"W-B" -- A Winchester Stock on an IBM?

I have a 3.8 mil IBM with "W-B" stamped in the sling well and hand guard. I can't find "W-B" stamp mentioned in Ruth, Riesch or Larson and don't yet have a copy of Harrison. The "W-B" stamp is very clear and deep on both the sling well and hand guard and there's no very light L preceding them, as in "LW-B." The stock appears to be a Winchester -- flat fore stock bottom, a Late Winchester Butt Plate and three holes in the stock underneath the plate. The Crossed Cannon cattouche on the RH side of the stock appears to be in the correct position for a 1944 Winchester 2nd Block Low Wood stock as shown in Larson pp. 358 and 363. The pistol grip is unmarked. The M1 Carbine stock marking convention suggests Winchester supplied the stock to IBM for this 3.8 mil IBM. Was this documented anywhere?
Pictures:
Dropbox - photo 1.JPG
Dropbox - photo 3.JPG

Thanks for any help y'all can give.

If Winchester had supplied IBM with stocks, it would have an IBM acceptance cartouche on it. The one shown is definitely not IBM and I have my doubts as whether it's even Winchester to be honest with you. I see some things that bother me, but will let others comment as I'm not sure about them.

F4Rio,

Welcome to the forum.

That is one I hadn't seen before. We have a couple "Stock" guys on here that might be able to help you. Hopefully they will see this thread. I don't see it listed either.

I think I saw a WB on a Garand stock years ago.

Winchester M1 rifle stocks inspected by Col Waldemar Broberg use the W.R.A. over W.B. cartouche, this stamp was used from mid 1941 to mid to late 1942.

Both shotguns and handguns can also be found with this inspectors stamp- but I do not understand why an inspectors initials would be used on the carbine wood in the photosAttachment 54980

LW-B=IBM LW= Lumb Woodworking Co. B=IBM Correct me if I'm wrong. GK

F4Rios'
Stock does show some taper at the leading edge of the slingwell, often seen on many WRA stocks, but not all.
The W concerns me, it's larger and a different style that's found on WRA stocks.
Look closely at the picture of the Hand guard showing the large W-B, it shows that the ( - ) isn't squared off to the B. Almost as if it was added to look like it was part of a W-B stamp. In that same picture the W looks to have a different height, width and clearly different than the W stamped in the slingwell.
Plus the spacing between the letters W-B is different on both the HG and slingwell.

The CC? I'd need to see a few better Macro pictures to compare.
Both the stock and HG have traits we can't see to determine if they were made by WRA.

Pictures of the size and how aggressive the milling is on the inside bottom op slide channel of the stock and cut near the notch of the HG will help, like these:

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC05985-1.jpg


https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC05152-1.jpg

Also look for any numbers/letters stamped inside the trigger housing area of the stock, like this:

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC08224-1.jpg




Pictures needed of the stock would include:
The flat bottom profile.
The milling inside the stocks op slide channel.
Overhead pictures of where the trigger housing sits in also need.
A couple of views of the bottom of the stock at the escutcheon nut area.

Keep in mind that a few makers used the 3 holes under the buttplate.
M-U marked stocks are 3 hole and have a rather large M that could be thought of as a W.
SC-B are 3 hole, plus have a large B.
I don't recall the numbers of holes under the RMC stocks, but do know the RMC made for IBM stocks have a large B, randomly stamped.

More pics needed, hope we can be of more help.

Cheers,
Charlie-Painter777

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...DSC08233-1.jpg

I was hoping Painter would come by. He knows a TON about carbine stocks.

Charlie-Painter777
I'm charging my Sony camera and will take all the shots you requested. The first pictures were from an iPad. My Sony will take better res/macro pix. I'll post the pix tomorrow.
THANKS for the help!
F4Rio

Here are some more pictures of the W-B marked stock. Dropbox - W-B
The sun has been in and out so I had to take them quickly before the overcast/rain begins. Hope these help you evaluate this stock.
I do see W-B marks listed in the various Carbine references; but, they are all for metal parts -- no stocks mentioned.
Thanks,
F4Rio

Okay, very nice pictures BTW. I feel better about it being a Winchester stock most likely now. I see where that stock has had either a type II or III barrel band on it at some point. That alone would ruin it as being original to your IBM considering it has a type one barrel band on it. Another thing to consider is how long is the barrel channel on that stock? If it's the longer 4 plus inch one like it appears to be, that would be another strike against this being the original stock on your carbine. Winchester went to the loner channel stock after IBM had ceased production if I remember right. I am pretty sure the "B" has been added later to your stock. If it is a long channel Winchester stock, it's pretty rare, but ruined by someone most likely tinkering with it.

F4Rio,
1st thing: The Hand guard wasn't made by WRA. But it is a nice match to your stock.

Your stock is a WRA Type III, a very nice one at that. Your picture #12 shows the position of the barrel band spring. This L shaped spring, where it goes in to the rear of the front barrel channel shows us it's a short channel.
A long channel would have more wood channel to the rear of where the spring enters the stock.
The CC stamp looks legit to me.
The stock nose shows use of a early Type I/A barrel band, more than likely the indentations forward of this area are from the band resting while apart. Though still a slight chance it may have had light use of a wider Type II or III band.

As already stated if this stock/assembly was accepted by IBM it would have the smaller IBM sized CC on it.
IMHO: Someone has added The W-B. Many of these original WRA stocks didn't have a small W stamped in the sling well. Many were stamped so light you'd barely find them. Put years of wood swelling and drying and it makes it easy for that tiny w to go bye bye.
Just the sliding back and forth of a sling over years of use would wear the area down.

If it were mine??
I'd try a bunch of tiny pin pricks in to the letters W-B and try steaming them up , maybe trying the tip of a solder iron or one of the fancy new household steam cleaners that you can direct the steam at.
Nothing to lose..... but 'Bubba' added letters.
It is a valuable stock.

HTH,
Charlie-Painter777

P.S. Here's a link to tips on WRA stocks, you can see/feel for comparison:
WRA Carbine Stock Traits

Thank you Charlie-Painter777, deldriver, and all the others -- you gave me very helpful info as well as a much appreciated welcome to a 1st time poster.
Semper fi,
F4Rio