http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/04/07/breaking-civilian-marksmanship-program-receive-86000-m1-garand-rifles-philippines/
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http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2017/04/07/breaking-civilian-marksmanship-program-receive-86000-m1-garand-rifles-philippines/
Lots of "if" "maybe" and "hopefully" but if so it'd be great for people who missed out or haven't had a chance to get one yet. I've heard some rumors about this for a bit, Mark Johnson commenting and the fact the Phillipines seems ready to send these guns homes makes me hope it is happening, though isn't that 86k number considered quite generous? Also, rumor was a lot of these guns were rough and may be parts only. Still happy to hear this though, more Garands to go around is always good. I was on the fence about adding another but eventually passed on doing so, maybe in a few years if these guns show up I can revisit that. Now if only some ammo would come around...
Here's the link... BREAKING: Civilian Marksmanship Program May Receive 86,000 M1 Garand Rifles from the Philippines - The Firearm BlogThe Firearm Blog
Yes, lots of hopeful but nothing concrete. The first statement is "May receive"... It would be nice for you guys though. I'd love to see the serial number blocks.
I have visited the Philippines many times - its a hot humid tropical country and preventive maintenance is pretty much unknown, also given the fact that they were American guns that cost the Philippines nothing My personal opinion is that they are pretty much junk.
Maybe junk, maybe not, won't know if or until they return.
CMP Forums - View Single Post - 86,000 Garands from Phillippines headed to CMP
CMP Forums - View Single Post - 86,000 Philippines Garands come home?
Not a chance that a gas trap may be in that early bunch, eh???
The CMP may have a few "hot and heavy" auctions, if so.
Early parts will help restorers for sure.
from the above link
"- Finally, on the actual topic of the PI Garands, the transfer of these rifles is in the works. The blog also referenced here is speculating as much as the other Facebook pages, even cross-posting info.
As those who have worked similar FMS-type deals/loans are painfully aware, there is alot of red-tape/logistics to work through, which is why there has been little to no detailed information and why it may take some time to finally get these shipped over, evaluated and graded for sale.
I have a very good buddy who buys out of PI all of the time. Prices always change after the deal is sign and done. Nothing ever shipped on time and lots of interesting excuses. He thinks zero Garands coming this way, and nothing at all coming for free. We will have to wait and see, but the longer the wait is, the less likely anything shows up. Most of the CMP returns have some sort of US Army delivery to the foreign country. The Korean Garand deal involved a missle defense system from the USA. Complex deal Hillary nixed. But off topic to say the least. As for the PI Garands, wait and see.
There is no payment involved. In order for CMP to get these rifles they must first be returned to the U.S. Army as they originally were LOANED to the Philippines as foreign aid under a MAP. The Army can then turn the rifles over to the CMP. If the rifles had been purchased from the U.S. then CMP would never see them.
Did you not read the thread? This the link first posted and then again in post 3, dated 7 Apr?Quote:
Originally Posted by philb
Go back and re-read my post. My bright buddy doubts this happens. I have no idea. I do know the CMP got Garands out of Uruguay in a complex deal that involved re-arming their Army. I do know the Korean deal involves a anti-rocket defense system. I doubt the PI gives anything up without something in return. That is how business is done in that part of the world. Mind you, the CMP is not involved at all. The US Dept. of Defense runs these deals. These are complex deals and usually take a long time to get to a conclusion. Again, wait and see.
"The CMP is not involved..."
Sure they are. If there are any costs involved, they pay them. The Army could not care less about 60-year old rifles that have been neglected, they only want them back for CMP.
Am I thinking correctly that If the Army is the owner, AND CMP actually gets them, would they need to have "Import markings"?
No.
To be import marked they would have to be sold to an importer and sold off commercially.
Not imported. Army property and simply returned to US hands. The Army was paying for shipping on past deals and will likely to do if the PI deal happens.
Word is the CMP is waiting for the shipping of the rifles from the PI's. The army will ship them but CMP pays the army back for the shipping. They are basically ready to ship just have to be loaded on board ship heading here. Wonder if they will unload on the west coast and ship by train or bring them through the canal and up into Savannah again like all the other shipments have been. Then trucked to Anniston. CMP has stated if they have them soon they will be offering them by early 2018. The other word is that Century is waiting for the OK from the State Department to bring in the 89,000 M1's from Korea. Wonder if they will also allow any of the 600,000 carbines to come back in too. Time will tell I guess. Now the Garand's or carbines from Korea will be import stamped as required by law as they are owned by the Korean government. But the CMP ones will not be stamped as they are US property to start with.
