first LE? investigate further or keep looking?

while i'm not in the position to buy right now, (license and permit to acquire) i'm asking around trying to collect stuff like brass etc and keeping an eye out for the "right" rifle.

what i'm looking for is a full wood rifle, on the accurate end of the spectrum, with iron sights, that isn't to nice to use fairly regularly. my first preference is for a lithgow built rifle. accuracy is far more important than matching numbers as this one is to use (small club level service competition, plinking and maybe the occasional shot at a feral deer or goat for a family member). if it happens to be matching and fairly correct as well as accurate i won't complain though.

i came across this one, it fits most of the main criteria. early action, H barrel, full wood etc. the price is fair, the owner knows i cannot take possession yet and is not in a hurry to sell it. should i investigate further or run away?

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it has a "MOTTY" heavy barrel, has been bedded by the looks of it and the nose cap has been heavily clearanced. i'm not sure if it has the original rear sight base or what the hand guards are like, i have only seen the pictures above.
the seller says the barrel is very nice and it shoots well.
to me it looks to be dated 1915, were enfield making mk3 star's by then?

thoughts?
thanks.

Match rifles have a collectable value and are a distinct area. If it speaks to you (that is you like it) consider it. A warning, collecting match rifles cane be very addictive.

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Originally Posted by henry r

full wood rifle, on the accurate end of the spectrum, with iron sights, that isn't to nice to use fairly regularly

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Your best bet is to find an FTR (Factory Thorough Repair) rifle that was completely overhauled after the war. I have a 1917 Lithgow that underwent FTR in 1946. Every part on it is 80% or better in terms of life expectancy. You can shoot it, display it, and cherish it. Purchase price for mine early this year was $325 USD.

henry r: I agree with Seaspriter. An as original, conventionally "bedded" rifle would make a better first LE. The rifle you show has, obviously, been tweaked in search of accuracy and who knows how reliable the modifications might be- especially if it involves all manner of shims and fiberglass. If you start with a good Lithgow that has survived as set up at the factory you'll be well down the road to happy LE ownership. My 3 Lithgows are probably the best set up of all my No. 1 rifles.

Ridolpho

It sounds the right rifle, depends on price I guess, one thing it has that you would probably be looking for is the target sight, they don't come cheap anymore regardless of make (it looks like a central or Austral one ?)..... one thing to remember is what some folk describe as "shoots well" may not be the same as your own description of shoots well.

With the nose cap work and barrel who knows what lies beneath..

Henry, you write "accuracy is far more important..." - my 5c worth is that, if you are looking for accuracy, a plastic stocked Remington 700 with a heavy barrel, bipod and scope in .223 cal will probably outperform this, or any other, Lee Enfield .303.
The reason the forum members here go dewy-eyed about Lee Enfields is that we are sentimental fools - not because the rifles are uncannily accurate.

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Originally Posted by RobD

Henry, you write "accuracy is far more important..." - my 5c worth is that, if you are looking for accuracy, a plastic stocked Remington 700 with a heavy barrel, bipod and scope in .223 cal will probably outperform this, or any other, Lee Enfield .303.
The reason the forum members here go dewy-eyed about Lee Enfields is that we are sentimental fools - not because the rifles are uncannily accurate.

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I think you missed the bit about service rifle shoot and because he is in Australia that basically limits him to bolt action rifles from WW2 or earlier

thanks gents.

the main use will be for plinking, the service shooting is to cover me for part of my licence requirements in my state. i want to be able to shoot at a range, so need to have target shooting as one of my "genuine reasons" on my licence application. for that you need to be a club member and to keep it you need to shoot 4 times per year at your club. there are only a couple of guys who shoot service rifle at the local club. all of whom have many many years of shooting under their belts. for me it will be for fun and to learn from very experienced shooters rather than any expectation of winning.

i know that a lee enfield will never come close to a modern rifle as far as accuracy, but i'd rather eat my genitals with a plastic spork than buy a new plastic rifle... :D i have wanted a smle for over 30 years and getting one is the whole reason i'm getting back into shooting.

i'm hoping for sub 3" groups at 100 yards, not 6"+.

to put the accuracy over originality comment in to perspective. i talked to a guy who was selling his '43 lithgow that he unpacked from grease in the 60's and never fired. it wasn't cheap but was a good price for what it was. i desperately wanted it but passed as it is a collector rifle, far too good for what want. i would guarantee that i would have dinged the stock within a week.

i would have got that lithgow. if you ding teh stock then you ding the stock. They got worse in the trenches, deserts paddy fields etc and still kept on going.

