Plainfield Plant Robbed 1967

Printable View

10-11-2021, 09:50 PM
painter777

Plainfield Plant Robbed 1967

Since Plainfield was brought up I thought I'd add this.

In 1967 the Plainfield Machine Co plant was broken in to with 46 Carbines stolen.
Shortly afterward Firemen and Police were on the receiving end of sniper fire from the rooftops. With the Police being under gunned, Plainfield management loaned 50 Carbines to Police battling snipers, looters and rioters.

Story titled: Guns of Riots starts on pages 22, 23-24 and concludes on page 69.

Another story written (IMO) with some brown nose flare, but may interest some is about the *New Universals.*
Titled: New Look of the M1 Carbine
Starts on page 42, 43 then on to 53 to 56.

https://gunsmagazine.com/wp-content/...8/12/G1167.pdf
10-12-2021, 08:30 AM
fjruple

It is my understanding that Carbines were not M1 but M2 Carbines which were under contract to the South Vietnamese police. The US military was not permitted to arm local foreign police departments with MDAP weapons. The M1 story was to minimize the fact that machineguns were stolen. I have it under good authority that to date none the weapons were recovered. The local police, the state police and national guard pretty well trashed the local neighborhoods looking for the "Carbines". The city and state had to pick up the tab for the damages. And that my friends is why the M1 Carbine is banned in NJ.
10-13-2021, 12:06 PM
TBIRD430

Wow!! Crazy history there....
10-14-2021, 08:19 PM
tenOC

Pretty sure the real reason the 1 Carbine is banned in New Jersey is for another reason. The same reason all the other banned ones are banned. Same reason they're banned in NYC.
10-15-2021, 06:32 AM
Bob Womack

My wife spent her teens one town over in the town of North Plainfield. Decades later Plainfield was still a wasteland, not from the police, but from damage from the rioters. The people who stole the weapons used them on the first responders who responded to the fires they set.

Bob
10-15-2021, 06:54 AM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bob Womack

Decades later Plainfield was still a wasteland, not from the police, but from damage from the rioters.

There are a few places like that. People left and the destruction barely even got cleaned up let alone rebuilt.
10-15-2021, 07:52 AM
fjruple

Bob-- The local "residents" were pretty well armed to begin with. You can see that reflected in what is going on in our intercities today. Control by the local government is only that turf you stand on. Newark has never recover from the riots. Boarded up buildings, corruption and razor wire everywhere. I felt safer in downtown Ramadi.
10-19-2021, 03:03 AM
TerryS

I can see stolen guns, but ammo ? A manufacturer would not have a lot laying around.
10-19-2021, 07:23 AM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by TerryS

A manufacturer would not have a lot laying around.

I'm not so sure, for testing and targeting there would be ammo required. Sure, it would get consumed but it's possible there would be substantial on hand.

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

I felt safer in downtown Ramadi.

But there you were carrying an M4 and a cummerbund full of mags ready for a scrap.
10-19-2021, 09:18 AM
fjruple

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

I'm not so sure, for testing and targeting there would be ammo required. Sure, it would get consumed but it's possible there would be substantial on hand.

But there you were carrying an M4 and a cummerbund full of mags ready for a scrap.

Jim-- Not really my MTOE weapon was a Beretta M9 pistol. It was a joke. The natives were carrying at a minimum AKs and here I am with my little pop gun. I found a Yugo M70AB2 AK with a folding stock laying in the desert. Cleaned it up. I got extra magazines and some good 7.62x39 ammo from the Special Ops folks. I used that until we got some M16A2 rifles in from states side. I love when armchair commandos write up an MTOE and never been in a hostile environment.
10-19-2021, 10:11 AM
eb in oregon

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

Jim-- Not really my MTOE weapon was a Beretta M9 pistol. It was a joke. The natives were carrying at a minimum AKs and here I am with my little pop gun. I found a Yugo M70AB2 AK with a folding stock laying in the desert. Cleaned it up. I got extra magazines and some good 7.62x39 ammo from the Special Ops folks. I used that until we got some M16A2 rifles in from states side. I love when armchair commandos write up an MTOE and never been in a hostile environment.

Those would be the same idiots that wrote the MTOE for Cavalry Scouts, believing a TOW missile in heavy forest is better than a MaDeuce or a MK19. We trained for years in heavy forrest using TOWS and would rarely have ever had a shot over 200 meters. Darn good observation device though.
10-19-2021, 10:34 AM
DaveHH

Quote:

Originally Posted by TerryS

I can see stolen guns, but ammo ? A manufacturer would not have a lot laying around.

The testing ammunition for WW2 factories was in the millions of rounds consumed. In '67 carbine ammunition was cheap, I can see having large quantities of tins and cases laying around.

