M1917 Receiver Notch

I recently acquired a Remington manufactured '17 with a 9-18 barrel date from a military retiree who had gotten through CMP, supposedly via Denmark. The rifle isn't a rework and is still has 90% of its original blue finish but there is a nicely machined rounded notch at the rear center of the receiver ring. I've heard all kinds of explanations for the notch but after a little experimentation I have a plausible explanation: Using USGI M2 Ball ammo in Springfield stripper clips, when inserting these in to the Enfield action, there are no guide recesses as with the '03 or '03A3 Springfields, and the loaded clip cants forward, barely clearing the receiver ring. This isn't much of a problem with bare hands but attempting to load stripper clips with heavy gloves makes it more difficult to have the bullet tips clear the receiver ring. Basically, the notch facilitates rapid loading with gloved hands. Considering that these rifles were supposed to have been used in the cold climates of Canada, Norway and Denmark, this is as good an explanation for the presence of the notch as I can find.

Congrats on your m1917, oldcorps. I suspect there are several variations on these returned '17s.. I have a 17 with a 3/18 barrel that has indications of Danish return, I.e pin front sight, Canadian stamp on stock butt, remains of the wide red stripe behind the front barrel, numbered and mismatched bolt. does your have any of these? The book by Ferris details some of these mods that occurred along their winding road back to the USA. Btw, my17 has a groove at the rear of the action that accepts stripper clips, but no notch. yours may have been modified for service in the far north as you indicated. Good shooting!
Ps. Any chance of pictures?

The rifle's excellent condition and fine bore are what attracted me. The stock isn't cosmoline soaked and there are no signs of a red stripe but even though it's an obvious replacement because the end is marked "W" for Winchester, it's numbered to match the rifle above the lower sling swivel. Wherever it was, it saw very little use. It came with a Milsco 1943 sling which may have been added later. I have a WWI action cover which gives it a nostalgic look. My generation is still struggling with computers so I haven't learned to post pix yet.

My wife was born and raised in Ft. Wayne and is an IU grad.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by oldcorps

I haven't learned to post pix yet.

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You could always email them to me and I'll post them for you. Check your PMs for email address.

I don't understand. My Eddystone with a 1918 barrel has the clip slots. I have never attempted to use gloves (other than a shooting glove on my left hand) but the clips seem to fit just fine. I do use aftermarket SS clips with heavy springs but I have not had any issues loading it. Just shot a match last weekend and it worked fine.

Dave

You're probably not shooting under combat conditions in an arctic environment. The clip guides on the M17 receiver appear unchanged from those of the P14 which were intended for the British Enfield chargers, a design that provided considerable additional mass near the cartridge base for the .303 rimmed round. These fit quite snugly but with Springfield stripper clips, there's a lot of play, especially when trying to load rapidly with gloved hands and the rounds tend to cant forward. Happy to hear that you're shooting and enjoying your '17! Other than the lack of a windage adjustment, the '17 sights are user friendly for older shooters.

Here's pics for Oldcorps...M1917.

The notch was to allow clearing the stripper clip the Norwegians used, since it moved the balls more forward. Nothing more.

That makes more sense. I know the U.S. clips worked fine as was...

Thanks Promo. That amounts to the same thing, loading under arctic conditions. Both the '17 and the '03 have 3.5 inches between the receiver bridge and the rear surface of the ring but again, the Mauser system of the '03 holds the stripper more securely. Wasn't sure if the modification was done by Canada or Norway but I've seen '98 Mausers converted to 7.62X63 with the same modification.

The rifles were given to Norway by Canada. Those then passed the weapons on to Denmark, from where some made it even back to the US. So not all Danish have this notch, neither all Canadian marked ones. But it is a clear sign of rifles having been in Norway once.

I think I had posted pictures of this adaptor here once, can't find them on my iPad right now.

Do you belong to Norwegian Arms Collectors?

Is this a club or something similar? If yes, no I don't.

It's a large organization of Norwegian gun collectors. Tor Karstensen, an old friend, was its long-time president but I haven't seen him in at least five years. He has what is probably the finest collection of Colt 1873 Single Action Armies in Scandinavia.

Promo's previous post showing pictures of the Norwegian stripper clip adaptor can be found here:
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread....l=1#post201805

I was referring to the notch cut into the rear surface of the receiver ring. The rifle in question doesn't and never had the stripper clip modification. Thanks for the pix!

No, I am not in that club. And not sure what you had wanted to say with your last post?

I enjoyed the pictures that you posted.

Ah, now I understand. You have me there, I have never shot a M1917 under arctic conditions. I have deer hunted and been cold as he** but they were not firing back as they say. I agree about the sights but I wished they had put on the "click" adjuster (on the F sights???), made the rear aperture smaller and the front post thicker. That said the PH5B is just about the perfect rear sight. The front wings could have also been wider like the M1 Garand, in a hurry they sometimes become the front post.

Dave

I had bought that '17 for trading material but it's still like new with the original blue finish, so I'll keep it. I've had many US Enfields but they were all parkerized reworks. In disassembly I noticed that it's all Remington with the exception of the bolt internals, which came from Eddystone and no big deal. The lack of a windage adjustment is typical of European sights of that era but the peep is definitely user friendly. Wish the previous owner had kept the CMP certificate so I guess I'll have to request a replacement.

I can see both sides of the windage issue. On the range with beige and black and the only shots on the left and right, windage helps, especially with reloads. In the real world of "minute of man" windage adjustment like the Krag and M1903 seem to me to be more of a chance to get off kilter. Scrambling around and bumping things that can move in my mind is never a good thing. The windage on the M1, M1903A3 or even M1 Carbine with the adjustable sight is pretty impervious to change once set. That the military generally only issues one type of ammo or at the most two, usually with predictable ballistics is another reason not to worry about adjusting the left or right. Most battlefield ranges are under 300 M anyway so the couple of inches a breeze can impart is negligible. The snipers get paid to hit man sized targets farther out so let them fret over reading the wind. As a young lad, I burned boxes of M2 ball and never seemed to have a problem hitting large rocks, old paint cans, refrigerators, washers and dryers (all discarded in the desert) from the sitting position with my M1917. Now as a reloader (and older) the rifle is not as predictable. I shot it two weeks ago in a match and used Greek HXP M2 Ball, and it was like an old friend had come back: at 200 yards every shot went where you aimed it (no wind of course). These are fun rifles, not the prettiest gal at the dance but, she wont let you down and will be there for the long haul.

Dave

Got lucky going through my junk boxes and found an original 1918 manual with oilcloth cover (which I thought I'd sold) and a canvas breech cover, also 1918 dated. Now it's a keeper!

There were postings on this forum in 2013 which included installation of the BAR Model 1918A2 rear sight which had the windage adjustments, not an easy job. but can be done

Sounds like a good idea. I'll leave mine as is, though. I was never overly enthusiastic when it came to '17 Enfields but have discovered that they can grow on one. Next I'll have to invest the $25 and get a copy of its CMP letter.