First time Garand build and problems –M1 smiths, please help! (very long)

Hello gents, I had an absolute great time yesterday building my first Garand. Years accumulating the tools and parts and I was finally ready to go. For the most part it went well, but I have a few problems that are keeping me for a rifle I’m ready to fire, I hope you can help.

I barreled three receivers yesterday for the first time. First was a 1.0 SA CMP grade C receiver onto an 11-42 CMP barrel I recrowned. It was hand tight at about 6:45. It took some “oomph” but it aligned well with the badger ordnance alignment gauges. Next I barreled a CMP Win-13 receiver (remember those from 2003? Like I said, I’ve been a few years in the making…) onto a WRA barrel that was hand tight at 6:30. As I expected it torqued on and aligned without as much muscle as the first barrel. I saved my best project rifle for last—I’m going to try and make a good match rifle. I had a nice 2.1 SA CMP grade A receiver I hand picked from the south store (when I got it home there was a very faint SA 12-65 rebuild, so I guess it should really have been a grade B. Regardless, it is a very nice receiver) and a new in wrap SA 11-51 barrel. These two were hand tight just past 7:00, I figured it would be the hardest to torque and align. It was, so much so I had to get about a 16-inch extension to the Brownells actions wrench to finish it off. Is it common to have to use a breaker bar to finish torqueing? I was a bit concerned with how much pressure I was putting on the assembly. Also, for any of you considering an action wrench, buy the Brownells. I first got the one from Midway because it was cheaper and it was obvious why as soon as I took it out of the box. I immediately sent it back and bought Brownell’s version. It was well worth it!

I then proudly set to work in the garage to finish off the rest of my ‘match’ gun following McKee’s assembly guide and referencing Kuhnhausen’s manual as well. Before I barreled the 2.1 SA I lapped in a NIW bolt following the procedures and headspaceing in the McKee book. I checked headspace again after installing the barrel and I was just short—just a couple thousandths short of closing on a Clymer or USGI GO gauge. I lapped the bolt a bit more as McKee advised. It is now at minimum headspace. It just barely closes on the Clymer and is just shy of closing on the USGI. From conversations here I thought the Clymer would be the more conservative gauge, I was surprised the bolt closed on it and not the GI one. Anyway, I’m satisfied with headspace now that it closed on at least one and don’t feel I need to lap anymore, please let me know if I’m off base. Assembling the rest of the parts was relatively easy, but slow. All my parts are NOS/as new and the fit is tight. It took a while to convince the rear hand guard tab to fit in the lower band (the stock is as new from Jeff McClintock, beautiful!).

My first problem occurred with the op-rod, it fails the tilt test. I tried two other rods and both failed in the same spot, so I’m thinking it is not the rod. When retracting the op rod the last half-inch of travel grinds to a halt. It is possible to fully retract it but it takes significant pressure. I’d like to think the problem is it needs some “breaking in” with the Parkerizing on every surface, but the amount of force required is just to much for me to think that is the case. McKee’s book doesn’t provide much help here (“Get another op rod”) so I read up again in Kuhnhausen. Lots of info there to try and find were the misalignment occurs and how to bend the rod. I forced the rod back and forth multiple times trying to indentify the friction point. Left and right it looks to be centered fine (I still have not installed the lower band pin as McKee suggested, but lower band it tight in place). The vertical bend of the rod I’m not so sure about. I think the problem is occurring with the op-rod saddle bearing down on the bottom of the barrel during the last half inch of travel. Second guess would be somewhere with the tab. “Feeling” how the op-rod slows down the problem feels like it more in the rear than up front with the cylinder. I was hoping that since the rod and barrel both have 100% finish I would be able to see any wear marks after cycling a few times to ID the conflict. Removing this op-rod is also a pain! It takes a lot of pressure to lift up on the handle when aligned with the slot and I actually have to get a screwdriver to pry it “out” to start the rotation out of the grove (the two other older op-rods were also tight but did not requiring prying). Is this due to it being NIW versus worn out or another symptom of my op-rod fit problem? I think the later. After inspecting the finish I was surprised not to find any wear on the op-rod or receiver. I surely thought there would be some with the amount of drag it takes to fully retract the last half-inch. I repeated the process again trying to locate friction. It still looked like saddle to barrel to me. This time a VERY thin line of wear the last half inch along the bottom of the barrel and just a small spot of finish wear right at the edge of the op rod saddle, at the flat part that contacts the receiver when fully retracted. So I think this is my problem. Do I have a vertical op rod bend problem? As I said it was a NIW rod so I’d hoped for now problems, but who knows what happened to it in 60 years (D35382 rod). What can I do know?

