New Ross MK2, have some questions?

Hello,

Well, I've been wanting a Ross rifle for a while and I found one at the big show in Tulsa. Its a Mk2 and that's really all I know about it so far, other than it was really grime-ey when I took it apart. My first question is about the barrel, there is an odd screw base spot in the front between the rear sight and the receiver. I'm just wondering if anyone's seen that before and why is it there and is it an issue for firing.(there's also 2 screw holes on the bottom of the barrel in front and in back of the rear sight). I'm also curious if its a civilian model or military model sporterized, it was marked civilian on the tag. Anything else you can tell me about it would be useful and appreciated.

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You can see where the front metal was rubbing on the barrel before the forestock was cut down. Also the barrel blocks slipped when someone was removing the barrel, causing them to change to a pipe wrench.

It is a Mk. II*** rifle which has been somewhat altered. Probably one of the thousands supplied to the US as training rifles. The stock has been filed where the US marks would have been.
The forend has been shortened. This could be restored by splicing on new wood with the joint under the band.
The barrel screws in with a quick pitch modified buttress thread - LEFT HAND. The barrels were designed to be changeable without the use of specialized tools. Remove the set screw and pop the barrel off. I suspect that the marks are there because someone was not aware that the threads are left hand.
The rifle is hurting, but would respond to some careful restoration.

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Originally Posted by tiriaq

Remove the set screw and pop the barrel off. I suspect that the marks are there because someone was not aware that the threads are left hand.

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Absolutely, without a doubt.

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Originally Posted by tiriaq

The rifle is hurting, but would respond to some careful restoration.

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I know its hurting, but there's potential here. I only paid 725$ for it, the other one I looked at was original but double the price. I may pop the barrel off just to clean it, this has to be one of the dirtier guns I've had to clean in a while. I've found carbon fouling or just grime everywhere on this gun. I considered finding a replacement stock, but there expensive. Splicing the current stock would be cheaper, then all i would need is a new bayonet band. Also forgot to add: the few serials I've found on parts don't match, is this normal for US trainer's?

You have the nosecap - it was moved back when the forend was shortened. Photo 1. The whole cap isn't in the photo, can't tell if it has been altered. Mk. II nosecaps generally aren't all that difficult to find.

If the barrel is in good or better condition you paid $400.00 too much for it's current condition . To restore it you will spend more than the asking price for the other rifle . The barrel is damaged with the rub marks , it's collector valve is gone ?

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Originally Posted by tr63

If the barrel is in good or better condition you paid $400.00 too much for it's current condition . To restore it you will spend more than the asking price for the other rifle . The barrel is damaged with the rub marks , it's collector valve is gone ?

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In Maine maybe you could have got it for 325$, but I'm in Oklahoma and they don't grow on trees here. And I'm not about to pay inflated gunbroker prices. I went to one of the country's biggest gun shows and saw 2 of them total, I chose the cheaper option. And the bores excellent. I also didn't know about the marks till I got home with it. Of course, if you have one for 350, id gladly consider buying it.

You have a Ross Mk II***. It was first manufactured as a Mk II**** with a Ross Mk III rear sight. That sight was replaced with the present Canada Tool & Specialty Co. (Sutherland Mk II) sight and the rifle designation changed to Mk II ***. The M.E. Sutherland Sight Co. became the Canada Tool & Specialty Co. That all happened at the factory, and before the rifle left the factory, and the two divots on the under-side of the barrel are remnants of the earlier sight mount.

Your barrel has been set back one turn.

About 5 years ago I sold a stock a in good condition that had been sanded lightly and the stampings on the right side butt looked readable for $475.00 plus $25.00 shipping . If I had it today for sale it would be $600.00 .

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Originally Posted by Bluenoser

You have a Ross Mk II***. It was first manufactured as a Mk II**** with a Ross Mk III rear sight. That sight was replaced with the present Canada Tool & Specialty Co. (Sutherland Mk II) sight and the rifle designation changed to Mk II ***. The M.E. Sutherland Sight Co. became the Canada Tool & Specialty Co. That all happened at the factory, and before the rifle left the factory, and the two divots on the under-side of the barrel are remnants of the earlier sight mount.

Your barrel has been set back one turn.

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In that case the chamber needed to be reamed to lengthen the chamber back to the correct size !! Why was this done ? Was it to correct chamber problems ? Will a replacement stock need to shorten at the muzzle end to be able to fit a bayonet ?

From the damaged slot in the barrel-locking screw it looks like they figured out the barrel threading in the end. The chambers of these rifles were enlarged when hard-extraction issues appeared during WWI, due to poor quality ammo.

The fact that yours has a very good bore would explain why someone went to the trouble of shortening the barrel and re-cutting the chamber close to original specs.

As Tiriaq mentioned, you have the band and nosecap so a restoration is mostly woodwork.

And yes, this was an ex-Canadian military rifle.

The scuff marks on the barrel are likely due to them thinking the barrel had right hand threads when they tried to remove it. As much as I enjoy restoring Ross rifles, I don't believe I would put the money into restoring one with a shortened barrel. Decent full-length barrels can be found, but they generally have poor to fair bores. The nose cap, although likely rebuildable, appears to have been quite heavily modified. Still, I would try to rebuild that cap before installing a reproduction.

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Originally Posted by tr63

Will a replacement stock need to shorten at the muzzle end to be able to fit a bayonet ?

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Yes it will.

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Originally Posted by Bluenoser

I don't believe I would put the money into restoring one with a shortened barrel

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Agreed, in the end you still have an oddity. Could make an excellent target shooter though as is.

And as for removing these "buggy whip" barrels as they are sometimes called, once the locking screw is removed, a few blows with a soft face mallet on the receiver around the chamber area usually loosens them enough for hand removal.