My Great Big MkII** Ross Rifle Project.

Hi Everyone
Recently picked up a MkII** (assuming it to be a commercial) .303 that has at some time in its past been seriously "got at", and as a result there's an amount of work and (unobtainable) componentry required to get it back to something nearing its original (glorious) condition.


What I intend this thread to be is a place to chart the progress I'm making towards the restoration, but also somewhere I can ask a few of the questions I'm bound to encounter along the way.

Among the unobtainable trinkets that my rifle is currently missing, :

#MkII** Nose Cap (to suit the heavier profile barrel)

#Rear sling swivel

#Bolt that retains the middle barrel band

#MkII front sight assembly--------------(FOUND)

#Now just need the sight hood

#"Keeper Ferrule"-------------(DONE)


Now given there's not been a ross made in close to 100 years, and that these same items are the ones everyone seems to be looking for: I'm very realistic about the prospects of tracking some of these parts down - so I'll be looking to machine/fabricate any of those which I can't source in the meantime.

The first of those parts I've resorted to making is the serrated "keeper Ferrule" (not sure of the official Ross Nomenclature) that engages the twin front action screws of the MkII ross (assumedly to prevent the screws loosening under recoil) . Had been told these tiny little pieces are virtually unobtainium, and can certainly imagine these'd be the first item lost once a rifle's been disassembled a number of times and in reality its probably of questionable necessity to the rifles machinations anyway.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/jTwXpZ-1.jpg
Mill set up in horizontal guise with the dividing head

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/xdEEGk-1.jpg
Close up of the machining details

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/5HbXfs-1.jpg
Note: The split magazine box and twin front action screws (and serrated keeper) necessitated by the arm of the "Harris" follower being on the centre line of the action.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/Lh3OMj-1.jpg
The "Keeper" installed in its pocket, engaging the other screw heads.
The heads of these action screws are visibly mangled so if these can't be tidied up a bit, I may resort machining some replacements of these too. ("slippery slope"... I Know)
Does anyone know the dimensions of the little bolt that holds the "keeper"?


Also wondering if anyone's got drawings or dimensions for a II** (heavy) barrel? If not can anyone can comment on how close the barrel profile might be, to those used on the later MkIII's? The situation is the barrel on mine has been shortened from its original 30 1/2" length, and I'm thinking its a "ring-in" that's been fitted at a much later date (so can't really base my profile measurements off this, to order the new barrel).

"TSE" a local Australian barrel maker has a profile on record for a "Ross Rifle" (generic) from diameter measurements he has lifted off a MkIII DP rifle and I need to determine how close this would be to what II** is meant to have?

Any info would be really appreciated
Thanks

Whilst unable to contribute to your project in any way, nevertheless I look forward to reading about your progress.

Thanks Mate, heres the next instalment:

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...UNTyrpng-1.jpg
Excerpt from the ross rifle book showing the evolution of the various fittings; those in the centre column are of the correct era for my MKII**

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/f38Zup-1.jpg
Roughing out the profile & then parting

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/uSPUwE-1.jpg
Undercutting the lug

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/AcSggz-1.jpg
Parting off with a slitting wheel

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/z6eucT-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/Jw9Rjm-1.jpg
The completed lug, now to work out just how i'll go about the forming & fabrication of the nosecap.

Among the bits my rifle is missing is the rear sling swivel, so here's me working to rectify this:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/KduqRm-1.jpg
Using the dividing head to machine the wave shape on the rear sling swivel head. I used the existing target swivel attached floor plate as reference for the dimensions & styling etc
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0/lTCwPc-1.jpg

Nice work!!

I'd be up for a couple of the little keeper bushings and 3 MkII** nose caps....

Awesome work by the way...

Great to see the old engineering / Tool making skills still in use

Pretty tidy work all round not to much swarf or chips great to see as to watch a CNC or an automated lathe at work is like watching bats in a dark cave if you get my drift...................

Hi all, would like to thank everyone for their comments - just a quick update concerning my ross rifle project: Win88 (from the ShootingAustralia.net forums) magnificently offered to lend some of the missing componentry to me, for measurement/duplication purposes - so a massive thankyou goes out to him for his generosity and his patience whilst the reverse engineering/nutting out process crawls along.

