Help with M1 Garand Prices please????

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08-13-2016, 01:49 PM
mdarnell19

Help with M1 Garand Prices please????

I am looking at a few M1s to purchase. I am curious what you all, who are more in the mix then I am, believe the current value of 1944 dated M1s are. I know that the earlier the rifle the more valuable, but the one I am looking at comes from a reliable/knowledgeable seller. It is a absolute mint condition, 100% correct 1944 M1 with the DCM papers and box. Can some please give me their opinions on the value of such a rifle? I understand pictures helps but I have none at this time. I am curious what you all have seen them sell for lately. Thank you in advance for the help. It is greatly appreciated. :thup:
08-13-2016, 05:39 PM
Joe W

To get the true value someone with the a lot knowledge and experience would really have to see the rifle in person and examine it. The fact it is a DCM sales rifle with box, in itself, adds to the value but still a big spread between a "correct" rifle and one that may be "original" or substantially original. I know it is very difficult to determine if a rifle is "original" or just a well done restoration. But real experts could give you a pretty good idea and this could make a large difference in it's value.
Also keep in mind that the rifle may not be as it was when it was sold through the DCM. many years have past and possible it has had a few owners. Who knows what parts could have been added during this time to make it "correct".
08-13-2016, 05:54 PM
Mike Haas

Try this...

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdarnell19

I am looking at a few M1s to purchase. I am curious what you all, who are more in the mix then I am, believe the current value of 1944 dated M1s are. I know that the earlier the rifle the more valuable, but the one I am looking at comes from a reliable/knowledgeable seller. It is a absolute mint condition, 100% correct 1944 M1 with the DCM papers and box. Can some please give me their opinions on the value of such a rifle? I understand pictures helps but I have none at this time. I am curious what you all have seen them sell for lately. Thank you in advance for the help. It is greatly appreciated. :thup:

OK I read you post..twice!. All anybody can assume from it is the rifle is as you said it is. Without pics/detailed info the only way we can tell you if it overpriced or a bargain is tell us what his asking price is. Even then it would just be a WAG..:eek::eek:
08-13-2016, 07:15 PM
mdarnell19

Thanks for the reply's. I am aware of what a restored rifle is verses a original rifle. The rifle in question is a 100% original rifle and still has the grease on the metal from the factory. We have not confirmed a exact price but we are talking around $4,000. I talked with Scott Duff and he said he personally would not take less then $4,000 for such a rifle. But I realize he is capable of getting prices for things that others can not. This is why I was curious what those here who still buy and sell these have seen prices at. The point of this thread is not to determine if the rifle is correct or not. I will have the help of other collectors to do that. I am merely asking the question, what is a 1944 Garand that is 100% original and in great condition worth? Thanks again for the help.
08-13-2016, 10:17 PM
Joe W

If Scott Duff told you " he personally would not take less then $4,000 for such a rifle", what more can someone else tell you. You already got it from best. If the rifle is as you say, I know it would be worth $ 4000.00 to me.
08-13-2016, 10:54 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joe W

If Scott Duff told you " he personally would not take less then $4,000 for such a rifle", what more can someone else tell you. You already got it from best. If the rifle is as you say, I know it would be worth $ 4000.00 to me.

Thanks. This was my thinking as well but wanted to know if I was alone in this thinking. I am more concerned with the price since it is a late war gun. It seems like late war M1s don't sell so well. Perhaps I will post pictures when he sends me some.

Any other opinions on values? Did not the CMP run out of M1s? Will this not raise the price of all M1s?

-Thanks
08-14-2016, 11:48 AM
Detroit-1

Before I would pay 4000.00 for any gun I would have more than the seller look it over. The DCM selling a brand new M1 unissued 44 M1 I would want to have Scott Duff look at it himself.
08-14-2016, 01:23 PM
Bob Seijas

I must be so out of touch with prices... haven't bought or sold anything in a long time. $4,000 for a regular 1944 M1? Yikes, seems nuts to me! I better revalue my collection.
08-14-2016, 01:48 PM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Detroit-1

Before I would pay 4000.00 for any gun I would have more than the seller look it over.