It'll be interesting to see the serial ranges and individual, perhaps early rifles that show up.
I know what I'm saving my pennies for... Gotta be ready when the CMP releases them before all the *** hats buy them up to sell for double and triple at the gun shows.
I would like to think the CMP will put a limit on how many one person can buy.
I think effective this year they cut them to 8. I'd almost say that for a period of time, 6-12 months, they have a certain grade and price point open only to new buyers to give them a fair shot to get one. Announce it early, let people get things in order, let them at. I believe at the moment they are only selling FG/SG guns in stores to try and get what they can out of the last few for now.
That said I wonder how many buy them for match shooting or just to have one. I shot mine for a bit in matches but since picking up a Bushmaster DCM I only shoot the M1 when I have to, which keeps costs down big time.
Per the newly completed and signed Memorandum of Understanding (MOU) between the U.S. Army and the Civilian Marksmanship Program, M1 Garands will be limited to eight per calendar year, per customer. The new limit of eight M1 Garands goes into effect immediately and any customer who has purchased over eight will not be allowed to purchase more M1 Garands until 1 Jan., 2017. The CMP considers any item containing an M1 Garand receiver with a serial number to be an M1 Garand and will deduct from the eight M1 Garand rifle limit per year.
The dealers must be unhappy. Not many guys buying 8 per year, but the dealers and their family members are doing so.
That's probably about right...Quote:
Originally Posted by Calif-Steve
The CMP Board charged Orest Michaels with building an endowment that would permanently support the shooting matches when the supply of guns ran out. He did this by selling guns as fast as possible, and built a fund that will generate enough income to fund the National Matches in perpetuity. Now that it has been accomplished, the new COO can relax a bit and make the inventory last longer.
I have heard the Garands should be in the US no later then 2018. They will be shipped out in a US vessel. No date of departure set as of yet.
I went to Camp Perry on Thursday to pick up my 03A3 and carbine (several years back now) and as I arrived I saw a one ton dually being loaded with crates of rifles and ammo so much so the a$$ end was sagging badly. The next day at a gun show 100 miles east of Perry I saw the same fellows selling the same rifles they had paid 500- 600 the day before with the prices jacked on the rifles in the 800 to 900 range and those spam cans of HXP that were $69 marked to $129.
Just saying this was still in Bush Jr.'s days .
I have 1-2 stories my self. By the way, I do understand there are a small lot of Garands due in from Turkey. Due any time now.
Has anyone heard anything more on the PI shipment? I did hear they would be shipped put on a US Navy vessel. But nothing since.
I spoke with PM RSAT, at U.S. Dept. of State this week since I just received a retransfer authorization for an WRA P'14 pending import and was informed that the 86K M1 Rifles from the PI are enroute or possibly have already arrived and are headed for Anniston. There is also another fairly recent batch of M1 Rifles, (number unknown to me), from Turkey that's being returned to the Army and will go to CMP. The M1 Rifles and Carbines in South Korea are still in dispute as to whether they were supplied as military assistance or purchased outright. Apparently the record keeping was bad and it all remains to be sorted out. PM RSAT doesn't have a problem with authorizing the import of the Carbines at some point but there are folks at BATFE that aren't keen on it because they are magazine fed semi-autos. All of the agencies at DOJ need a housecleaning from the top down to remove the corrupt political hacks of past administrations and get things back on a common sense track. Time will tell.
The CMP South Store manager confirmed that CMP is receiving the 86,000 Phillipines M1's as well as 13,000 from Turkey. It's about 1/3 way into this video from 2018 Shot Show range day [SHOT 2018] Updates from Civilian Marksmanship Program (CMP) - YouTube
In a backhanded way, I already have an M1 imported from the Phillipines. Mine is a 6.09 Million SA gun, (9-64 barrel) rebuilt at Ogden Arsenal (obviously before being supplied to the Phillipine Islands as Military Assistance) and is still in some kind of light black preservative coating. It does have some minor pitting under the stock line (yes, humidity, obviously but no structural harm), stong rifling and mostly most recent issue parts but is really a solid, nice rifle, imported and marked commercially by Federal Ordnance. And it has an IHC stock, darn it!
So I would withhold judgement - there may be some pretty nice rifles come in, particularly if they were supplied late, in the 1960's after overhaul. And even parts rifles have value, to keep the rest running! CC
As the Winter GCA Journal will detail, we examined quite a few nice rifles in the Turkish Air Force returns. Many IHCs had the original barrel and bolt (the rest was a mix of parts). I'm guessing there will be a few goodies in the Philippine lot, there always is. The rifle assigned to the company clerk, supply sergeant, etc often escaped much use.