Second problem is stock fit. Trigger housing and guard are both NIW and the stock is as new. The stock has been on a rifle before, so I would not think there would be any trouble with the fit or final inletting. When I went to lock the trigger group into place the trigger guard stopped with friction just as the hook was at the end of the trigger. “Great!” I thought, this would be a nice tight stock and a good one for my match rifle. Boy is it tight! I literally am not strong enough to close it. I wacked with a rubber mallet and it didn’t close. I applied 186 pounds of down force of the rifle to try and force it in (don’t embarrass me by asking how I know that, it took enough courage to try that hard on this beauty!). That will just barely get the hook to touch metal at the bottom of the housing, but about 3/16” forward of were the hook “hooks” (under no tension the hook usually hits metal about 1/16” forward of its engagement area). I tried applying the pressure on a more forward portion of the guard to stretch it out but no luck. The trigger group and receiver lock up fine without the stock. The trigger group works in another rifle but is still tight. The stock does not work in another rifle or trigger housing. So I at least know I have a stock problem compounded by a brand new trigger guard. The stock has a DAS so it has been closed on a rifle before, were they really that tight when brand new? I think the most pressure is occurring on the bottom of the magazine portion of the housing, the part to the most rear. That is where I’m starting to see the most “new” compression in the stock. Any advice? I don’t want to start removing any wood unless that is the only option. Any other tricks to lock the tightest trigger housing you’ve ever seen?

One last bit—the follower I bought was NIW and still in two pieces. No problem I thought, the ordnance manuals show how to hit it to tap it in place. Like everything else yesterday, it just didn’t want to play. I guess I could pull out the 100-pound hammer and just start whacking away to solve my problems, but I just didn’t want to force anything. Any tricks to assembling a follower? Just whack it even harder with a hammer? It’s a bit awkward to hold while hitting.

I can’t wait to get this thing shooting. It looks great! I put NM sights on it as well. I started collecting parts for it with the thought of a “brand new” rifle then the CMP Greeks came out! I couldn’t help but feeling like an SA employee yesterday, it was just a great time other than the few frustrations. Sorry this is so long, thanks for making it all the way though and I look forward to your advice and help,

Brett

It sounds like none of your operating rods fit the new combination you have built - true? Are you doing the test with the action outside of the stock? If yes then I suspect your rod is not properly bent. It is highly unlikely you can hand bend it to shape and its probably best to get it to someone like Jim Schwartz. I suspect you have tried this op rod on your other actions, if so did you get the same response? If yes then I believe there is something wrong with the bends. It strikes me unusual that the others would work on other actions and not this one. I trust you checked the tab raceway on the side of the receiver to make certain there is no damage that is not allowing it to travel freely.

Regarding the stock, I have had that happen to me before. I have found (depending on the humidity) that a stock that has not had an action in it for quite some time will swell and cause the latch problem that you are describing. My recommendation would be to initially find a trigger guard that has wear to the lugs and see if it will lock. Once the action is in the rifle for awhile and the humidity stabilizes you will most likely find that the new guard will now lock with decent force. I would resist taking wood off the bottom of the stock until last resort. If it has indeed swelled due to humidity then when you take wood out you will find it will be sloppy once compressed and dry. Not a good situation.

Regarding the follower, I have put the nose piece into its groove and taken a decent rubber hammer and wacked on the back end. Never had a problem putting one together but I have only done 2 or 3. I fooled around a lot the first time until I "pre-started" the process but putting the narrow end in first.