Henryr depending on what you shoot governs the class, that rifle being modded would be I think a Spec - 2 modified and have to shoot in modified class, better going for a Spec-1 as issued and as alluded go or try to find an FTR and as far as having fun that is the essence of the whole endeavor.

Henry, it looks like a typical well set up Range Rifle.
A lot of British rifles were sent to OZ post WW1 as reperation, they were good tight rifles and if this one was deemed good enough to be mated to a Motty barrel, then I'd assume that it was a good shooter.
Spec 1 and 2 are only applicable to SSAA and AIHPA disciplines, if you shoot NRAA then it's good to go.
The enlarged nosecap was for a rubber nose, refit the insert if it is missing, these modded rifles can still hold MOA, I'd buy it in a flash(if I didn't already have so many) Don't let the purists put you off.......it's good value.

As HenryR did not state what discipline he was going to shoot I thought it prudent to give him the guff on them in relation to the Specs I shoot under its fine if he shoots NRAA it is just a bit hard to enter a Spec-1 comp with a Spec - 2 rifle it was an information only blurb, as I have only shot SSAA & AIIHPA I cannot comment on the rulings and courses of fire that NRAA have. I have seen persons get disgruntled when they want to shoot only to find that the class they have cannot compete because there is no class for it we invented a class so all can shoot and win a trophy or a selection that way everybody is happy and gets to try and beat the elements.

cinders, the club is a SSAA club. i think there are only 3 regular shooters in service rifle, with a few others occasionally dusting off their military rifles. a fair proportion of the club shooting bench rest. there is a fair number of western or a growing number of field rifle from what i have been told.

i have talked to the guy who looks after the service rifle here and he wasn't too fussed about the exact spec of the rifle. aka barrel profile, bedding etc, as they shoot for fun rather than serious competition. we didn't talk about aperture sights as i didn't think i'd have a rifle with them.

Like Muffet said and I concur if the rifle is real good and if it has a Motty barrel then it should be a good grab and like you said the owner is not too fussed on time for the sale, you may have noticed the distinct lack of Remington 303 brass at least there is none were I am, the 174 SMK Seirras perform well and there is plenty of load data out there for them I use AR 2209 as AR 2208 is a bit sharp, but beware as The Enfield line grow on you....dont they fella's

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Originally Posted by henry r

cinders, the club is a SSAA club. i think there are only 3 regular shooters in service rifle, with a few others occasionally dusting off their military rifles. a fair proportion of the club shooting bench rest. there is a fair number of western or a growing number of field rifle from what i have been told.

i have talked to the guy who looks after the service rifle here and he wasn't too fussed about the exact spec of the rifle. aka barrel profile, bedding etc, as they shoot for fun rather than serious competition. we didn't talk about aperture sights as i didn't think i'd have a rifle with them.

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If they're not worried about bedding and heavy profile barrels, they're not likely to be worried about aperture sights. In my experience, at club level people generally don't mind what you're shooting as long as it's an old military rifle of some description. Unless you're completely pwning everyone, of course. :p

For what it's worth, heavy-barrelled target and club .303 rifles were pressed into service during WWII - they needed everything they could get. I believe most of them were used for reserve and Home Guard-type duties.

i guess i will investigate the rifle further then :D . i wouldn't hold your breath for updates with pics and range reports as it might take a while.

the few times i tried aperture sights in my youth i never got the hang of them so stock sights would be on the cards.

being pressed into ww2 service might explain why it has a ^ in a D stamp (english?) as well as a australian D^D stamp on it.

as far as brass, i bought a bag of bretram cases and have collected a few 60's and 70's boxer cases plus some mk7 berden primed cases.

my intention is to shoot either PPU or mk7 for a while before learning to reload, so there should be some more cases there.

i have already considered that lee enfields can breed in a gun safe, so am looking at getting an older 10 gun safe from a friend and using the older 5 gun single compartment safe i have for ammunition, cleaning gear + the associated military bits that have accumulated already.

Don't overdo it on the Safe size, these damn things get to partying pretty well, I often think it degenerates into an orgy.(would explain the rapid propagation.)

Muffets correct henry r if you get one it starts the whale song sorta stuff calling to all its mates from all over and before you know it you have a throng of them trying to get into your safes, now all I have to worry about is keeping the ones I have quiet..........

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Originally Posted by muffett.2008

Don't overdo it on the Safe size, these damn things get to partying pretty well, I often think it degenerates into an orgy.(would explain the rapid propagation.)

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Amen to that! I stored a few Lee Enfields in the same safe as a couple of Gew. 88 Commission rifles and a few months later out popped a Huzagol M35.

Ridolpho