Information About an I.B.M. M1 Carbine

Hello to all!~ I just purchased an IBM M1 Carbine from gunbroker.com I got a great deal on it and it is going to DEFINITELY be a keeper. It came with a whole bunch of extra 15 and 30 round mags (that I have sold) to make the effective price of the M1 $335. Good price :) I wanted an M1 that wouldn't just hang on a wall, but would be used from time to time. THIS IS IT!

Here is the question...I know that everyone here knows SOOO much more about M1 Carbines than I do and I would love to know about my new baby. I disassembled most of it and took a ton of pictures of the internal parts (I left it disassembled so that if there were any parts that you needed clarifications of I could provide them :). What would you be able to tell me about my M1. I assume that it is a parts queen (and for $335 I can't argue). Are there any parts that are exceptionally good or are there any parts that are not USGI WWII??

And here is the auction that I won:

US CARBINE 30 CAL. M1, 1943 IBM mfg : WW1 & WW2 Collectibles at GunBroker.com


I am going to attempt to post pictures of the carbine right now. What information might you be able to tell me about it. Anything interesting?? I couldn't find any markings on the trigger group...any idea if it still is WWII era or is it after that?? Push button safety with an arsenal-refinished carbine?!? Hmmmm... The sling...marked MRT 9-62. From what I understand...it means Mildew Resistance Treatment and 9-62 is the date when it was treated. Any ideas on how old it is by looks?? WWII era treated in '62?? Ideas??

Thank you SO much for your time and have a great day!~

Jeff Jones

congrats on your purchase, even for an import it is a good buy. Which import mark is on the barrel, Blue Sky? or other?

Thanks for the reply! It is Blue Sky Arlington, VA. The import mark is not deep at all...I had heard that some of the import marks were deep enough to cause problems with the barrel.

laptopps,
welcome to the addiction known as "Carbine-itus”. These guns are like "Lays potato chips” you can’t only have one! As a first specimen you have done VERY WELL, and at an OUTSTANDING price. I have 2 I.B.M. carbines and have had 3 other "Post War commercial” versions. I am NOT an expert but will share some of the information I have gathered if you are interested.


U.S. CARBINE CAL.30M1 – approximately 6.5 million manufactured from 1942 to 1945, by 11 different manufactures. All parts from all manufactures were made within specifications to allow interchangeability between guns. The guns receiver (main part of gun that the barrel & other parts attach to) was stamped "U.S. CARBINE / CAL.30 M1” at the front and the manufactures name (usually under the rear sight) & serial number at the rear. Many modifications were implemented during production to improve the weapon. As your gun has the original design was for a push button safety, which was changed to a rotating type because solders were pushing the magazine release instead of the safety. Toward the end of production the adjustable rear sight was introduced. When weapons were turned in for repairs, the most up to date modifications were usually installed. These guns saw service from WWII, Korea, Viet Nam, and many foreign nations’ forces. VERY FEW existing carbines today are in ORIGINAL condition, but EVERY ONE has some kind of story to tell!


What I can tell you from your pictures, you should be proud of your acquisition. I.B.M. manufactured carbines in 1943 & 1944. Your S/N 3878825 puts its manufacture date roughly April 1944 (I.B.M. S/N production 3838000 – 3998000 . . . 1944). Your stock magazine pouch appears to be original and was made in 1943. It was NOT however made to be put on carbine stock. It is made to hold extra carbine magazines, and to be buttoned to the web pistol belt. Sometime early in the war GIs found this an easy way of having extra magazines at the ready. Your trigger housing is NOT an I.B.M. trigger housing, in fact it looks like it is NOT EVEN a M1 trigger housing. I believe you have a M2 trigger housing! What’s the difference? The M2 is a select fire (machine gun) version of the M1 carbine. This does NOT make your gun a machine gun or illegal, but is a very interesting addition.


I have rambled along enough. If I can be of further assistance let me know and I will try to help out. ENJOY your new addition and search for as much knowledge as you can!


