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Just getting started reloading for my 1903. I have Imr 4064 and 150gn flat based spire point factory seconds. Any tips or experience to share. Should I keep to listed OAL. I have a redfield peep sight on it and wanted to go for accurate loads . It has a 1944 1903a3 2 grove barrel on it. Yes it was sporterized when I got it but barrel wasn't cut. With some factory loads it seemed pretty good. I won't be using it for hunting so was interested just in target shooting.
I've tried some reduced loads with Red Dot. I put 13 grns behind a 147 grn FMJ which produced 2" groups at 100 mtrs. The same amount of powder behind a 168 grn HPBT produced a large group that I didn't even bother to measure. I suspect that the bullet wasn't going fast enough to be stabilised. For full loads I use Vhitavouri powders with either 147 FMJs or 168 HPBTs (Sierra or Hornady).
Anyone wanting to copy the reduced loads be advised that they are not in the loading manual and you therefore use them at your own risk. They did however function without problems in my Remington built M1903 A3.
Hornady 155g A-Max bullets give very good accuracy for me in 30.06 and .308. I load them long and single load so my OAL is customized to my rifles.
Thanks for replies.
I will try single load method and keep with the lighter bullet around 150gn. Now I have read to take an empty case and put the bullet in slightly and close the bolt so bullet is pushed in which would give Max OAL. Then work back from there on length to help with the bullet jump to throat. I have only made bullets using listed lengths. If I start with middle of listing for powder charges will the OAL affect pressures much in making them longer. I haven't done any experimenting outside of whats in the loading manuals. I do have a chronograph to check velocity.
With factory 150gn PPU ammo I'm getting around 3 inch groups at 100yards with the peep sight which is fairly good for me with blurry vision. I just don't want to put a scope on it.
I'm cheap and never bought the O.A.L gauge. That's how I do it, with a cartridge with slits cut in the neck and a bullet colored with a Sharpie. Not benchrest precise but good enough for most.
I've never even worried about pressures. I Back off 10 or 15 thousands.
For short range loads take a look at https://www.milsurps.com/showthread....086#post360086 to see what can be achieved.
I have used the 4064 but prefer IMR 4895 (or H 4895 or Varget, basically the same burn rate) and I push the 147-150 grainers with 47 grains. Max in the book is 51 grains. I shoot 2 to 3 inch groups off the bench but I'm 65. Now a patient young man with good eyes used my Smith Corona with my reloads and covered 4 shots with a dime and all five with a nickel.
Groups like that would do a lot of modern rifles proud.Quote:
Originally Posted by TDH
65 years old? When I was that old we were still using Lee Enfields!
I am of the KISS school. Your rifle has been around for over 100 years. There have been several variations on barrels, sights etc. That said any factory bullet at 150 grains going 2,700 fps is going to shoot very well (assuming a good barrel, upward muzzle pressure, and everything tight and to spec). Lots of shooters have loaded millions of rounds and the sweet spot is still 150-168 grains and 2,600-2800 fps (safe loads from a manual). At a match on Saturday, a shooter with his AR said he wanted to work up a load for his M1 Garand. OK, go for it but there is not much new under the M1 Sun. No amount of ammo tweaking is going to turn my Rack Grade M1 into a Remington 40x or be as accurate as 90% of the AR's out there. My go to 100 yard load for a M1903A3 is a 170 grain cast bullet at 1,400 fps. No recoil, inexpensive and accurate enough to score well in a CMP match. As a benchrest rifle, it has a way to go though. I don't doubt TDH's results. I have put five shots into one hole once at 25 yards with cast. Given a really good rifle and a really good shooter good things happen. Enjoy your rifle, and enjoy loading for it. Pride of ownership is something to covet.
Dave
OP, 49 gr of IMR 4064 and a 150 gr bullet has worked well in my 1903s. I have loaded Sierra 150 gr HPBT MK, Sierra 150 gr BTSP hunting bullets, and Remington 150 gr Core Lokt flat base.
I would use recommended OAL. Work your loads up as per normal procedure, every rifle is different. In my 1903s, when I got at or above 51 gr, I did start getting pressure signs, which is expected because that is at or near max in most data I have seen.
The biggest problem I had in the 150gr weight range was finding a good flat based bullet that was long enough to load to factory ball round OAL. The Hornady 150 Interlocks, and the Sierra 150 Pro Hunters will allow this. Most if not all 150gr BT projectiles won't.Quote:
Originally Posted by M95Dennis
You can try seating out to the lands, but you might reach the point where the round won't fit into the mag box anymore before that happens.
After all that, you may just end up where I did...right at factory ball round length.
I now use Speer 165gr HCSP's with either IMR4895 or 4064 @ 2700 fps as my general use round for the 03A3 and M1 rifles.
Agreed. A range that I use myself with good results. Since any setup has some tolerances (bullet shape, measurement accuracy, seating die action) it is illusory to think that one can hold the spacing between bullet ogive and land contact constant to 1/1000. In other words, trying to get too close will result in pressure variation as a simple result of the seating depth variation.Quote:
Originally Posted by WarPig1976
BUT,
if there is not enough of the (more or less) cylindrical portion of the bullet within the neck of the loaded cartridge, then there will be inadequate expansion of the neck on firing before the bullet comes free, resulting in a gas loss around the neck that will be visible as a dirty deposit. So optimum seating depth is often incompatible with the use of boattails.
- Which seems to me to be a good indication that there is no significant throat wear in that rifle!Quote:
Originally Posted by jakester
When I started loading one of my mentors told me that loading for a pistol is simple rifle ammo is a totally different can of worms. For pistol a bullet has to travel 6 inches of less before it leaves the barrel most of the time. I did have n eight inch barrel on a .44. but for the rifle add several steps like trimming the neck length and making sire the primer pocket is kept clean. Each rifle shoots different so start in the middle of the range say 44 to 51 grains depending on the book I started at 47 with max in the book 51 and then I would load 15 to twenty rounds at 46.5 and 47.5 and another twenty at 46 and 48 and then 45.5 and 48.5 (if you get my point) and then it's set down at the bench and snuggle in. Shoot 5 rounds and record them try a different loading and shoot 5 rounds until you find the load that works best in YOUR rifle. What do you do with the extra rounds? I would shoot them or you can pull them apart and reload them to what works best. Either way have fun.
---------- Post added at 04:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:07 PM ----------
Hey EX Crab they were still using the Lee Enfields ?:eek: Or the Nave Lee Enfields? :madsmile: Did you serve with Teddy too?:bow::cheers:
---------- Post added at 04:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:07 PM ----------
[/COLOR]Hey EX Crab they were still using the Lee Enfields ?:eek: Or the Nave Lee Enfields? :madsmile: Did you serve with Teddy too?:bow::cheers:[/QUOTE]
I was joking, slightly. Although the L1A1 was the service rifle in my time, we still had derivatives of the Lee Enfield in service. The L42A1 was an LE rebarreled to 7.62 Nato with a modified mag, it was used as a sniper rifle. The L39A1 was a rebarreled LE but with the old 303 mag, it was used as a target rifle.