Hope this is some help. I have been in the same situation a time or two myself. Good luck

Brett - it appears that there is to much wood for the lock up - I recall an article quoting Art Tuttle that he rejected receivers every week due to the receiver cracking from to much force from closing. Suggest you get a small metal plate attach sand paper to it and sand the stock on the 10 degree flats- be careful not to change the angle and count your strokes say 10 or 15 per side. Note your progress by installing the trigger group back in stock with upper present and observe the distance from the trigger guard tip to the latching point- when you have a distance approximating the picture on page 205 of Kuhnhausen you should be good - I would allow a little more distance for wood compression

Thanks for the help so far, I've done some more troubleshooting:

I know I do not have an op-rod problem. My NIW rod works fine in another rifle, passes the tilt test with flying colors. I tried a fourth op-rod in my new rifle set up and still have the same problem. I removed the gas cylinder and front hand guard but still have the friction build up. I can also visually confirm the lower band is not rubbing on the op-rod tube as well. The only two points that can be grinding the op-rod to a halt are the saddle/barrel contact and the tab/track area. I believe the problem is in the op-rod track. A good rifle I’m comparing allows the op-rod a very small “wiggle” the entire length of track, but my new build only does for some of it. As it gets to the last ½” (about where the end of the handle first approaches the release cut away) friction increases and any play or wobble is gone. However, the op-rod track looks, feels and sounds flawless. There is some very slight wear to the Parkerization from when the receiver was previously shot after the 12-65 rebuild. There are no areas in the finish wear that are abnormal, it is quite even. The wear is so slight it still has the “chatter” wear marks about every 1/8” you see before it completely wears the finish off smooth. All 4 op-rods have the same problem, so I don’t think it’s a tab issue. I’ve gauged as much as of the channel as I could but found nothing out of the ordinary or different from my sample rifle. So now I’m stuck and out of ideas. I still need some help here.

The stock has been stored in air-conditioning for at least 3 years, but from what I understand in a storage unit for who knows how long before that. It is likely swollen from humidity. Does it remain in a swollen state even if taken out of the humidity? It is not tight side to side (when sliding the receiver into the stock), just latching in the trigger group. Using a worn in trigger group gives a funny result: It first gets tight about ¼” past the end of the trigger. It takes a good amount of pressure to get it to just about halfway down the trigger, then it suddenly POPS! into place. The same trigger group doesn’t do that with other stocks. I guess it’s just the flats on the trigger guard lugs finally coming into contact and relieving the high pressure. I’ll try Ernie’s advice and try the worn group in the stock for a while to build some more compression then move to wood removal as a worst case.

Now the poor follower. I must apologize to the group, I think I’ve taken a perfectly good USGI part out of the supply system. Even with a rubber hammer and wood blocks I still managed to bend the blasted thing. The good news is I know where to hit and it barely takes any force. Place the hook in the hole and the slide portion will not quite be in the groove. A small nip will be protruding up from the hook end. Give this a light tap and it snaps the slide portion into the groove while keeping the hook engaged. The hammer blow should be in the direction of the length of the follower, like you were going to hammer a bullet into the barrel. I was hitting about 45 degrees off from that like the ordnance pictures show. It’s together now but the bend causes a bit of binding on the follower and it doesn’t slide freely.

Thanks again and looking forward to figuring out this receiver problem,

Brett

Brett, i'm not sure but i think that your niw barrel would have a short chamber and would need to be reamed to headspace bolt, not wear the back of the bolt lugs down to make it headspace. hope someone else will help out here kurt

make very sure that your barrel is timed perfect, if it is off more than a couple degrees with the gas cyl in place your op rod will bind on the way back, with the tab on the op rod being new it could be on the high (fat) side of the specs and you might have a tight channel. i would check barrel again for timing, being your first time it's not hard to be off a little

I would also recommend checking the index of the barrel. I had a rifle fail the tilt test and on close examination, the inside hump of the op rod was hitting the side of the sight base as it came rearwards.

Thanks Kurt. I don't think I removed too much off the lugs during lapping but I guess I won't know for some time! Has anyone installed a NIW USGI barrel that headspaced without finish reaming?

When I installed the barrel I was about 30 minutes off from parallel on the gauges, but I will remeasure if all else fails. However, I do not think it is a barrel alignment problem. Even with the gas cylinder and front hand guard off, I still have the friction.