I wouldn't trust the seller to the end of my arm. He's the seller. The voices here have told you we need pictures to give you an opinion. They're right. I personally have applied cosmoline to military rifles after the fact of manufacture so just because it has "The original grease"(says the seller) doesn't mean squat. Did you show it to Scott Duff, or are you fishing in the dark with him same as you are with us? Seems you are one of these that wants to hear what he wants to hear and that's all there is to it. So either show us with detailed pictures so we can determine originality and value or sell it with what you think you have now...
08-14-2016, 03:43 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

I wouldn't trust the seller to the end of my arm. He's the seller. The voices here have told you we need pictures to give you an opinion. They're right. I personally have applied cosmoline to military rifles after the fact of manufacture so just because it has "The original grease"(says the seller) doesn't mean squat. Did you show it to Scott Duff, or are you fishing in the dark with him same as you are with us? Seems you are one of these that wants to hear what he wants to hear and that's all there is to it. So either show us with detailed pictures so we can determine originality and value or sell it with what you think you have now...

I am not selling anything, I am wanting to buy this rifle. I would post pictures if I had them but I don't. I will as soon as I get them.

From my experience of purchase valuable firearms, there are 2 steps. 1. Authenticating the rifle and 2. establishing a accurate price for the firearm. Since I am waiting on the seller to send me detailed pictures, I am trying to work on step number 2.
08-14-2016, 03:56 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob seijas

I must be so out of touch with prices... haven't bought or sold anything in a long time. $4,000 for a regular 1944 M1? Yikes, seems nuts to me! I better revalue my collection.

Bob, this was my initial thought also. But then I see CMP auctions like this. I know this is a Winchester and is 1943 but still, $16,000???

Civilian Marksmanship Program - Promoting firearms safety training!

If you remember we talked over email about the seller. You said you knew him well and that he knows his stuff.
08-14-2016, 05:31 PM
Patrick Chadwick

Pie in the sky?

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

...Did you show it to Scott Duff, or are you fishing in the dark with him same as you are with us? ...

He's fishing. Note:
"I understand pictures helps but I have none at this time."
and
"I would post pictures if I had them but I don't."

from which one can deduce that ScottDuff hasn't seen anything, not even photos.

This thread is going nowhere without photos.
08-14-2016, 06:29 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick

He's fishing. Note:
"I understand pictures helps but I have none at this time."
and
"I would post pictures if I had them but I don't."

from which one can deduce that ScottDuff hasn't seen anything, not even photos.

This thread is going nowhere without photos.

Man you guys are tough on a new guy to the forum. Do you believe I am trying to do anything other then what I stated? Let me make it abundantly clear, my intention is to purchase a original M1 Garand. In my search I contacted a gentleman that I have purchased from before and he mentioned the rifle in question. I have been studying what makes a rifle original and have been on conversation with Scott Duff, Bob Seijas and Rick Borecky about this subject matter. However, these three men have admitted that they are not up to date on the current prices of M1 rifles. This is why I posted this thread, to see what those who are update have to say about values. I feel though that I have not received any help and that my character and intentions have been called into question. Perhaps I am mis-understanding peoples responses. Please correct me if I am wrong. I see many members here are from other countries and communication can be difficult and tricky.

If I receive pictures I will post them, I guarantee this. I sure do not want to make a uniformed purchase. I thought it possible to determine by price only if I should even pursue it further to get pictures. But perhaps this was a unrealistic goal.
08-14-2016, 08:03 PM
Mike Haas

MDAENELL19 - Repost your question..

QUOTE=mdarnell19;372445]I am not selling anything, I am wanting to buy this rifle. I would post pictures if I had them but I don't. I will as soon as I get them.

