Reloading 6.5 carcano

Hello, I am fairly new to this forum but have been reading threads for a while. I just bought a Carcano 91/28 TS, it was originally a 91 TS made in 1899 and was converted to a 91/28 by F.A.G in 1938.

I am going to reload for this rifle and I am looking for advice. I know the original load was around a 160 gr .2665 FMJ round nose projectile. In my area I have access to both the Hornady carcano bullets and .268 140 gr cast bullets. I am leaning towards the cast bullets as they are about half the price and easier on the bore. What load should I be looking at and are cast bullets okay in gain twist rifling? I have read they can come apart but the ones I am looking at are hard cast.

Thanks in advance

Hi, I reload for the long rifle with gain twist and military bullets since the mid nineties. Lately I have started using a great reload suggested by Hornadys’ specialist Emery. I must say that this recipe is really great.
I use the standard military bullets, 160 grs (approximately). .2675”. 37 grains of W760 and magnum rifle primers. COAL 75,0 mm or slightly longer (the bullets are not match ones). No signs of overpressure at all, good consistency and accuracy. I never reloaded with cast bullets, but with military ones this recipe is really great. I used to load less powder and normal rifle primers. Not bad, but every now and then, I felt some “wind” in my face. With this one, no issues!
That is my new pet load. No doubts!

Thanks for the info!! any idea how long Hornady bullets themselves are? I found some cast ones made by a local guy and want to see how they compare dimensionally

If you allow me some time, I can tell you the exact dimensions of the military ones.
I never used Hornady‘s.
Also PPU has bullets for .268. 140 grs. Fmj, spitzer. I don‘t recall if they are also boat tail, but don‘t think so.

Cheers, thanks a bunch, the dimensions of the military ones would be great. Just trying to get a ball park of around where they should be.

The Hornady bullet was made wrong by the "specialist " and can cause major problems . The PPU bullets are not the best quality but are not dangerous . The 123 flat base will shoot better than the 139 boat tail . The 123 will shoot ok with about any listed power and loading . Any thing from I-4895 to I-4350 .

I think I am going to go with cast and use 10 grains of unique.

A guy near me makes .268” 140 gr round nose flat points that are 1.11” long. I looked at some calculators online and these should have no problem stabilizing out of the 1:9 rifling at the muzzle of my TS carbine.

I just hope the 20 hardness cast bullets can handle the gain twist rifling

Here we are!
30.0 mm exactly.
Attachment 105402
Concerning the Hornady bullets, from what I heard they were initially a tad too big, with exactly .268. Also the distribution of the copper was not correct, causing the bullet to have more trouble getting through the gain twist at the end of the barrel.
That has been changed a lot of time ago, and now many people use them.
They are just quite expensive...

You might want to look into powder coating the cast bullets. My understanding is it allows you to treat them basically as you would a standard FMJ round except its a cast round. Never played with it myself, but the concept has interested me.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Eaglelord17

You might want to look into powder coating the cast bullets. My understanding is it allows you to treat them basically as you would a standard FMJ round except its a cast round. Never played with it myself, but the concept has interested me.

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Thanks for the idea. Not looking for max pressure, the rifle these will fire out of is 121 years old so I am not looking for max pressure, just some fun plinking rounds to get some range time out of the old girl

Use
lapua Mega 6.5x55.10.1 g / 156gr.

The work exelent in my two gain rifled Carcanos
i know they are only .264
But dont worry. The work

Jsne

The Carcano bore size is apparently somewhat variable from rifle to rifle. Some folks(me included) having fairly good luck with PPU 6.5mm ammo. Some guys swearing the .268" bullets are needed for accuracy and then some who had pressure issues with the .268" bullets and load with the more common .264" bullets.

For cast bullet loads it's probably best to slug the bore and see what you have for bore size....can always use a gas-check on cast slugs

If Carcanos bores are anything like a lot of other rifling systems developed in that era, the bullets will be theoretically "undersized". The standard theory of the time was that the swift kick in the backside at ignition would "bump-up" the rear of the bullet for a reasonable seal and everything would be OK. I have never seen a recovered bullet that had been fired from a '91 Carcano, but if anyone has, could they take a close look at it. If it is not too mangled and distorted, see if the rear-most four or five millimeter is measurably larger in diameter than the rest of the bullet jacket and if there is a visible difference in the depth of the rifling marks on the jacket, from front to rear. i know that the original nickle alloy jackets are relatively hard, but they had to be softer than the barrel steel for the rifling to engrave the bullet.

Another interesting theory that is discussed in early technical texts is that leaving a bit of "soot' in the barrel after each shot was a good thing, as the heat of the next cartridge that was fired would cause any atmospheric oxygen in the barrel to react with the "soot" and not the barrel steel. As in any rifle, the idea was for the bullet to engage the lands to cause bullet spin, but NOT for the bullet to be so hard that it acted like a high-velocity broach and just tore out the lands. .303 Lee Enfields work exactly this way: .311" bullets, .303 Bore, but a nominal groove diameter out to .319" was within spec. as per the drawings I have. It seems to work way out past 900 yards, as all the older target-rifle types will tell you.

If the BORE diameter (across the LANDS is smaller than the Jacket diameter. (Bullet .264", bore .258 or so, "conventional bullets, and a "fast-ish" propellant may just get the job done nicely, bearing in mind that "sporting bullets generally have CLOSED bases as opposed to the open ones of "ball" projectiles. IF the jacket on a .264" "sporting" bullet is thin enough at the rear, and the propellant combustion has a reasonably high initial impulse, the bullet WILL "bump-up" a couple of thousandths of an inch. By the way, what is the availability of the six-round clips these days?.

I suspect this concept is a hangover from the days of the Minie Ball, with that bullet being a "racing fit" when it was rammed down the bore, but the skirt around the hollow base was expanded by the powder gases and engaged the rifling to provide sealing and spin, (and to scrape out some of the fouling from the previous shot). Patt-53 Enfields firing the PROPER hollow-based bullet were not exactly "scatterguns"; being able to lay down some impressive groups at several hundred yards..

If anyone plans to shoot a Carcano a LOT or have a whole room full of different models, Mr. Corbin may be worth contacting for the tools to make EXACTLY the bullet you want. NOT cheap toys but a definite solution and a whole new adventure!

I must still have one or two recovered bullets, original military ones. They are really like new, just with the sign of the rifling. I think that if they don't hit a hard surface, the Carcano bullets are really reusable...

I do have the dies to make my own Carcano bullets . It works good . Another solution is the use a lathe to either trim down or cut driving bands in the Big Hornady Carcano bullets . That also works well and has the advantage of being able to size a bullet to a certain rifle .

What does “cut driving bands” mean?

The problem with the big Hornady bullet is too much bore friction and nowhere for the thick jacket to displace to with
gain twist . If you cut .006 deep grooves every .050 down the body of the bullet that contacts the bore you have cut the friction in half and have room for displacement of jacket . You will still seal up and stay straight in the bore without all the drag . Like the original idea as stated in the other guy's post about bore riding bullets , but it works better as the bullet has several points of contact , not just the base . When Barnes was having pressure and fouling problems with their solid copper bullets I told them about driving bands and they now make their bullets with them .