Thanks,

Brett

badger ordnance alignment gauges how did you align with rulers or levels

if you used a machinists level

L. S. Starrett Catalog

you can achieve alignment better than the garand spec which is +/- 20 minutes = 0.66 degrees

the level graduations are 0.005" per 12 inches

this yields an alignment angle of 0.0004 degrees

if your alignment is correct and

your op-rod passes the tilt test on other rifles

but binds on the new rifle I would suspect the receiver

I would measure with shim stock the width of the guide stud track to see if it is uniform

Also per Kuhnhausen p 97

"the 15 deg rotational draw should not be exceded "

when you say 7 O'clock are you indicating that you were 30 deg off alignment?

i am no gunsmith, but i do my own work. i have done 3 niw barrels and had to finish ream to headspace the bolts i wanted to use. reaming does take out a few thous. allowing the round to move forward in the chamber giving the base of the case a little more support, by not reaming you are pushing the round back leaving more of the base unsupported (thats the way i see it but again i am not a gun smith) GOT TO ASK GUS FISHER KURT

Kurt, good inputs, thanks. I will buy a reamer.

Mark,

I used a bubble level and the Badger Ord gauges. I don’t have a $200 machinist’s level, but a metal 3” level that is quality enough for the job. I remeasured the alignment this morning. The bubbles were not “dead nuts” to each other. Using the rear gauge as a baseline, I had to raise an edge of the level with a .007 feeler gauge on the front gauge. The gauge is 3” long. I did the trig and .007” over 3” is 8.02 minutes (the barrel is under indexed). So I should be well within index tolerances. Also, I have at least .008” clearance between the inside rear of the hump and rear sight base (from Dan’s post above). I know Kuhnhausen says do not exceed 15 degrees hand tight, but the McKee book (pg 63) looks for 7 to 8 o’clock (30-60 degrees) calling 7:30 (45 degrees) ideal. A significant departure from Kuhnhausen! A discussion on this topic a few months ago had the consensus that 60 degrees was too much but I think under 45 was workable.

I feel I can confidently rule these things out: Barrel indexing, gas cylinder, op-rod, lower band, front hand guard.

My problem is this barreled receiver combination and any op-rod placed in it (4 so far now). I gauged the track channel and it specs out fine. Friction occurs during the last half inch of travel when opening the op-rod. I cycled it out in bright sun today and found what I think may be the biggest point of friction: the forward most part of the receiver. It looks like the bottom of the op-rod handle (the thin side) is bearing down on the flat surface beneath it just above the receiver pin/receiver drawing number area. I am now thinking perhaps the barrel is indexed correctly but perhaps TILTED down, causing the op rod to bind at the saddle/barrel area and op rod handle as it gets fully retracted.

And now the rest of the story—the shop press I used had the center of the press about 5” away from the edge of the bench. This did not allow me to center the press on the middle of the barrel vise and still have clearance off the bench to spin the receiver wrench. This caused me to pull the barrel vice out (towards me) until I had enough clearance to spin the wrench. When the press clamped down on the vice there were more pressure on the rear (far side) of the barrel vice, causing the vice & barrel to tilt about 5 degrees muzzle low. I knew this was not ideal but had no other option at the shop. I was careful when applying force to the receiver knowing I couldn’t pull the wrench perpendicular to the floor but had to be perpendicular to the barrel. I was careful and deliberate. The two other receivers I barreled that day in the same manner both pass the tilt test fine (they did not require as much torque, however).

Has anyone heard of the barrel being tilted down (muzzle low) during assembly and then this type of op-rod problem occurring? It's what is making the most sense to me right now, but I’m just amazed that the barrel would have gotten bent that much.

Thanks to all who have help so far. Gus, Roland, Dean, Ted or any other full-time smiths care to opine?

Thanks, Brett

All right guys, I’ve put by “bad” barreled receiver and a good one on a true surface (scrap piece of polished granite) and measured just abut every way I could to determine any barrel “down tilt.” To me it seems the best way is have a barreled receiver sitting on the granite with the points of contact the bottom of the front receiver legs and the outside diameter of the muzzle. This gives three stable points of contact. I then measured the height of the receiver heel off the granite, both were 2.5 inches. If my bad combination had a down tilted barrel, I would expect the receiver heel to be lower to the surface than a good barreled receiver would. I also had the receiver sit on all four legs and measured the height of the muzzle off the granite, both were 3 5/16.” So over a distance between 25-28 inches, both were well within a 1/16” of each other (0.14 degree). Does anyone know a better way to measure? I’m hoping now that I didn’t tilt the barrel, but I’m still at a loss for where my problem is.