From my experience of purchase valuable firearms, there are 2 steps. 1. Authenticating the rifle and 2. establishing a accurate price for the firearm. Since I am waiting on the seller to send me detailed pictures, I am trying to work on step number 2.[/QUOTE]

After you've gotton past step 1. Then post picures; then we maybe able to help to authentic the rifle. Once thats done then we might be able to help you with price estimates.

Nobody on this forum is "being hard on a new guy". Your making it hard for us to help you. :nono::nono:

Rob
08-14-2016, 08:58 PM
Bob Seijas

Have to say that I see it differently... the guy asks a simple question: what's an original 1944 rifle worth? Is it worth the $4,000 the seller is asking? OK, that's a hard question without seeing it, but there are simple answers that might help him. Mine is NO, unless it is the best 1944 anybody has ever seen, just flat new. If it is a gun in high excellent condition and original, my guess is $2,500.
08-14-2016, 10:13 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by bob seijas

Have to say that I see it differently... the guy asks a simple question: what's an original 1944 rifle worth? Is it worth the $4,000 the seller is asking? OK, that's a hard question without seeing it, but there are simple answers that might help him. Mine is NO, unless it is the best 1944 anybody has ever seen, just flat new. If it is a gun in high excellent condition and original, my guess is $2,500.

Thank you guys. I will post pictures if and when I get them and then we can continue this conversation. Thanks for the help so far.
08-16-2016, 07:20 PM
AZshot

There were tens of thousands of M-1 Garands sold after the war. The DCM has been unloading them for decades. I've seen the prices go from $100, to $300 when I got mine in the 90s. But I find it hard to believe why anyone would pay $4,000 for an ubiquitous service rifle made so abundantly. A sniper version of a USMC Johnson or something maybe. But a regular M-1? Nah....keep looking. I don't know those "experts" quoted and don't care. It sounds like those Mecum car auctions, with guys prancing around yelling "Ho!....'nother bid! YAOW! "

Don't get suckered in by emotions. There are so many M-1s out there it's not funny.
08-16-2016, 08:47 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by AZshot

There were tens of thousands of M-1 Garands sold after the war. The DCM has been unloading them for decades. I've seen the prices go from $100, to $300 when I got mine in the 90s. But I find it hard to believe why anyone would pay $4,000 for an ubiquitous service rifle made so abundantly. A sniper version of a USMC Johnson or something maybe. But a regular M-1? Nah....keep looking. I don't know those "experts" quoted and don't care. It sounds like those Mecum car auctions, with guys prancing around yelling "Ho!....'nother bid! YAOW! "

Don't get suckered in by emotions. There are so many M-1s out there it's not funny.

Thanks for the advice, I am certainly trying to take my time to make sure I make a good decision. I understand there are a lot of M1s out there but from my understanding there are not may factory original M1s out there. Should not a original M1 be priced significantly higher then say a restored rifle? Thanks again for your opinion the subject.
08-17-2016, 08:43 AM
Bob Seijas

Original

That's very true... the first pair that was new unissued and in the factory box was auctioned by CMP for over $30,000 -- and they were Korean Era late production. Subsequent pairs brought about $16,000 and individual rifles were bid into the $8,000 range. A similar 1944 rifle would be rarer, but of course the problem is determining if it really is a new gun or a near-perfect restoration. I could do one that would fool most people for a LOT less than $4,000.
08-17-2016, 04:38 PM
Patrick Chadwick

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdarnell19

Man you guys are tough on a new guy to the forum. Do you believe I am trying to do anything other then what I stated?

It's nothing to do with being a new guy. So please do not take it personally. "Tough" tends to have a negative flavor - I would prefer "rigorous". And the rigor is in the interest of your wallet!

You did the right thing in coming to this forum, as the collective eyeballs of forum users will often pick out aspects that a single person might overlook. But to make use of that collective experience, photos are of the essence.