The protective hood for the front sight was discarded from my rifle long ago and after some research it turns out they are right up there (along with MkII nosecaps) on the list of most requested ross rifle trinkets in the various milsurp classifieds. Those that have them aren't selling and Ross Rifle Co certainly isn't making any more so figured I could do something about it and help others out too.

These are the jigs, I came up with to assist in the making of Ross sight hoods. Fortunately the hoods used on the MkII's & MkIII's are dimensionally the same, so the one set of tooling caters for both models.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/CoCS4M-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/kXYJaC-1.jpg
The number drills will be replaced with tool steel of the appropriate gauge, initially was just keen to see if the concept would even work.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/WMFxoy-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/zkn7us-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/tMWC01-1.jpg
Have had to skim some material down to match the thickness of that originally used, otherwise the mean diameter would be wrong for the developed shape/layout.
So long term will need to chase around and see what can be sourced - am hoping .0525" is a common gauge in some of the imperial speaking country's.


https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/Z5wlWj-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...2/DgBMPv-1.jpg
Still need to de-burr a little and investigate blueing etc but think the result looks promising at this point.

Btw am still desperately seeking profile dimensions of the MkII** heavy barrel if anyone can assist.

So, I thought I was doing well making my own wrenches for an M1 rifle receiver and barrel. I daily converse with men that make their own forming and machining jigs...at least it leaves me in good company...nice work on the scarce and unobtainium parts.

Very nice machine work. We appreciate the photography and updates. Salt Flat

That is flawless work. I am definitely in the market for a bunch of these!

Will you be making nose caps as well? Both MkII military and target caps and MkIII military caps are needed badly. I would likely take several of each and probably a half dozen or so hoods at least.

As for bluing, radocy rust blue is nearly a perfect match for factory bluing. I can send pics if you'd like.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by flying pig

That is flawless work. I am definitely in the market for a bunch of these!

Will you be making nose caps as well? Both MkII military and target caps and MkIII military caps are needed badly. I would likely take several of each and probably a half dozen or so hoods at least.

As for bluing, radocy rust blue is nearly a perfect match for factory bluing. I can send pics if you'd like.

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Hi Flying Pig, am quite a fan of your work with Ross's also ;)
Would definitely be interested to hear more about the radocy blueing, and if you've got pics that'd be a real bonus.

Am currently working away at the fabrication of a MkII nosecap and my experiences here will ultimately determine weather or not they can be feasibly made in any great quantity on the available machinery. I believe the main stumbling block will be my ability to machine the bayonet lug/piling hook component in a cost effective manner on manual machinery. There's multiple setups involved and as a dividing head is used to shape the radii it means each lug needs to be made singularly. I'd likely have to outsource that job to someone with a little 4-axis CNC mill. Things could get $$$, very quickly.

Anyway as per post #2 I've already machined the lug required for this 1x prototype nose cap, so will press ahead to complete it's fabrication then down the track when I'm at the stage of weighing up feasibility etc will get some quotes on CNC machining.
All currently hypothetical but if any @ all are eventually made for sale, they'd be based around sheet metal construction (i.e. MkII style) as this is where my comfort zone is - the single piece forged MkIII type would be too involved. This would cater for the any of the military MkII's, the MkII** (Heavy Barrel version), and the very early MkIII's (that used left over MkII caps).
Am finding quite a wide variance in internal dimensions of the different types of MkII nosecaps, which will make the design of forming tooling bit of a challenge.

As for the sight hoods I imagine most will want them supplied in a blued finish and with the appropriate screws, so my intention had been to offer them in kit form.
To date the lions share of the work has been directed toward nutting out the hoods manufacture, will now need to turn my attention to sourcing (and likely modifying) the little bolts and researching the blueing etc.
Am reluctant to put a time frame on how long this will likely take, but in the mean time will certainly keep you all updated & informed of progress via the forums.



Also a massive thanks goes out a few members on the rossrifle.com forums.
They were able to measure the contours of the heavy barrels on their MkII**'s for me, and here's the resulting drawing.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...L5Hsppng-1.jpg
(I did add a little to the tennon length to match the other ross barrel drawings I've seen - far easier to remove material, than add it back on ;)
(disclaimer the PDF formatting of my CAD program, is playing up quite a bit and leaving bits out?)