Fred

Welcome to the carbine forum. Someone is always willing to speak out to help answer question.

Nice purchase and a fair price for what you received. Blue Sky marked carbines are form the late 1980's. I remember them being $99 to $109. Refinished, mixed parts, some in better condition then other. Many guys don't like the heavy Blue Sky stamp on the side of the barrel. In fact sometimes you can see the impression starting to show on the inside.

"EW" Winchester safety
AU Underwood mag catch

Look on the mag well flat to see if it has any marking. Look in the well of the slide. Just too hard to see some of the parts.

Don't know why someone screwed a snap on the stock. I guess they didn't know how to feed the sling around the oiler.

What are the markings on the 15 round mags? The aftermarket 30's I'd try to sell.

I'm guessing the snap on the stock fits the one on the mag pouch and keeps it in place.

That shouldn't be needed. The type 1 pouch fits very snug over the stock. But I have seen crazier things.

Did you sell the aftermarket 30's on eBay? Saw some sell there not too long ago for over $80 each - WoW! Nice carbine. If it still has the IBM barrel and not worn too bad, it could shoot pretty darn good. A lot of the IBM barrels weren't stamped with a date. - Bob

Well it was just a guess. Couldn't come up with a more logical reason for the snap being where it is. Personally I never did care for the stock pouches none. The cons out weigh the pros, IMO.

@fn111557 I fully understand what you're talking about when you say carbine-itis. I haven't went out to shoot this rifle and I still love it so much! I didn't realize that the magazine pouch was not meant to be on the stock. The button on the stock looked new but I thought that's were supposed to be...How I was wrong! There's part of me that would love a 100% USGI M1 carbine. They don't have to be all original parts, but I would love the trigger housing to be an M1 carbine and a World War II era housing. I'm wondering whether not I should just sell the trigger housing to purchase a original World War II M1 trigger housing. Just thoughts. What are your thoughts?

---------- Post added at 09:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:48 PM ----------

@JimF4M1s Thanks for the welcome to the forum! The blue sky stamp is totally fine and does not hinder the barrel whatsoever. Thank you for the heads up on the safety and the magazine catch. In terms of the 15 round magazines that I sold, they were all Inland marked and I sold five of the eight magazines to someone for $100 plus shipping. I have one marked IS which I don't know what that is. I have one more Inland (IA)and then one (U)nderwood. The aftermarket 30 round magazines I did sell. They were all marked "Made in the USA" and I sold those for about $30 each. They sat on eBay for almost a week before I brought the price down to $30 each. Once one person bought one they all sold very quickly.

---------- Post added at 09:57 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:55 PM ----------

In terms of the pouch on the stock. Should I just go in and remove the snap fitting that is embedded in the stock? I think I can get it out and only leave a small little hole.

---------- Post added at 09:59 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:57 PM ----------

@USGI Bob Thanks for the compliment on the carbine and the IBM barrel did not have a date. Some of the aftermarket 30 round magazines did sell for higher price, but no one would bite on mine until I lowered the price. I've actually been on eBay for over 17 years, I have great feedback and they should've sold pretty easily. But they didn't. Oh well! At least I got the effective price of this carbine down to a little over $300.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laptopps

Should I just go in and remove the snap fitting that is embedded in the stock?

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Yes, for heaven's sake! Make it gone.

Hey, sounds good! On the trigger housing, I wouldn't worry about it. I believe it's an original WWII era M1 housing that has been through a "refurbish" where it received M2 modifications. I have one kind of like it that was done on a Type 2 Inland trigger housing. You still might be able to find a mark on it somewhere - it could even be a Winchester. ;) - Bob

@browningautorifle I have one word for you...........gone!

@USGI Bob...I have looked SO hard for a stamp but couldn't find one. There are several places with a bit of small scratch marks on the housing and one could think that a mark could actually be the stamp. Where would be the most common places for a stamp on the housing?? Thanks, again, for your replies!

Jeff,
Here are a couple good links to help out with your marking identification.