And please beware of the word "original". The swapping out of parts to create what is presumed to be an original configuration for a particular date or number range is so easy that it is not possible to guarantee that a rifle is original (in the sense of being the same assembly of parts as left the factory) merely because the parts match the approved configuration. In this matter one must be rigorous - even tough - and inspect the rifle minutely for signs that parts have been retrofitted. This is often revealed by differences in wear, scratches, dirt etc. All aspects that require no particular knowledge of the type of rifle, but a sharp eye for material inconsistency.

So in the end, even with the best photos, no-one will be able to guarantee that the rifle is original. All we will be able to say is that (hopefully) nothing is visibly wrong. Considering that the price that the seller is looking for is 8 times the price of my 1943 original-enough-for-me Garand, you certainly should be rigorous in evaluation - of the rifle and the seller!

At the price level that you are considering, one should a) have the rifle examined by an acknowledged expert and b) obtain a written guarantee from the seller that he will take back the rifle and return the money if the rifle is subsequently proven not to be as he claims. Remember the old saying: verbal claims are not worth the paper they're witten on!
08-17-2016, 07:44 PM
mdarnell19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Patrick Chadwick

It's nothing to do with being a new guy. So please do not take it personally. "Tough" tends to have a negative flavor - I would prefer "rigorous". And the rigor is in the interest of your wallet!

You did the right thing in coming to this forum, as the collective eyeballs of forum users will often pick out aspects that a single person might overlook. But to make use of that collective experience, photos are of the essence.

And please beware of the word "original". The swapping out of parts to create what is presumed to be an original configuration for a particular date or number range is so easy that it is not possible to guarantee that a rifle is original (in the sense of being the same assembly of parts as left the factory) merely because the parts match the approved configuration. In this matter one must be rigorous - even tough - and inspect the rifle minutely for signs that parts have been retrofitted. This is often revealed by differences in wear, scratches, dirt etc. All aspects that require no particular knowledge of the type of rifle, but a sharp eye for material inconsistency.

So in the end, even with the best photos, no-one will be able to guarantee that the rifle is original. All we will be able to say is that (hopefully) nothing is visibly wrong. Considering that the price that the seller is looking for is 8 times the price of my 1943 original-enough-for-me Garand, you certainly should be rigorous in evaluation - of the rifle and the seller!

At the price level that you are considering, one should a) have the rifle examined by an acknowledged expert and b) obtain a written guarantee from the seller that he will take back the rifle and return the money if the rifle is subsequently proven not to be as he claims. Remember the old saying: verbal claims are not worth the paper they're witten on!

Thank you Patrick, great advise! I understand the extreme difficulty of authenticating a rifle as "Original." Which is why I have not yet purchased anything. Good pictures will be a start and I would be willing to send the rifle to a expert to get a opinion. Scott Duff does not do this any more, do you know of anyone else who does? If so please let me know. I am trying to talk to as many knowledgeable individuals as I can before making a purchase. Again, the seller and I have not talked about a confirmed price yet, I will not be interested unless he is willing to come down considerably. I still haven't even seen any pictures so the rifle may be no good.

I really do appreciate the opinions on value but at the same time I believe many I have spoken to have been buying M1s since the 1990s and are not aware of the value these rifles now have or a outraged by what they sell for today. You said this rifle is priced 8 times what you paid for a 1943, that's $500. There are no M1s for sale for $500. Unless you are willing to sell your rifle for a profit? I'd give you $700 for it? See what I mean. Prices have changed. I don't want to get ripped off (which I understand anything near $4,000 is too high) but I understand that am not going to pay 1997 prices. This was why I posed this question here so that those who still go to the big gun shows and buy and sell these can tell me what they are seeing nice M1s sell for. I hope this makes sense. Thanks
08-17-2016, 11:26 PM
CanadianAR

I don't understand why authenticity even matters! He's not requesting that you authenticate a rifle.
He isn't asking for advice. A simple rough estimate on value.

