such a mark as the pictures of them look rather deep and can find nothing indicating date or maker, which yes is odd. It cant be a no3 mk2 or a p17 stock as it has a volley sight and the finger grooves are right place and size for a P14. Right now I now assume that sometime in the past the stock has been heavily sanded. Otherwise maybe it has a refurb/un-issued stock, I just dont know. I'll strip it apart and take pictures inside and post, maybe its a home made stock and those will reveal it, which will be a pity.

WRS, well the front lobbing sight is complete, it has no NZ army markings nor other acceptance markings. I've read that some were released after WW1 as surplus?

I will unscrew the brass disk, maybe its on the rear.

Thanks but I have no urgent need of parts and I am still licking my wounds after paying for it, doh. I will gradually look for proper W stamped bits to swap out the E's, as they come up no immediate need. If its a dubious restoration then I'll not worry too much, and use it as a range gun so next month I'll think about a PH5B if that is the case.

I cannot see any marks on the stock at all. The upper front wood is faintly stamped W, the rear a nice large R. The sights are stamped W but are a lower number. Trigger is W, bolt release E.

I cannot find anything on the barrel to indicate age for sure except maybe it has a 7 at one point but what was before it is obscured. It is also not the original barrel I suspect or it has been removed and replaced.

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Originally Posted by ssj

I cannot see any marks on the stock at all.

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Found a stamping on your stock!

I think you'll find '87' stamped on the stock in the linlet where the bolt closes down just forward of the safety. I have the same marking on my a sporterised P14 Winchester rifle I have that still has the front volley sight (winchester marked) attached, so I reckon its a good bet you have a winchester stock. My guess is the exterior of the stock has been sanded and that part was obviously missed due to its recessed location.

Another place to check for production markings is under the buttplate as there would be no need to sand that area.

Yeah the volley sight is W stamped. I will take the butt plate off. If you could check your PM for my Q pls?

thanks

The S on the receiver means it has been sold to public, therefore also probably rebarreled. An original military barrel should still have the rifles serial below the rear handguard, aswell as the manufacturing date.

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Originally Posted by Promo

The S on the receiver means it has been sold to public, therefore also probably rebarreled. An original military barrel should still have the rifles serial below the rear handguard, as well as the manufacturing date.

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Thanks that is what I thought. It has prof marks on the barrel. I suspect it might have been a PHale gun with a ball burnished ex-military barrel, sadly its been so heavily re-crowned we'll never know.

For comparison, attached the pictures of my Parker-Hale Winchester P.14 rifle. As you can see it has the same S marking on the receiver (one of my two P.13 rifles also has that marking).

Ah cool thanks Promo for the great example. I had forgotten my no4s are stamped Parker Hale and AJP respectively , so my P14 is not a Parker Hale gun for sure it would be marked like yours, its a home brew.

I was wondering how to do the sling for target shooting btw, now I see how yours is done I know what to look for, fat chance probably. Looks like the same part as a number4 but with 2 wee hook/clamps, neat idea.

On my gun under the butt plate is a 7 and both the butt plate and oiler hole plate are stamped W. The "87" in the bolt handle well/cutout is a 37 and very clearly marked I dont think its an eight.

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Oh and the mid webbing buckle is stamped MA, OZ SMLE territory I would think.