I was curious if any one has seen a DLO Manufacturing (Douglas Lawrence Oefinger) Bren. I have heard he manufactured some and I would like to see one.
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I was curious if any one has seen a DLO Manufacturing (Douglas Lawrence Oefinger) Bren. I have heard he manufactured some and I would like to see one.
Doug told me he imported 3-4 L4A1 guns as "Pre-86 Dealer Samples" in 1985, IIRC; my understanding is that they were not in great shape when he got them and he "rebuilt-refinished" them as appropriate.
So, no transferable Brens, just Dealer Samples.
-TomH
So what if I told you I know of a papered DLO MKII? Is it a fake?Quote:
Originally Posted by TactAdv
What do you mean by "papered"? A postie would have NFA documents... but would be restricted to dealers.
No clue. Just repeating what he told me. Doug is an -ODD- duck, he had lots and lots of projects that he doesn't talk about until he needs to sell something.Quote:
Originally Posted by c310pilot
But as to your question, No, I would presume it is indeed one of his creations, perhaps one that he finished at a later time??
A simple phone call to him would clear it up.
-TomH
The Bren is on a Form 4. The transfer was approved last year. Just curious about some of the markings. How would one get in touch with him?
I sent you a PM with his phone number.
Whatever became of this inquiry.....Did you ever call D.O.?? Learn anything of value on your gun..???
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So what if I told you I know of a papered DLO MKII? Is it a fake?
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The Bren is on a Form 4. The transfer was approved last year.
Look on the Form 4, in section 4, (b) does it say “Machinegun” and nothing else and in (d) Model, does it say “Mk2” and nothing else?
There are some registered that way. The problem is you can’t tell from the form if it was originally a Mk2 Bren or a Mk2 Sten, or any other kind of Mk2 for that matter. There are also Sterlings with Form 4’s just showing “Mk2”.
Now one might think if (d) Model has something like “Bren Gun”, “Sterling Mk4” or “Sten Mk2” listed you’re good to go. No! Not always. The ATF might want it corrected to “Mk2” when it’s transferred. I have seen it happen twice within the last year.
So your question, “Is it a fake?” is very hard one to answer. Did some unscrupulous person have a “Mk2” Sten or Sterling tube somehow grew into a Bren?
It might be a legit DLO Bren but I would very careful if I were you.
I would love to have a transferable Bren, but I wouldn’t go near this ATF created can of worms myself.
It's a simple task to write a letter to NFA along with your F3 or F4 and have them change the mistakes on the original forms. I've had to do it twice with no problem at all.
I wish it was that simple, Brian.
The change to “Mk2” was required by the ATF. They say it’s a required correction and they will not approve it any other way.
I have had two within the past year. Copies of the original approved forms from DLO say “Sterling” and “Sterling Mk5”. The ATF required they be changed to “Mk2”.
This is specific to some DOL receivers/guns only. I had no trouble getting a mistake on Wilson corrected.
Vince, et al:
There are actually two separate issues going on with this. One, the easier one to discuss is that one of the VERY few things ATF got extra funding for lately was to correct the NFRTR to the extent possible. (We'll leave THAT to another discussion), and there are/were many, many older registrations that were, to be simplistic here, in error or incomplete. It is, and actually has been for a long time, commonplace to request the transferor to do actual pencil-on-paper tracings of the engraved/stamped markings of the gun in question to properly classify it.
Originally, this was done to correct the minimal, and often in error, registrations for most commonly guns that were war trophys. Many people simply didn't understand the foreign markings or foreign naming conventions, much less any language barriers. Common were simple entries listing simply the national origins ("German Army"), or "street names" of many guns, i.e., "Schmeisser" for MP38/40 was common, for example.
The other more........interesting....reason they are asking for specific corrections to CERTAIN domestic manufactured transferable guns is that, shall we say, some of these initial registrations morphed over time into......other items. There are many classic examples but those by John Stemple are the best example. Apparently, certain of the DLO items have come into question as their current form as opposed to the original declaration at time of registration.
There was a lot of paper floating around spring-time 1986.....
