Enfield # 4..Mark 1..New to me..

Posted this question earlier..but it must be lost in space. I'm a shotgun guy..Always liked the Jungle carbines. Bought a decent on, that, for some reason has about an inch of the barrel cut..and the sight is against the wood. Not a problem for me. Can I convert it to a carbine configuration > I know i'll need a flash hider, and barrel work. What else do I need ? Will a carbine stock and hand guard interchange..or can I use the existing stock and just change hand guards ? I'm not a purist..obviously !..Any help or suggestions will be truly appreciated !..thanks..jerry............

Feel free to do what you want. If the barrel has already been cut down then there is not much you could do anyway to restore it to a normal No4 without replacing the barrel.

Anyway, Jungle Carbine (No5) and No4 stocks and handguards are interchangeable from what I know, except maybe that a No5 stock may bite into the reciever where a No4 stock does not, since the No5 reciever is milled in certain places to save weight. Flash hider I am not sure where you could get one, or even how they mount on the barrel. You could probably find a No5 butt-stock around to make it look even more like a No5, or just keep the No4 since it will probably fit the socket a bit tighter, assuming it is the original one.

Just keep in mind that if you had a No4 MkIII or No4 MkI/2 (I believe that is correct) you would not be able to swap a No5 fore-end onto it because of how the trigger mount is changed.

I'm pretty hazy on No5's, and even No5's, but no one else has helped yet, so if I were you I would wait for someone a little more knowledgeable to have a say.

I'm not best qualified to talk about No5's either, but I do rebuild genuine ones from time to time. I presume you have access to a lathe? You'll need to turn the barrel to the correct length & you'll need to turn a step into the end so it fits into the barrel recess in the flash eliminator. Getting a flash eliminator is another issue. Originals are made from unobtanium these days, although some outfits your side of the pond have made repro's in recent years. Perhaps someone in the US will chip in to advise if they are any good & still available. I'm not really sure as I've only used originals, but I think some of the repro's have thinner walls so that the the FE can be used with an unmodified No4 barrel (ie without a step turned in the end of the barrel). Again, maybe someone clued up can help here. You can fit a No5 forend to a No4 body (receiver) but as Nijalninja said, you may need to do a little work with a wood chisel. The position of the barrel bands is not the same in No4's & No5's, so if you swap the forend over it will be better to swap the handguard as well. In fact, if you have a No5 handguard you can cut down a No4 forend & recut the barrel band slot, using the guard as a template to show where to cut the new (barrel band) slot. It sounds complicated but it's not too difficult. If you do cut down a No4 forend at the correct length you will also find that you have cut it right through the lightening cut in the barrel channel. Again, not a big deal: degrease, patch & glue a shaped piece of wood into the defect from the now redundant front part that you've cut off.

You've set yourself a bit of a task simply because the bits are hard to find; both a set of wood & a FE. However, if you can track these down it's not too difficult, & as mentioned if you can get a guard you can then mod a No4 forend to do the job.

Hope this helps a little. (But if it were me I'd just rebarrel the No4 with another (unmessedabout with) No4 barrel, & if I wanted a No5 that badly I'd buy one that was complete!)

Never let it be said that I don't appreciate a project . Years ago, I owned Brooklands, inc in Ft Lauderdale. We imported AC cobra..and GT40 parts from the original..and sometimes cranky ,craftsmen in the UK. We also supplied spares for MG..Austin, etc..I'm used to the hunt..and sometimes enjoy it..Still..all experience is MOST welcome..jerry

The flash hiders are presently available from Numrich as the originals are expensive, I know, I have one for sale and want lots for it. The last ones Numrich had were less than perfect but these might be better. I also have a barrel loose right now so could take measurements for you... The wood has been done from #4 wood, including the butts. Peter Laidler did lots of them and told us about it in old posts...

By the way, here's your other post. I could show you how to find them...if you like... https://www.milsurps.com/showthread....931#post425931

Got the FH from Numrich..Quality is quite nice. Did some measuring..and cut 4" from the #4 barrel....and the FH slipped snugly into place. Fits perfect..I broke the sight insert while switching it to the FH. Where can I get another ?..And..Were any 15 or 20 round mags. ever available ? I'll post some pics. when I'm done..Thanks for the help...

I have a sight insert I'll send your way.
The front sight blade, correct? That's drifted into the front sight base dovetail. Is that what you need?
If so, PM your address.

They trialed 20 rounders for the No 1 MK III in world war one they worked better with 15 rounds in them they were not a great success as being extended and cumbersome they caught on stuff added more weight to the rifle and were disliked by the troops if you can find one then they would be about as expensive as a Hiscock .22 magazine which will set you back @$1500-1600/Au.

As for the No.4 or 5 rifles having a 20 round mag never happened.

The 20 round mags were sent to India for use in a LMG they were making. So are thinner on the ground than rocking horse poo/harder to find than hens teeth/ easier to find than fairy dust. :D

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ozark1

broke the sight insert while switching it to the FH. Where can I get another

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You should take a look at the number on the sight and tell us so you get the right one...it matters.

Thanks guys..and to rcathey..I look for a number and PM you..Now to clean up the metal and wood..j...got a sling and a bayonet...

The sight insert that is broken is from a #4 gun..The one I need is the one that fits the flash hider #5..SO..I don't know which one.?????

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ozark1

.The one I need is the one that fits the flash hider #5

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Should be the same. The number on top of the sight is what you need.

BAR is correct the size of the blade is on the top though you may want to get a couple of different sizes + & - as well due to the fact your shortening the sight radius from the original configuration therefore what worked on the longer barrel may not on the shortened length and the changes in the harmonics of the barrel that having the flashider plonked on it.
There are plenty of sight blades for sale on that site in the UK cannot vouch for the USA just ensure you get the ones for a No.4.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by ozark1

The sight insert that is broken is from a #4 gun..The one I need is the one that fits the flash hider #5..SO..I don't know which one.?????

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Springfield Sporters has 'em.

The sight insert on my No5 has the split dovetail. I think the inserts with the solid dovetail were for the base with the locking screw .

Lee Enfield #4 | British Enfield Gun Parts

Thanks guys..Project is progressing nicely. Reshaped the wood..and will put a little better darker finish when I'm done..Repro. bayonet fit the FH perfectly..