Did the goverment make unmarked leather slings for use on the Garand and 03?
Or were they all marked?
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Did the goverment make unmarked leather slings for use on the Garand and 03?
Or were they all marked?
There are unmarked leather 1907 slings around. The government didn't make any of them, private contractors supplied them to contract.
I have to wonder how many were lightly or slightly stamped and over the years of cleaning, oiling and such that marking just vanished.
A small correction - Rock Island Arsenal manufactured the gunsling (official nomenclature) M1907 and marked them with the arsenal identification and year of manufacture. During the Great War and subsequently the gunsling was manufactured by contractors that were required to mark their production with company identification and year of manufacture. There are slings that were manufactured post WWII on government contracts that were not marked as to the manufacturer, but usually printed with "MRT" (mildew resistant treatment) and sometimes a year.
There have been quite a few manufacturers that have manufactured the gunsling. Some were manufactured to fit one inch sling swivels, but most are made in 1 1/4 inch width. The quality of the materials, and construction and varies greatly. A few of the commercial made copies have the manufacturer's identification marked on them, but most are unmarked. As with many products it is likely that government contractors continued to manufacture products, that may have met specifications, after the contract(s) ran out. These companies often had components that remained after the contract quantity was delivered. I have in contract records where the contracting agency acquired by purchase order additional items manufactured. However it is clear that some companies had components on hand that they finished into complete products and sold commercially.
You should be aware that most items contracted by the government were made to a specification. The component parts were usually separately contracted and then provided to the final assembly contractor. The point being that the products manufactured by the contractors was usually in compliance with the specification. So a gunsling M1907 that was assembled with non-standard components was likely not made on a contract, and probably made for commercial sales. one of the components that is often incorrect in the commercial slings is the rivets used to assemble the double hooks. The specification was for brass rivets, which is what is usually found on marked slings. The commercial slings were often assembled with copper rivets, or anything that was available. The slings provided to the movie studios can usually be identified as replicas by the obvious non-standard rivets. The slings used in the production of Saving Private Ryan a case in point. The nickel plated rivets stand out to the educated observer.
If you have a gunsling M1907 that you are unsure about a few focused images would be helpful to identification.
There are tons of repros out there these days, be careful.
BTW, there is some confusion about MRT... some say the R was originally "Retardant"
FYI- There are some genuine WWII leather slings out there that were made by "Hickok" and are stamped on the back side (the rough side) of the leather in a real small font, like 1/8" or so. The stamp is right under the hook, and there is NO date stamp. If you find what looks like a nice, vintage, unmarked WWII sling, be sure to look on the back side for the Hickok stamp. They're out there. I found several.
Rick, can you post some photos of them. It would be a great tutorial for us that have not seen them. TIA
I invite your attention to the website link which may be useful to this discussion.
Rifle Sling Home Page
A number of sample markings are illustrated, however few of the manufacturers are identified. I tried to provide identification of the manufacturers however the web site is closed to contributions or inquiry.
For examples of "MRT" marked slings click on "M1C Sling" and "M14 Sling"
Example gunsling M1907 manufactured by F. M. Hoyt Shoe Co., Manchester, NH. Both the short and long straps marked on finished side of the leather, below the double hook, dated 1918, and inspected by "J.J.M."
Attachment 57414
Example of "MRT" printed sling, otherwise unmarked. Image illustrates rather crude sewing, and use of copper rivets in assembly of the double hook.
Attachment 57415
Link I provided to the website was lost during edits...
Rifle Sling Home Page
All my Hickok made M1907 and M1907 modified slings are dated 1943.
I would if I still had them. They "left the building" years ago. Plus, my memory could be failing me re: Hickok slings being dated or not.Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill Hollinger
I'm in the process of negotiating a deal on a garand and I didn't notice a manufacture on the leather sling. If the deal goes through, I'll post pictures of the sling to help with the ID.
Thanks for all the info so far.
We'll need a complete expose on the gun too...of course...
[ATTACH]Attachment 57809[/ATTACH]Attachment 57807
Here some pictures of the sling.
I can not find any markings on it. It's very worn with a lot of cracking.
Well, seems a couple of your pics didn't get attached. If the sling was dressed, you still might be able to make out some markings.
Hope these go through.
So would this sling be WW2 vintage?
Those are the ones that went through the last time. Yes, steel frogs should be a WW2 sling.
Here are few quick pictures of my latest purchase.
Seems to be a correct May of 1944. Tear down shows all items to be correct for the time frame
All items in the pictures came with.
Ammo can and En-blocs are WW2 along with the 1943 Ammo.