Also, ATF makes the standard request to inform them at any time you can provide more accurate registration information. I have a pretty rare Japanese Type 1-100 aircraft flexible gun (Japanese licensed-built clone of the German MG15), originally registered in 1947 with the only information listed as "Japan" as the manufacturer, and "air gun" as model. When I got it I began a serious research of the guns' provenance, and over time and with the help of many experts like Ed Libby and correspondence with Japanese experts elsewhere, it's story became much clearer. We now know it is, specifically, one of the very, very uncommon sub-variants of the already uncommon IJN Type 1, known as the Type 1-100, manufactured by Yokosuka Naval Aviation Factory. I documented that specificity to NFA Branch and had them amend the registration to reflect the accuracy of the guns' history.
-TomH
Tom,
The “Mk2” debacle is a result of them trying to “correct” the registry. According to them that is how they were originally registered with the ATF. I can’t argue with that, but it has created an opportunity for morphing.
It might be just a coincidence that a previously unheard of DLO Mk2 Bren surfaced after these “corrections” started.
I hope we hear more from the captain.
On the more keep-them-guessing/semi devious side, surely the best idea would be to deliberately keep things obscure. After all, you - or someone in the distant past - just supplied the info they asked for.
My friend imported a straight pull SA80 GP bull-pup rifle from Canada in the 80's or so. After all the Customs formailities were completed, it went onto his UK licence as a SAKO. He queried this and it came back as......., yep, you guessed it......., as still a SAKO on the obvious basis that there was no SA80 on 'the list'. The nearest firearm make was SAKO. So SAKO it remained!
We still have that issue here on out reg cert. They wrote the law to state any mistakes are caused by the firearms owner and his responsibility to sort out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
'the nearest Firearm make was SAKO'
Well, that would indeed cover a 'Lot' of weapons indeed Peter!....:madsmile:
SAKO = Small Arms Killing Object......................:D
I just stumbled on this thread. I have had a DLO BREN for about ten years. It has a cut/re-weld receiver papered as a Mk-II, and is fully transferrable. Doug had it painted with Sterling type black wrinkle paint. I assume this was done to hide the weld scars. I couldn't get it to run at all for quite some time. Finally I sent it off to Len Savage. He "corrected" the welds, re-machined the interior, and refinished it. It now runs 100% with .303 South African surplus ammo. Len also set it up to run 8MM and 7.62X54R by changing the bolt and magazines. I actually like running it on .303 better.Quote:
Originally Posted by c310pilot
Here are some pictures or it taken with one of my MG34s. They are surprisingly similar in length and weight. Who would have known...
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...dbeb7d7f-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...d9baef03-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...a38c4d39-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...f1aef872-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...0f6f22bc-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...85e7c764-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...19a6394f-1.jpg
Finally, here is one of Mongo's videos with my BREN in it. It makes its first appearance at the 0:16 mark
https://www.youtube.com/watch?featur...&v=zWUYvoCvwD8
I think that you'd find it more comfortable to fire if your left hand was over the top of the small of the but actually gripping it tight, pulling the butt and gun back into your shoulder. Instead of using your left hand underhand just cradling the butt. Just my opinion of course.
But firing any Bren is just a moment to savour.........
Thank you for the information, but I'm not in this video. I simply supplied the weapon and the ammunition. It's amazing how many people will volunteer to fire a weapon when it's not theirs and they didn't buy the ammo.Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
Because I'm old and lazy, I prefer to fire my BREN while it's mounted on a BREN tripod. I just place my fat behind on a camping stool and squeeze the trigger.
How about that green tag? Sexy to say the least.
I have been asked to show how Doug marked his BRENs. Well, here is how mine is marked:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...ofebvhym-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...nepooftp-1.jpg
When I spoke with Doug way back when, he indicated that he "manufactured" a total of five (5) BRENs. Mine was his last one.
Remember, at the time mine was manufactured, DLO was based in Stamford Connecticut. My BATFE paperwork shows the exact serial number as 80MKII-005. Kind of funky, isn't it?
“Funky”. Yes, Doug did some funky things.Quote:
Originally Posted by MG34_Dan
I wonder what changes the BATFE will require to the Form on the next transfer.