TOE: I was drafted and spent only 22 months in the Army (72 day early out from VN)). During that time, I got a glimpse of how incredibly screwed up the whole thing was. When an IG inspection came to town, there was so much BS being done, with hand receipts to cover missing stuff and other stuff hidden, not many things were legit about any TOE. We actually had a stolen jeep in our battalion and just like in the movie "Mash" the order was to repaint that bumper NOW! Men who were in Korea swore that the natives could provide a stolen guided missile if the price was right. Now with computers, it is either hard to do or incredibly easy I don't know. When those Bozos walked off and left billions of dollars worth of TOE in Afghanistan, it must be very easy. Abandoning billions to assure that new stuff must be manufactured to replace it, wars that serve no purpose except to provide customers to arms producers, Generals micro-managing companies then becoming lobbyists. See a pattern here?
10-19-2021, 01:38 PM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

love when armchair commandos write up an MTOE and never been in a hostile environment.

Or aren't even infantry.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eb in oregon

Darn good observation device though.

Be able to count the hairs on that hand...
10-19-2021, 04:22 PM
eb in oregon

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

Or aren't even infantry.

Be able to count the hairs on that hand...

I was once training at Ft. Harrison outside Helena Montana and we were in the field working with the TOW at night. We watched a couple a few hundred yards away that had parked downhill and were "sparking" in the back seat. Yes I my be a pervert, but it was entertaining. Of course this was long before everybody had a phone let alone smart phone to record it.
10-19-2021, 10:28 PM
painter777

Quote:

Originally Posted by eb in oregon

We watched a couple a few hundred yards away

While drinking our share at the drive in years ago and having just returned from the bathroom, I accidently got in to the wrong Pontiac Lemans. I jumped in quickly being cold outside and the windows fogged up.
Then the Screaming started.
It wasn't full of my buddies, but a couple in the back. I nearly scared that Older Couple to death. My friends sitting in my Pontiac were 3 spots over. They heard that couples scream as I came running back to the right car. Other than my scarred for life eyes, :eek: I think I was more embarrassed than that couple was.

Reminds me of the episode of That 70's Show, When a policeman thought he had some youngsters parked and Sparking. To his surprise when the window was rolled down he found Red and Kitty were the culprits going at it in the little gas saver car. Red Forman then chewed the Policeman a new one.
"Oh Red, you let him off with a warning" said Kitty.

Quote:

Originally Posted by eb in oregon

"sparking"

Haven't heard "Sparking" used since my Father would give me the business when I was heading out on a date.
@Eb, Thx for that, Good memories..... :thup:
10-19-2021, 11:10 PM
ssgross

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

I love when armchair commandos write up an MTOE and never been in a hostile environment.

Yep. Those couch potatoes wit no clue how to calculate "Mega Tonnes of Oil Equivalent" :)
10-20-2021, 01:13 AM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by eb in oregon

Ft. Harrison outside Helena Montana

I've been there too...passing through in '98 I think it was.
10-20-2021, 09:39 AM
fjruple

Quote:

Originally Posted by TerryS

I can see stolen guns, but ammo ? A manufacturer would not have a lot laying around.

Terry-- That is not unusual in this case, PMC was a small manufacturer and tested the weapons on site. The "stolen" guns and ammunition were part of a contract for the South Vietnamese Police. at the time the US military prohibited from supplying foreign police authorities with US military aid. The funny thing was that none of the "stolen" weapons have ever been recovered to date that I am aware of. My personal belief is the "weapons" were written off as a loss for insurance purposes but that is me just speculating.
10-20-2021, 10:24 AM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

My personal belief is the "weapons" were written off as a loss for insurance purposes but that is me just speculating.

Insurance...I wonder if the size of the theft could have been padded for insurance money? As in stating there was a higher number of guns and more ammo than there actually was?
10-21-2021, 08:38 AM
fjruple

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

Insurance...I wonder if the size of the theft could have been padded for insurance money? As in stating there was a higher number of guns and more ammo than there actually was?

Jim-- Just speculating!!! LOL
10-21-2021, 12:10 PM
browningautorifle

Quote:

Originally Posted by fjruple

Just speculating

Me too.
10-21-2021, 12:36 PM
eb in oregon

Quote:

Originally Posted by browningautorifle

Insurance...I wonder if the size of the theft could have been padded for insurance money? As in stating there was a higher number of guns and more ammo than there actually was?

I would imagine that it would take a heap of falsified paperwork that would need be created (production figures, serial numbers, parts, materials, and ammunition receipts) to accomplish that. And I'm thinking a company such as PMC had enough difficulties without biting off something with severe penalties.