Thanks,

Brett

Hhttp://img.photobucket.com/albums/v321/Parker1144/dcp_1990.jpg?t=1236898793
Here's a pic of the machinists level I use

I’ve spent so much time on this barreled receiver measuring and comparing with others and I still see nothing wrong. I’m pretty sure the barrel is not bent as I was guessing previously; it parallels all my other barreled receivers. I guess I’m just going to have to send it off to a professional smith to work on. I imagine they are hesitant to speculate on what could be wrong on a forum.

Thanks to the guys who provided ideas.

Brett

Trigger housing fitting:
http://www.trfindley.com/pgtgfix.html

Brett,

From what point on the receiver did you use to align the barrel? If it wasn't the flat milled out section under the rear sight, that could well be a problem. The top of the front ring of the receiver is NOT the place to put a level or parallel bars.

I've found the very best way to align the receiver is to use a piece of 1/2' or better still 3/4" square stock about two inches long, that has been precision ground on two opposing sides. You lay that block where the rear sight base sits with a ground side down, use a angle finder that is graduated in every degree of 360 degrees and get a reading off that. Then put the angle finder on the gas cylinder with the front sight taken off. (If there's ding on the top of the cylinder there, you have to clear it with a fine file so you don't get a false reading.) There should be no more than one degree difference between the front and rear for a standard barrel. For a NM barrel, there should be 1/2 degree or less.

If after ensuring the barrel alignment is right and the op rod still doesn't slide freely, that isn't all that uncommon with M1 op rods. Many, MANY of them had to be hand bent to work correctly. If you don't know how to do that, then I suggest you send the op rod to Jim Schwarts and have him bend it to the gage.

Gus,

I used the Badger Ordnance gauges from Brownells. I aligned the barreled receiver with a very tight NIW gas cylinder (no burrs) and using the rear sight flat. I measured the barrel alignment multiple times and am confident it is under 8 minutes from vertical. The NIW op rod passes the tilt test fine in other barreled receivers, but other op-rods (4 so far) fail the tilt test in this particular barreled receiver. So I can rule the op rod out and I'm confident I can rule out barrel rotational alignment, although there may be some less common barrel alignment problem?

Thanks for chiming in,

Brett

Brett did you use a different gas cylinder to align the barrel rather than the one you wound up using?

If you are sure your barrel is indexed properly and you have tried muliple rods....I would try a different (perhaps used) gas cylinder.

Gus,

I used the same gas cylinder to align the barrel. No parts swapping.

DD,

The binding happens when a gas cylinder is not even installed.

With just an op-rod (all rods I've tried), receiver and barrel I have the op-rod friction the last half inch of travel when opening. It binds on the barrel bottom/op rod saddle, the op rod handle/forward edge of receiver guide rail and I think in the rear near the tab/receiver guide rail.

Besides barrel rotational indexing is there another type of barrel misalignment I can check for?

Thanks,

Brett

What happens when you use a gas cylinder? The gas cylinder holds the tip end of the rod in the proper position and the tab holds the rear end. Also, when you have a new rod with a new tip and a new gas cylinder there is very little clearance between the rod tip and the cylinder. If everthing is not just right, the tip can bind in the cylinder.

The problem is the exact same whether I have a gas cylinder installed or not. The op-rod does not bind on the cylinder in any way. I tried it without the cylinder installed to assure that it was not a cylinder problem. The op-rod still binds in the same place with the same force regardless if a cylinder is installed or not.

Thanks,

Brett

If the rod binds without the cylinder on then it must be the op. rod tab binding in the slot.
I can't help myself....is the trigger group latched in when you are having the bind? Sorry, I just had to ask.

move along, nothing to see here

Dan

Just an ignorant thought to throw out here but is there any chance the receiver has a distortion or twist between the front and back? That could explain the binding and the strange pop putting that second trigger group in (at least in my mind that is) :)

Good luck

Dan

DD,

No trigger group. Just a barrel, receiver, op-rod and too much friction.

Dan,

Some type of odd receiver problem is all I can think of and I'm at a loss to try and figure it out anymore. I'm going to send it off to a smith.

Thanks for the help everyone.

Brett

Brett

So as I understand it the receiver guide stud is binding in the receiver track

this occurs at the front of the receiver?

A op-rod will travel farther forward without a bolt installed

so the binding may be a result the op-rod running forward of its normal stop position with out the bolt

see if the friction is the same with a bolt installed

also dyechem can be used to indicate the interference

****M LAYOUT FLUID at Brownells

Mark,

The friction is when the op rod is in its last half inch of travel to the REAR. There is no friction/binding previous to this. Friction is the same with or without a bolt installed.

