Shtle III* History

Hello everyone

I picked up this rifle for a good deal and I am guilty of putting the scope on it years ago. Recently I've been getting to know the gun a little more by the markings that are on it. Not shown in the photos is the serial number under the back sight also matching. My understanding is that the 18 on the left receiver photo means that the rifle was re-barrelled. Is my understanding correct? What do some of the other markings mean? Why is there no mention of the manufacturer under the crown and GR on the Shtle III* picture? I would like to know a little more about this firearm. What can you tell me? The butt of the stock also has a 1.25 addition to it where the wood is different. Would that be for a taller guy using this firearm?

Phreaky: The manufacturer is indicated: Enfield = Royal Small Arms Factory, Enfield.

Ridolpho

The buttstock has been cut and a recoil pad added, then subtracted. Instead of replacing it, someone found it "Easier" to add a new back end. I think the number you refer to does indeed mean a rebarrel in that date. The bolt has been installed and scrubbed of it's original marks and numbered to this action. The firing pin was loose at the cocking piece and the back end of the firing pin peened to increase the back end size... Other marks indicate chamber length and pressures induced and proof marks, inspector's markings. Others are just manufacturer's markings.

Oh... so nothing really special about the old gun, besides the fact that it may of been used in a World war or two. Otherwise it's a bit of a Heinz 57 and maybe even more of a danger to shoot considering the age. Thank you Ridolpho for helping me with the manufacturer and Jim for the other info. I'm not sure how you know all the information about the firing pin on the cocking piece, but you also probably know the day it happened and the weather on that day. My mind is blown. You amazed me with that information. Thank you.
Otherwise it sounds like I have an over-sized paper weight to what I mounted a scope to. I guess I should check the head space on it before using/selling it as my research advised. I still wish it could talk and tell me more stories, but maybe it's time to retire it.
This was a No. 1 Mark III* right?
Thanks again.

Yes, No.1 MkIII*...

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Originally Posted by Phreakyteebz

a danger to shoot considering the age

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There's likely nothing wrong with that rifle for just shooting. You can have headspace checked and serviceability and then go ahead...just get a box of something local purchase and go ahead.

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Originally Posted by Phreakyteebz

I'm not sure how you know all the information about the firing pin on the cocking piece

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The back of the firing pin shows peening...you can see it. It doesn't mean it's broken or damaged though. Just that someone thought it needed more...

Hi Jim or whomever,
Can you entertain my ignorance for a little bit. I'm trying to google the peening thing and am not having much success. It talks about hitting with a hammer to improve metal surface, but I really don't have a hot clue where to look or what to look for. I'm assuming you mean on the first picture on the back of the bolt? Are you talking about the circle behind the screw or within that circle where someone tried to adjust the firing pin? Thank you for all the feedback so far.

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Originally Posted by Phreakyteebz

hitting with a hammer to improve metal surface,

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Exactly what I was saying. The back end of the firing pin or striker, is the circle you see above the screw in the back of the cocking piece in picture one. I suspect the striker was a bit loose or was replaced and someone thought more was needed. It's the little marks that are present. It doesn't matter that it was done...

Phreaky, many LE rifles in daily use are a 100 years old. In fact, if you look around you will find many firearms in regular use for hunting, sport, recreation, etc are many decades old. Just ask and you will be surprised.

Good firearms have no age. In normal common sense use your Sht LE III* should last at least another 50 years or probably thousands of rounds.

I would think the barrel is original to the rifle, and the bolt is to .

If the extension is jointed onto the butt stock with a vertical dovetail, it and the butt disk blanking piece are likely to be factory done. There were a number of short butt stocks converted to normal length when there was a production shortage at Enfield. The butt has since been remodelled with a 'Prince Albert' style pistol grip, popular around the turn of the nineteenth century.

The back of the firing pin or striker as it is known, shows some light bruising. Could be hammer marks from somebody trying to break it loose if and when it was tight. It could be a lot of things. Perhaps the concern is about peening of the metal?

The cocking piece needs to be stable and a good tight fit on the striker. The threads can wear if the bolt is dismantled many times. If the cocking piece is even slightly loose on the threads, it can have effect on the trigger and getting a consistent pull off.

The armourer cure to tighten things up was to tin the striker threads with solder then reassemble. Bubba's method was to hammer a flat on the threads or to peen the end of the striker in situ. I dont think that this is the case here.

Would it be amiss of me to comment on 'butt stock' again? Its been bothering me for quite a while. The butt is the rearmost part of the stock, so correct wording is butt, not butt stock.

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Originally Posted by englishman_ca

Could be hammer marks from somebody trying to break it loose if and when it was tight.

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Never thought of that...maybe...

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Originally Posted by englishman_ca

There were a number of short butt stocks converted to normal length when there was a production shortage at Enfield

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Hadn't heard that one...

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Originally Posted by Daan Kemp

. . . The butt is the rearmost part of the stock, so correct wording is butt, not butt stock.

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So, by extension, shall we discontinue "forestock" and just call it the "fore"?:madsmile:

Its a bit fuzzy in my mind, but as I recall, at one time the standard lengths of the butt stocks was rationalised and adjusted by half an inch. Normal became short, long became normal, a new longer long was introduced, and short became bantam length. I probably don't have this correct, but is was something like that.

There was a considerable factory inventory of older short butts and a need for what had become normal length. So to keep war time production going, (or simple Brit frugality), the RSAF added the extension to produce normal length.

The butt stocks with the extension are not uncommon. Just not recognised by many as as a factory mod. The joint had a neat vertical dovetail that is visible from above and below. The blanking disc was added at this time too, at a glance one can see it appears a little further forward than standard, due to the rearward extension. This gives me a clue to when it was done, at a time when the disc was obscolete (post 1916?) and no longer used.

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Originally Posted by englishman_ca

The joint had a neat vertical dovetail that is visible from above and below. The blanking disc was added at this time too, at a glance one can see it appears a little further forward than standard, due to the rearward extension.

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Good info and something to keep in mind when inspecting from now on.

Parashooter - the 'fore' is known as the fore-end, wood on top of the fore-end known as the front and rear handguard.

Fore stock, butt stock, upper hand guard, lower hand guard.

Semantics.

Wearing vest and suspenders to the hotel in Canada would be fine. Doing so in the UK might get you beat up or offers of free drinks.

In Toronto, if you smoke cigarettes, never ask somebody if you could bum a ***, unless again you were looking for free drinks.

Proper SMLE nomenclature from the Illustrated Parts List.

Stock, fore-end
Stock, butt
Guard, hand, front
Guard, hand, rear

You guys should all invest $10 plus post on Skennerton's SAIS Series booklets. It's all there and eliminates confusion.

Brian has it dead right once again

By implication then, the butt swivel will be a little further forward on these extended butts (as measured from the butt plate).

In the case of the OP's rifle it has a civilian swivel though. He hasn't responded as to whether it has the dovetail to locate the rear addition...

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Originally Posted by Roger Payne

By implication then, the butt swivel will be a little further forward on these extended butts (as measured from the butt plate).

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Yes sir, that is correct.