DIE SELECTION FOR RELOADING FOR MY M1 CARBINE.....HELP NEEDED

Ok fellows......need some help here.

Going to order reloading dies........they are going to be carbide dies and will be either LEE brand or RCBS......unless someone can convince me for the added cost to order DILLON.

My RCBS reloading manual strongly suggests the use of "taper crimp" dies.

The RCBS are taper crimp while the Lee are not! The Lee set in their sales pitch lay out the reasons that in the way they manufacture the die eliminates the need for the taper crimp.

I have copied that portion for you to read if you don't mind......

LEE – Three-Die Carbide Rifle Set-30 M1 Carbine -90626
Lee carbide dies are contour ground to provide step-less sizing. After sizing a case, except for the burnish, you cannot tell where the sizer stopped. Other brands leave a pronounced step where the die stops. With a carbide sizer, no case lube is needed, and you don’t even have to clean your cases.
No need for a taper crimp die, plus better accuracy with Lee Dies. Taper crimp dies are used to correct the problems caused by the improper expanding plug design or adjustment. They distort the bullet shank and reduce accuracy. Because the Lee Expander flares the minimum amount, consistent with easy bullet insertion, all of the flare is removed with the bullet seating die, thus eliminating the need for a taper crimp die.
Each die has an enlarged mouth to dependably align even range damaged cases. They are built to last for the large volume reloader.





I will still use lube......but the question remains are Lee more user friendly and better "or" should I still go with the taper crimp set from RCBS or Dillon?

Dies will be exclusively used for the M1 Carbine.

---------- Post added at 10:21 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 AM ----------

Sorry my oversight......this thread probably should be in the reloading section......

I use the RCBS dies without any issues

Because the .30 carbine headspaces on the mouth, loads should not be crimped. If mouths are flared for loading cast bullets, any style seat/crimp die can be adjusted to remove flare without further reducing mouth diameter. For jacketed bullets, no flare may be needed if mouths are chamfered - though some will seat easier with a bit of flare.

I use the Lee dies, but with the RCBS shell holder which fits better than Lee's. You will find huge differences in brands of cases, even in LC over the years. Some are much easier to size than others. I taper crimp mine but only about a thousandth or two. Trim length is very critical. Case heads can pull off if you don't lube. - Bob

I prefer RCBS without question, never used a carbide die on Carbine. I lubed them and used standard dies. I trimmed to length and chamfered inside and out I used a modest case mouth bell because I almost always used lead gas check and still have that mould. I never used a taper crimp and never crimped. Just seat and they should go back to straight taper, if a taper crimp then as stated, just a touch.

A friend of mine couldn't get his ammo to come around, bullets didn't stay in cases and things weren't working right. I had him bring the whole thing over including dies, he had something other than RCBS, so I set up and ran all his cases through my dies and loaded everything without issue. They all worked and fit without fail...

speaking of shell holders, I just got lee dies for 7.5 MAS. First time using lee dies, it was all that I could find available. It was nice that the shell holder came with it, but the opening was too small for the large primer cup on my Hornady iron press to pass through. It ruined the mouth of the cup. Luckily I had a spare, and diagnosed the problem before any more serious damage was done. Maybe something to consider, not knowing what kind of press you have.

"Lee carbide dies are contour ground to provide step-less sizing. After sizing a case, except for the burnish, you cannot tell where the sizer stopped. Other brands leave a pronounced step where the die stops."

If wanting to use a die set with a carbide sizer, this is important, at least to me.

Unless the RCBS sizer is also "Contour" ground, which in this case means that the carbide sizing insert is ground to the same taper angle as the case, then I would go with the Lee sizer. The .30 carbine cases need very little expanding if seating jacketed bullets.

Pay special attention to case length with the carbine brass, they grow alot when sized.

I don't taper crimp mine, I just adjust the seating die carefully so that it just removes the slight bellmouth in the case as the bullet approaches full seating depth. This is easy to accomplish, but may take a few "dry" runs to get there. Using this method I have never had bullet "set back" during loading or firing, the carbine bullets have a long bearing surface so they stick into the cases very well.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by jakester

Pay special attention to case length with the carbine brass, they grow alot when sized.

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Yes they do. Wide chambers can make this more than less too.

I use the lee dies and once set up correctly they work fine Like these fine gentle men have said trim length is critical and a use a squirt or two of Hornady sure shot and they go in slick and easy/

Quote:

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Originally Posted by TDH

once set up correctly they work fine

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My only complaints on the lee sizer dies themselves is the rod that holds the expander ball does not have a removable/replaceable pin, and the rod is smooth sided, so is secured only by friction from the locking nut. I kept wrenching the nut down, and it kept slipping after 5 or so rounds (again, my only lee die is in 7.5 French). I finally put it on my bench vise, added some nickel anti-sieze to the threads to prevent galling, and applied an unreasonable amount of torque. It hasn't slipped since.
In my troubleshooting, I noticed the expander ball had quite a rough surface compared to the mirror finish of my Hornady and rcbs dies. So I chucked it up in a drill press, and started polishing with 800 grit emery paper, working my way up to 2500, followed by jewelers rouge.
So, I would agree with all the work just fine statements. My general 2 cents about lee dies is that if I were a beginner who had not yet acquired a "feel" for what normal operation should be like...this issue of rod slipping and rough expander ball for bottleneck cases, not to mention the increased chances of breaking or bending a decapping tip with inexperience, would likely cause a lot of frustration and possibly damage that could be avoided by going with just about any other brand.
Of course, my expander ball complaint is mute since the OP was about a straight wall cartridge.

Even with Lee carbide dies, I use a touch of case lube. My very first reloading was a Lee Loader in 30 Carbine (mid 70's). I wore out three plastic mallets and a real nice piece of maple whacking in the short case that needed to be full length sized. I eventually got a set of steel RCBS dies and a Jr press, which worked great but they got lost in a move years ago. It has been a love hate project: for such a short case, it takes so much force to size them. Be sure you ALWAYS trim to the recommended length. Too long is asking for trouble. When you get a M1 Carbine that shoots accurately, hand-loads definitely help.

Dave

Quote:

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Originally Posted by Wineman

For such a short case, it takes so much force to size them.

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Boy, I'll sure second that - enough force that a lot of my loads show an imprint of the shell holder on the case heads. There's so much difference between some commercial brass and between different lots of military, that it's helpful to sort by maker, and the military by dates, before sizing. - Bob

I never had that trouble that I can remember, almost all my carbines were military cast off too. Again, I lubed as I used the older pattern dies.

Redding die set from Dillon. Very good.