I don't know garands at all. I am a k98k and G/k43 collector. But when asked a question, ie; what's a matching bnz44 kreigsmodell rifle in 95% condition worth, I just answer the question. I don't even care if the rifle in question exists. Haha. I can, as an up to date collector, just give an estimate on value. If the rifle turns out bad, he should have asked about authenticity not value.
08-18-2016, 12:40 AM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianAR

I don't understand why authenticity even matters!

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianAR

I don't know garands at all.

Both these statements show why you should have stayed out of this then. Here in Canada, many don't know squat about an original or collector M1. Most wouldn't know one if it bit them. There's a vast difference in the prices and we're trying to establish what he's trying to buy. There's a huge price difference.
08-18-2016, 01:24 AM
CanadianAR

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

Both these statements show why you should have stayed out of this then. Here in Canada, many don't know squat about an original or collector M1. Most wouldn't know one if it bit them. There's a vast difference in the prices and we're trying to establish what he's trying to buy. There's a huge price difference.

Who gives a damn what he's buying!? He did not ask you guys to sort out of its original or not. Just a price on a stated item, that's assumed good.

Give a price for an original 1944 garand.

This isn't an issue with knowing garands or not. It's about knowing English and listening to what the OP is saying.
Again he is not asking for authentication. He just asks what a 100% good gun is worth.
So you must assume(to give him an answer)the rifle is all good and lay out a value as if it was a good gun.
08-18-2016, 06:13 AM
browningautorifle

We'd rather not assume here. Thanks for coming from no where and sorting us out. You don't know what you're talking about.
08-18-2016, 12:04 PM
twh

There are very few Garands that would command $4,000 or more and most of those have scopes attached or funny looking front ends and are beyond the scope of what you asked. As a real world example I happened into this scenario yesterday at my favorite shop for all things Garand or US surplus. Sitting on the counter was an all correct, except for the clip latch, M-1 in the early 3 million range that had just been sold. The original asking price was around $1,700.00 but it sold for around $1,300 as part of a package deal. As I said it was correct with the exception of the clip latch and had one of the nicest SA/GAW stocks that I have seen. Had I known about it before the sale I would have bought it at that price and considered it a good deal.
08-18-2016, 12:39 PM
CanadianAR

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

We'd rather not assume here. Thanks for coming from no where and sorting us out. You don't know what you're talking about.

You're honestly ridiculous. This is why I never
Come to this forum. Because it's half useless.

And I don't know what I'm talking about?? I know how to answer a question without trying to be some sort of garand messiah by implying no information can be given out without photos. When in fact the entire thread could be resolved without pics at all
A simple question. Such an epic waste of time.

Again, the OP doesn't want your opinion on originality or correctness. Simply a ballpark on a known good 1944
Garand.

Can someone who bought a correct 44 garand in the last year at a fair price just post what they paid. Lol.
08-18-2016, 01:19 PM
Badger

Quote:

Originally Posted by CanadianAR

You're honestly ridiculous. This is why I never Come to this forum. Because it's half useless.

It's only half useless when you wade into a thread, carrying a gasoline can in one hand and a book of matches in the other, seemingly to add little value except to incite a firestorm, about a collectible genre that you self admittedly don't collect and know anything about. :confused:

We sorry that you find our forum and style of communications between members unsuitable for what you're looking for.

This thread is closed, as there's little more that could be added except for everyone to experience additional literary drive-by shootings. ;)

Regards,
Doug

PS ...

Quote:

Originally Posted by mdarnell19

I am not selling anything, I am wanting to buy this rifle. I would post pictures if I had them but I don't. I will as soon as I get them.

Hey partner... as some have been trying to say, it is difficult to give you any kind of a reasonable price on a Garand that they can't visualize. Condition and authenticity are everything. Once you get your pics, send them to me at badger@milsurps.com via email and I'll post them for you, as well have our Advisory Panel give you a pretty accurate appraisal as to what you're looking at. The more pics the better... :cheers: