Printable View
I am looking to buy a Carcano rifle that is an early WW2 Carcano rifle. I was wondering what should I be looking for on the rifle and what markings should it have to still be an axis regime rifle? Another question I have is how readily avaliable is the ammunition?
So what are you specifically looking to represent? Every Carcano variant was pretty much used during WWII, and there are quite a few different variants. Overall they didn't really mark the rifles with any particularly special markings when the government changed. Only major difference was after 1929 to 1943, they started using Roman numerals for the date (just add the Roman numeral to 1929 to figure out the year of production).
Ammo can be difficult. There is two main calibers, 6.5x52 and 7.35x51. 6.5x52 can be found but it can be difficult. 7.35x51 is very difficult to find, most people who shoot it have to custom make the bullets and ammo. Most are in 6.5x52 as the few made in 7.35x51 were abandoned (sent to Reserves or even Finland) due to the desire to keep the ammunition standard during WWII.
This is a good link with a list of the models. Very basic information wise, but it can help you figure out which model you are specifically looking for.
Carcano Identification: A Quick and Dirty Guide for Variations : : CRsenal
Hmm, I guess what i was really asking was what model of the rifle was most used by Italian forces during the time they were fighting against the allies?
You should look for the 91/38 variants or the cavalry moschetto (folded bayonet), especially in 6,5x52. 7,35 was issued only in limited numbers.
The long rifle was also very much in use, but less in front-line units.
If you want to reload, you should look for old military bullets. Here in Italy you still find them, but they're getting rare.
Hornady has a .268 160 grs. bullet perfectly suiting, but first check your bore. Some Carcanos have been tinkered with and have tighter bores (.264).
Probally the best couple options for that would be the M38s, and the M91/24. As mentioned they did use pretty much every version in WWII, none of it was really thrown out, but the most recent production rifles were the M38s and those were intended to be the main pattern of rifle until they found having a adjustable sight was a advantage and they started making the M41s (which those didn't see much service, most are in mint shape because of that).
As others have already covered, you have a wide range of Carcanos to choose from. That is, if you can find one that hasn't been "Bubba'd". I have owned just about every model. Favorite was a 38 in 7.35. This was 40 years ago when you could still get surplus ammo on the cheap. If you are going to shoot much...get into reloading. I would prefer a 91/38 in 6.5. STAY AWAY from the 8mm conversions!
Definitely. The action has not been designed for the high pressures of the German ammo.
I'll make sure to stay away from it!
Wow...been here a long time and this is my first message.....amazing I kept my mouth shut for so long.Quote:
Originally Posted by Ovidio
I have two and am in the process of working up loads for them. Partizan makes factory ammo....going to cost you about $2 per bang. But that gives you some good re-loadable brass.....Norma also makes brass for it....but like most of their stuff it is a bit spendy....good but spendy.
The Hornady bullets are fantastic....the correct profile and correct size if the gun is in "good" shape. Mine really came alive with hand loading. I went from a basket ball group at 100 to a fist sized group with a bullet that did not bounce its way down the bore....also had some real key holes with the partizan ammo.
They are real fun guns to shoot (oops all of this is for 6.5) very lite recoil....just a pleasure. The hornady bullets are also a bit spendy....but I got the costs down to about $.70 per shot.
The rifles are one of the few "good deals" left in the surplus world....and are also fun to shoot.....find a good one and give it a try.
Privi 6.5 is only costing me about $16 a box. I do some shopping around it you're paying $40.
I have over 80 Carcanos and have never seen a .264 groove bore . Just how would you "tinker" with one to shrink it ? Wash it in hot water ? The early rifles had grooves as deep as .270 , they did tighten them up to close to .266 by the M-41 . The problem with the big Hornady bullet is to the groove size but the land , and the fact the bullet is made wrong . Way too thick a jacket . With a tight land the gain twist guns will have trouble engraving the bullet jacket as it goes down the bore and the twist changes . Way to much drag and the pressure goes up . With the tight groove .266 rifles with tight lands also , there is just not enough hole to push a bullet that has such a thick jacket that will not deform enough . They can be found with bore hole combinations that can work with the .268 bullet , or not . Hornady sells a good .264 160 round nose for the 6.5mm's and a .300 128 for the 7.35mm's . 6.5mm cases can be used for both . Also there is nothing wrong with a 8mm one [ in good shape and put together correctly other that the recoil ] as the Carcano action is a large ring with just as good as steel as the K-98k and two large front locking lugs .
