30M1 Carbine cartridge

It all started back in 1901 when TC Johnson was issued a patent for a semi auto mechanism to be used in the new Winchester 22 semi auto and later in 1905 for the 32 and 35 caliber Winchester self loading rifle (more of a carbine with the 22 inch barrel). Both rifle and calibers were discontinued in or around 1920 and no other weapons were factory chambered for these cartridges.

When Winchester started to develop the M1 carbine the old 32 cal WSL cartridge from the old Model 1905 was modified and became the 30M1 carbine cartridge (early cartridges still had the 32 WSL stamp from the Winchester bunter used on the headstamp).

I have a Model 1905 rifle in 35 WSL caliber that I shoot (easy to make the cartridges from 38 Special brass) my rifle has a three digit serial number manufactured in 1905. It is nice to shoot a semi auto produced in 1905 and everything works

My .351 didn't look as nice as that one so I ran a 9mm chamber ream in and fitted P 38 mags... I had to lighten the slide with holes too...it ran about perfectly with anything fed to it.

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Originally Posted by browningautorifle

My .351 didn't look as nice as that one so I ran a 9mm chamber ream in and fitted P 38 mags... I had to lighten the slide with holes too...it ran about perfectly with anything fed to it.

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Oh Jim. I wish you hadn’t wrote that.
About the only thing keeping me from getting one of these was the cost/availability of ammo.
Thanks a lot!

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Originally Posted by rcathey

the cost/availability of ammo.

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Stay in touch, I can talk you through it...not much of a brain strain though. The mod for the mag goes on the back...so it feeds easy. Or use existing expensive mags with a block at the back. You can also make brass for .351 from 5.56 brass, it'll work...passable.

The 35 Winchester self loading cartridge might have also been a good choice for the carbine, but it is all history nowAttachment 94576

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Originally Posted by RCS

The 35 Winchester self loading cartridge might have also been a good choice for the carbine, but it is all history now

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I have this odd attraction to 35 calibers. An M1 in .35 would be mighty nifty.

If considered, the .35 would have been rejected because of reduced magazine capacity and reduced range and energy. I guess it could have a jacketed bullet which also would have been a requirement to prevent leading and clogging the gas port.

The Kentucky State Police had 1907 Winchesters back in the Fifties. Increased capacity magazines were available but uncommon outside of law enforcement agencies.

Attachment 95095

FBI used those too, large mags. Now you seem to only find them in displays of LEO...and pricey when loose.

What a lot of collectors don't know, it that France used many thousand Winchester Model 1907 rifles in trench warfare. There was even a full auto Model 1907/17
manufactured for France. France also made their own 351 WSL cartridges. France developed their own assault rifle during the post WW1 years using a 351 cartridge
necked down to 8mm called the 8mm Ribeyrolle.

American gangsters also used the Winchester Model 1907 some being converted to full auto with a Cutts installed on the muzzle, during
the 1930's.

I have a 1905 in .32SL but unfortunately it has a .35WSL mag.