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Hi all,
Just been thinking on the way that the MLE's and Shortened Range Pattern rifles were bedded in the forend. Does anyone have any info on how this was done or any tricks that were used?
There is a lot of info out there on the No1 and No4 rifles but don't ever really hear much on these rifles.
Just thought it might be a good topic to have a yak about.
Similar methods I think.
I did have some info on this, but the last crash wiped it and I have not got around to looking up those files.
However, if you wish to do a trove search for A.S. Spencer, you might find it yourself.
While on the subject of shortened LLE's, I was just re-reading C.H Cromacks history of the NRA of NSW, 1860 to 1956, in 1933/34 just after the changover from the LLE to SMLE and shortened range pattern rifles, an analysis of possibles shot at that years Kings Prize, made interesting reading.
There were 297 possibles scored, with 116 short cut downs, 66 short H barrels, 6 short light barrels and 6 long rifle.
60% of the possibles were scored with the Long Rifle cut down, 34% with the short H barrel, 3% with the short light barrel and 3% with the long barrel.
I guess the LLE barrel cut down, was just that bit stiffer than the H barrel.
That's very interesting Mr Muffett!
I have a range pattern fore-end, just waiting for the right sported job to come along. :-)
muffett, did the author of the analysis correct the percentages to take into account the numbers of each type of rifle used? if 80% of the field used range pattern MLE's and only 10% H barrelled SMLE's then it changes the way you read the number of possible's considerably.
that being said, either way it makes range pattern MLE's more interesting to me.
As the author has been dead for a great many years, I can't ask him, but there were 116 short cut downs accounting for 60% of possibles, compared to 66 SMLE H rifles accounting for 34%
if i have read it right this time, the percentage of possibles shot by each type of rifle equates nearly perfectly with the percentage of each type of rifle present.
Yes I am interested as well as I have two of them both BSA's.
One has a Parker Hale PH5a on it and a heavy barrel fitted.
The other has a Central target sight on it and a mint heavy 51 lithgow barrel.
The one with the Central on it is more interesting to me because it has Hooton & Jones
engraved on the charger bridge?? Don't know much about them.
It had been badly butchered in the forend and was very loose all over. I replaced the draws and set it up like a No1 with a small bearing pad on the knox form and under barrel contact running from the Mid band to the end of the forend with a tight fit of the nose cap. It shoots alright ,1 -1/2 5 shot groups at 100.
As it had already been messed with there was nothing to loose and it came out a sweet
shooting rifle. By far my favorite of my LE's.
I would like to know more about these range pattern rifles, they are great shooters!
If my memory serves me correctly, the Nodes and Anti Nodes are different positions between the shortened LLE barrel and the SMLE H barrel also, 6 nodes in the LLE and 8 in the SMLE H.
I suppose I could dig out a couple of each and do some measuring.
Your correct Muffet from Sweets Competitive Rifle Shooting enlarged 3rd edition I have the SMLE H Barrel has 8 nodes and 7 Anti-nodes
I have 5 of the New Zealand cut down/MLE rifles(that is where they came from) and one Australian (that one came with a Forend modified to fit a WWII combat central sight) .
4 are bedded with the barrel in contact with the stock at the 6'0clock position most of the way to the muzzle. A couple of them look like the front band was peened onto the barrel, and then lapped on the inside to get a good fit. A couple have front bands that were relived so they do not make contact (2/4).
Two of the rifles show signs that the middle band had packing of some sort. One is clearly asbestos, the other has now crumbled but appeared to be some sort of rubber/fiber gasket material. The one that had a gasket fitted at the rear band also showed signs of the same kind of packing at the front band.
One with a commercial Medford barrel that has a center node contact and free floated every where else. That one also has the front band that is opened up so it makes no contact with the barrel at any point.
The other one fitted with a packed middle band has the forend opened up from that point forward, the barrel makes no contact with either the front band or the wood forward of the middle band.
All of the riles seem to have standard action bedding, with the barrel reinforce being in contact with the barrel.
The only caveat is 5 of the 6 rifles were purchased from Robert Tiffin of Christchurch, and there is some evidence to indicate he would replace post 1898 actions with pre 1898 actions to allow for dealer free exports in the late 1990s. As such I am not sure which are original and which might be put-togethers.
I MUST BE BORED......Attachment 77870
Robbie was not the only one there were a couple of guys doing this about 10 or so years ago & they drove the price up for Long Lees here, when they stopped the price fell by at least half, the worst thing about it is they made a lot of grey areas when it comes to any doing any research on the markings but for the most part if you have a butt tang marking C14 it should be a 1896 MLE Mk1, if a E14 mark then for the most part should be a MLM MkII & if marked 1901on the tang then it should be a MLE MK1* & from what we have seen from good examples left a 1901 BSAQuote:
Originally Posted by Frederick303
Thanks for the replies gents. This gives me a bit to go on. My thinking is that I will stay away from having the barrel bands touching the barrel. My reasoning is that I can always add packing in if I need it.
It is interesting with the barrel band packing though. Im trying to figure out how to post a couple of photos from my iPhone of the barrel bands from my BSA commercial CLLE. It has grooves machined into the top of them to allow them to be packed with asbestos back in times gone by. It is a beautiful rifle!
The barrel band and nose cap with asbestos packing were patented by BSA and were marketed in their catalog as an accessory for target shooting.