(m1family.com) listing of parts, manufactures, and markings;

Part markings. (check here first) : Parts Markings / Stocks

(instructables.com) instructions and pictures for filling out “carbine club data sheet”;
[P.S. if you are going to take apart the bolt for complete parts identification USE THE BOLT DISASSEMBLY TOOL!]

HOW TO FILL OUT A CARBINE CLUB DATA SHEET FOR AN M1 CARBINE

WOW Fred! There is SO much information there...Thanks for sending that! I just spent the last hour reading all the info there. Didn't realize how MUCH there was to know!

If you don't already have it, pick up a copy of "US M1 Carbines: Wartime Production" by Craig Riesch. It's a handy book to have around - 6th or 7th edition is about $20 online. Many trigger housings are marked on the RH side near the back, but not all. - Bob

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Originally Posted by vintage hunter

I'm guessing the snap on the stock fits the one on the mag pouch and keeps it in place.

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No, the snap on the pouch is behind the magazine compartments and the corresponding snap on the pistol belt is on the outside of the belt. The snap on the carbine is on the wrong side for the mag pouch unless it was for a left-handed shooter. But it shouldn't be there at all. Definitely take it out.

@INLAND44 I'm glad that you guys told me to get rid of it. I really didn't like it anyway and it is now gone. All that's left is just a small little hole in the stock and I can completely live with that especially because it is covered up by the magazine pouch. Ha!

Is there anything else that you guys would do, change or otherwise modify on this rifle. Are there any parts that I can switch out where the selling of one part would pay for a more correct part for my rifle.

Thanks again for thanks again for your help!

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laptopps

Is there anything else that you guys would do,

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I would change the barrel band. Yours is defective, the spot welds have failed. The band and bayonet lug should be unitized.

@vintage hunter Sounds good...does the barrel need to be removed from the receiver to get the old one off and the new one on??

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laptopps

does the barrel need to be removed from the receiver to get the old one off and the new one on??

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No, it goes on from the muzzle end. You have to remove the front sight to get it off and on.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by laptopps

does the barrel need to be removed from the receiver to get the old one off

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No, the front sight comes off for that. By the way, the trigger pin isn't seated all the way through. Is it correct? It doesn't look to have bags of extra on the other side...but it seems to have slipped to the inside.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by INLAND44

No, the snap on the pouch is behind the magazine compartments and the corresponding snap on the pistol belt is on the outside of the belt. The snap on the carbine is on the wrong side for the mag pouch unless it was for a left-handed shooter. But it shouldn't be there at all. Definitely take it out.

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You might want to look at a type 1 magazine pouch and cartridge belt again. The snap on the stock is in the correct position for the stud on the magazine pouch for a right handed shooter.

The snap on a pouch is on the inside of the back. Snapping onto the stock the way it was before you removed it would have left the mags and opening flap on the right side of the stock. For a right handed person. Gone it's good.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

No, the front sight comes off for that. By the way, the trigger pin isn't seated all the way through. Is it correct? It doesn't look to have bags of extra on the other side...but it seems to have slipped to the inside.

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@browningautorifle JIM, you were exactly right about the trigger pin. I just tore it down and reseated the pin. YOU GUYS ARE GREAT!~ I put two more photos down below (one of the trigger pin and one of the pouch in what I think is correct).

Trigger pin FIXED...Thanks Jim! And so with the (lame) snap on the stock now gone, this would be the correct position for the magazine pouch for a right handed shooter, right??

If you need a stock pouch, that would be about right. That's where it fits I guess. The benefit is having three mags with the gun in case of a quick grab...home defense perhaps...

Believe it or not, I actually have a loaded magazine in the pouch and have thought about that if someone was inside the house, I would have the ability to have an easy reach home defense weapon. That would be crazy!~

Or...did you mean handy?

EXACTLY! Easy to reach and handy home defense weapon!

Another member here has one for that very thing, and yet another used one for his LEO patrol backup in his trunk.