I don't know if all the binding is coming from the receiver guide stud. I do know the op-rod saddle/bottom of the barrel are binding, the bottom of the op rod handle at the forward part of the receiver is binding and I think the third point comes from the op rod tab.

It is like the barrel is tilted down: This causes the saddle to hit the barrel, the tab to ride high the the channel and the bottom of the op rod handle/forward edge of receiver to be the fulcrum/pivot point.

I think Dan is correct-the problem seems to have been narrowed down to the rec'r. You say you used a breaker bar and a great deal of torque. I'm wondering if the rec'r wrench may have been twisting on the rails!

Have you re-checked the barrel index using a bubble level rather than your indexing fixture? Also try a couple different gas cylinders when using the bubble level.

Gents, if the barrel is indexed properly and there is no obvious damage or twisting of the receiver, then the op rod is just going to have to be re-bent and Jim Schwartz does that very well.

When I was working on batches of Navy Garands, I found a general rule of thumb on how op rods fit. Out of 10 rifles, two or three worked in most rifles, three to four worked in some other rifles, one to two only worked in a couple rifles and the last one or two only worked in the rifle it was in. This is due to tolerance stack up, wear and how the rods were adjusted to the receiver during assembly or rebuild.

Gus--Did military armorors require that a service rifle pass the tilt test? TIA H

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Homer03

Gus--Did military armorors require that a service rifle pass the tilt test? TIA H

---

A whole lot depends on who you talk to. Generally speaking, no they didn't use that as part of the inspection procedure. If an op rod really hung up, they normally just replaced it. Most standard armorers didn't know how to bend an op rod that well.

Gus,

Did you ever see cases inverse to that--a barreled receiver that was very picky to the op-rod that fits? In other words, only 1 of 10 op-rods woked in that barreled receiver versus an op-rod that only worked in 1 of 10 receivers? I know it sounds the same, but there is a difference. In my case I've tried 4 op rods and all bind at the same point. All 4 op-rods work fine in other barreled recievers. I worry that I'll send the op-rod to Jim and there is nothing wrong with it because it works fine in my other rifles. I do think that tolerance stacking my be a contributing factor with the NIW barrel and op-rod.

DD,

I used a bubble level on the index fixture.

Homer,

That may be the case (I hope not!) but the receiver holds straight edges just fine, I cannot see any distortion in it.

Thanks,

Brett

I'm realy stretching here....Don't use your indexing fixture. Just use your bubble level on the flat behind the rear sight and the flat on the gas cylinder. If it checks correct, turn the level around 180 degrees and check again. Maybe your level is off. Then try another gas cylinder and re-check index.

Gents,

Aren’t the receiver ends of M1 barrels cylindrical with the same OD on the bottom? If so, and the bore is aligned perpendicular to the receiver face, then it should not matter if barrel index is in error IF the gas cylinder is not installed. It is obviously a whole different story with the gas cylinder correctly installed.

I have op rod binding even without a gas cylinder. Obviously an op rod can bind much easier without a gas cylinder to keep it in position, but it is possible to do a tilt test without a gas cylinder installed. This barreled receiver fails the tilt test in the same manner/position with 4 different rods with or without a gas cylinder.

DD, I've put everything away for the weekend and can't measure it again.

Thanks,

Brett

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Brett

Gus,

Did you ever see cases inverse to that--a barreled receiver that was very picky to the op-rod that fits? In other words, only 1 of 10 op-rods woked in that barreled receiver versus an op-rod that only worked in 1 of 10 receivers? I know it sounds the same, but there is a difference. In my case I've tried 4 op rods and all bind at the same point. All 4 op-rods work fine in other barreled recievers. I worry that I'll send the op-rod to Jim and there is nothing wrong with it because it works fine in my other rifles. I do think that tolerance stacking my be a contributing factor with the NIW barrel and op-rod.

Brett

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Yes, I've seen that happen very infrequently as well, ESPECIALLY with Medium Heavy and Heavy Barrels because the diameter of the barrel at the breech was large enough that op rods wouldn't fit without major bending and/or relieving some of the rounded section of the "saddle" of the op rod.