They were rebarreled in Italy at some point, by a company selling them. I'll have to check for the name of that company, but here in Italy the problem is very well known and dreaded.
---------- Post added at 01:31 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:27 PM ----------
I found the info. It was a company called Piscetta. They rebarreled with .264, 6 grooves barrels.
Just be aware that the danger is real.
They keep popping up here.
So, no hot water needed, standard procedure!
I have several rebarreled Carcanos in several different calibers .I do not try and shoot Carcano military [or mil spec ] ammo in them . They are not Military Carcanos any more , they are now different . Just like any military rifle rebarreled to a different caliber .
The problem is, apparently, that these rifles don't have particular markings. It's a job of the early seventies if I remember well, not properly done. There have been a few accidents here with these rifles.
A rebarrel should be easy to see since all the original military markings were on the barrel . A barrel with out them should stand out . I could see where it would be a problem as I would not want to fire original .266 dia long round nose military bullets in a .264 barrel .
Many people don't really know their way around a milsurp rifle, so they end up with something like this and get hurt or damage the rifle. Especially because the Carcanos were quite popular rifles for hunters after the war, so they have been bought by hunters more than by collectors.
I will make some further research about markings, because I guess there has been some foul play around these rifles.
Perhaps wash it with hot water and put it in the dryer.....I did that to one of the wifes sweaters....that was a very dangerous mistake.....and she really went into an over pressure condition.Quote:
Originally Posted by bob q
I have had great luck with Hornady's bullets....I only have two rifles...well carbines really, so not the depth you have....but they really like them. No signs on anything going wrong...no over pressure signs, but I do load all my old guns on the soft side....so I don't know....267 fits my two like they got made for it....and they shoot it just amazing.
One of mine has a mis matched bolt....rifle bolt, the other is correct. I do really like the carcano and enjoy shooting it....not sure if it is the odd duck nature of the rifle, the bad rep the gun has in general or what....I also really like my French firearms as well.....I go for the underdog I guess.
I think I have a few pics of them out there....do you have any photos of your that you can share.....I love seeing them.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c5...psc14a49ab.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c5...psa0891b4d.jpg
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c5...ps9965099b.jpg
---------- Post added at 08:22 AM ---------- Previous post was at 08:19 AM ----------
Forgot the bolt pic
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c5...psae8b5031.jpg
Between rain this weekend did a little more shootin....with the Hornady 267 it really came alive....I wish I would have saved the "before" target but it was horrid.....think one on paper if I was lucky....with the reloads I am very happy.....had to use some kentucky windage as the site is....well what it is.
When I get home tonight I will take some photos.
Hey guys, I was in my gunshop on a weekly run and they just so happened to have two carcanos for sale some fella brought in one was a 38 and the other a M41. The 38 was chopped and they were both selling for 150 bucks I picked the M41 because it was in mint condition despite a bore that is pitted with dirt in it. Needs a recrown as well rust ate her up. I could post if you are interested. It looked like they had been in a basement or something just moist air on them till they came into the shop.
I would love to see them.....give them a try with the correct sized bullets. They really are good little rifles that I think get a bad rap. Yea they are a little "clunky" but they are on par with other rifles of that era and I think you will find it will shoot as well as like one in shape.
Would still love to see the collection of 80....I understand some are shy about putting pics on the net, but you already said you have that many....so the cat is a bit out of the bag.
These are just guns that get so little love....I would love to see people saying that this is just a good all around rifle, and pimp some pics of their treasures.....I only have one more....I will try to get a pic of my other one here soon....nothing but rain so perhaps tonight.