Before we go further, I just remembered something I have only run into on a couple occasions over the years. That's where the internal diameter of the hole in the gas cylinder was not straight or was dinged or bent inward. One one cylinder I ran across this on, you could not tell it was dinged or bent by looking inside it. Tony Pucci told me he has about a dozen to two dozen gas cylinders like this. With the gas cylinder off the barrel, try pushing the op rod all the way in and out of the cylinder to see if the piston is binding inside the cylinder. If that is happening, then I most strongly suggest you get a replacement cylinder as fixing a cylinder like that is very time consuming and most often may not work.

What usually causes the problem you are having with the op rod is the rear portion of the op rod is bent or twisted, but since four other op rods aren't working as well, that may not be the case. (This is something that is a REAL BEAR to try to analyse without seeing the barreled receiver and op rods in hand.) I'm having an extremely difficult time trying to explain the second thing, so please bear with me. I've seen a very, very few barrels and gas cylinders that required the op rod to be specially bent to clear the breech of the barrel. It might take me hours to try to describe how to do it and even then, you may not get the hang of it. Bending op rods is one of the, if not the most difficult jobs to do on the Garand. I have run across three op rods that I could not get properly bent to fit Garands over the years even AFTER having them checked on a real, G.I. op rod gage the folks on the Navy Van used.

So, what I suggest you do is take the op rod from the other four rifles that fits this "problem" barreled receiver the best AND the op rod that you are trying to fit to this rifle and get a bottle of ****m Layout Blue. You may be able to get it locally from a machinist supply store, but here's a link to the product:

****M LAYOUT FLUID at Brownells

Mark the op rod you are trying to fit so you know and can later identify it from the other four rods. ****m the whole curved section of the saddle of the op rod that goes around the barrel on both op rods. Then put the gas cylinder back on the barrel and try running both op rods all the way back and forward a few times to see if and how hard the op rod saddles are rubbing on the barrel. If the rod you want to fit is rubbing real hard there, you can use a half round file or a grinding stone and a sanding cartridge role to clear the rubs where it wore off the ****m blue. After clearing a little, re blue the area with ****m and try again. If it is easier to move, then you are on the right track. If it is not easier to move, then the op rod will have to be rebent or replaced. If it is easier to move, then I continue on with bluing and then relieving the op rod until it moves freely. (The op rod you are not trying to fit is meant to be a "base line control" to see how you are progressing when relieving the rod you are trying to fit.) You can use acetone to get the ****m off the op rods when you are done. Be careful about getting it on your clothes as it almost NEVER comes out of your clothes. After cleaning off the rod, cold blue or reparkerize it.

Anway, that's how I would try to fix it.

PS. The word filter obviously doesn't like the word.....D......yke even though in this case it is only part of another word.

Good inputs. Good enough to confirm to me I need to send this to a pro to diagnose and fix. If you'd like to see it in person, you can email me. Otherwise I'll find a 'smith in the back of the CGO.

Thanks again for all the help from everyone. CUSP is not dead!

Enjoy the rest of your Sunday,

Brett

Just my 2 cents worth, but i've used a magnetic level on a 1" size block in the rear sight flat, coupled with the same level on the front sight pad for bbl alignment. you can quickly chk your installation w/o removing anything. i always finish ream w/pull thru reamer. this combo has worked perfectly for the last 12 garand and 14's that i've done. quite a few replacement stocks have too much wood to close correctly (mostly aftermarket). try another stock that you know closes w/new combo.

Something that's been bothering me since the begining of this thread. Have you measured the diameter of the barrel just ahead of the receiver to see if it was machined oversized? Maybe the oprod saddle is binding there?

Ralfus;

I was thinking the same thing!!! I recently built my first M1D, from a CMP Racker, and a year or two of parts accumulation... ...I always wanted to machine on a M1D barrel block/mount and it was fun, and a good learning experience...

Getting back to Brett's issue, what caught my eye was the aftermarket Numrich M1D barrel block, when crush-fit, was oversize right where Brett is having his oprod/binding...I machined the block down till it was even with the barrel shank joint and the rifle then easily passed the tilt test....I'd say the tolerances there (oprod/barrel shank) are very small, judging by how many used takeoff USGI barrels are worn shiny right there...

Brett, I would second Ralfus' idea and if you have any extra USGI barrels laying around, I'd break them out and just do some precise measuring...Your NIW barrel might be a "frog's fur" thick...

218bee