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Canadian forummer xsniper suggested we might all want to shed a tear (& wish we had a time machine) at the prices in the enclosed ad from the 1960's. He wasn't too sure about uploading an image, so here it is. Open it up, then look down the LHS towards the bottom........
Do you remember them Warren??
Gord Cummins at Crown Surplus in Calgary is where a lot of my kit came from over the years.
Mind you, you really had to dig deep in your pocket to find $90.00 for the snipers and the $4.00 in gas money for the 400 mile drive to Calgary.
Plus, Gord was a real great guy and on occasion he would let you into the sheds at the back to root around.
Deac 34's were $25.00 each if I recall.......
Oh, this was in the late 50's, early 60's.....
I believe the son still runs the business
Gord even had a Centurian tank that was a runner with all new running gear, among other bits of armour, but that is another story best told over a pint with old friends :lol:
I remember well strolling through his hallowed halls. The Cent with the spare barrel lying beside it. The tail turret from a Lanc standing in the corner...guns intact...Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
Jim: we can no longer claim we are only 29 years old and holding.
Well, you at least..:)
There was also a carrier or two and more than one ferrets as well.
Jacques Littlefield bought most of the armour.
Apparently he was in store and asked if it was for sale.
Gord gave him some ridiculous sky high price and Littlefield asked if he would take a cheque.
The rest is history.
I think the Centurian ended up with the Coors collection not that many years ago.
Some nice stuff has come out of Canada including the complete running engine for a Tiger..
To only be 60 years younger and know what I know now and have a few $ in my pocket.:banghead:
We should be so lucky as to have something a guy like him wants. I was just lucky enough to have stumbled into the right places at the right times I guess...know a few people.Quote:
Originally Posted by Warren
If only we new
Interesting to see a Garand at $ 120 while at the same time the No. 4 T is $ 90. With nowadays knowledge clearly the T's would had been the better investment.
Part of collecting though isn't what is the better 'investment' rather what you enjoy collecting. I have technically lost money on some of the trades and sales I have made, but I don't feel as though I have because I am happy with the result.
For example I once traded a RC K98k for a Portuguese M1904/39 in the grease. Technically even at that point the RC was worth more. Today the RC is worth significantly more but the M1904/39 hasn't really increased that much in value. That being said, I consider the M1904/39 a significantly better gun and the condition significantly better so to me I did better than the other guy.
Not that long ago we as young fella's in the very early '80's used to go belting down gravel roads in the bush in our mates car maroning (Fresh water crustacean yummy.) and shooting the particular car was a Ford GTHO 351 Phase III Shaker manual, check out and see what one of those is worth.
We also used his brothers XB Ford 2 door coupe 302 Windsor manual same deal except this one was one of only 2 in Australia that were customer orders with all the Bathurst racing gear installed he had all the original paper work from Ford Australia confirming the cars pedigree.
Today with these 2 cars in your garage in pristine condition you'd get no change out of a million $'s to buy them.
And the bikes I've owned and sold I'm kicking myself but we all have had similar experiences young and hot blooded looking for the next big thing!
When looking at prices of items years ago it is worth remembering what the "average person" was earning at the time. A house may have only cost two or three thousand pounds fifty or sixty years ago but people were only earning a few pounds a week at the time.
In 1976 I worked in a garage as a lube/driveway attendant from 7am - 6pm Mon-Fri 1 hour lunch plus working on Roster Station nights (Who remembers looking at the paper to find out where they were after 6pm) for the privilege of working there was paid 50 hours @$2/Hr $100/wk before tax our flat rent was $38/Wk did not leave allot for living.
Despite things being cheaper it was a thin line back then, I feel now in 2022 despite what's happening people are better equipped and more financially secure in their lives.
I have some pretty funny stories of garage life and customer interactions and a tyrannical boss!
I did not intend to make a financial investment comparison, but to point out how the demand over the years had changed the ratio. Don't you consider it interesting that the ratio back then was for 4T to M1 was 3:4 whereas nowadays it is 2:1 (just a very rough estimate), or you may call it from 3:4 to a 12:4, if that helps understanding it better.Quote:
Originally Posted by Eaglelord17
Sorry for jumping on you a bit there. I just see too many people at the moment concerned not with collecting or being interested in what they are collecting, rather only what they think will be worth money and trying to make quick bucks on the backs of the people trying to collect. It is a big part of why prices are going up so much. It is also frustrating as it is causing those who do want to collect to either not be able to afford it, or to leave the hobby as there is other things they would rather spend equivalent money on.Quote:
Originally Posted by Promo
Ex. when I started most milsurps were around 300-500$ with some being a bit more, but your average ones in that range. It was a blast, and you can afford to buy and sell and trade at least one a month for those prices. Now those same arms 10 years later are 800-1200$ or more and it results in much less collecting as many of us can't afford to collect at those prices. Whenever a dealer has something in stock at a reasonable price you see it bought instantly and someone immediately attempting to flip it for double the money. Really makes it difficult to enjoy it.
In the 50 odd years I have been eclectically collecting WWI -II books/emphera/milsurp rifles/ordnance I would have sold about a dozen items, I brought a T cause I've always loved the 303 rifle it took nearly 30 years to get one now its in the safe its staying there along with the other 303's.
I collected because of a passion and partly due to my cadets also my fathers service in WWII, my brother being in the RAAF for 20 years before he passed away and my b/inlaw being a VN vet and to better understand what/when and how all those that went away managed to survive and those that did not come home.
For me it will never be about the money, just the memory from those that gave us what we have today.
For some of us; collecting can be a bit like chasing the horizon! The things that you really would love to own one day are always just out of reach.
The "Money" factor is important; as a lot of people today only ever think of money above all else. I have a perfect example of this last year.
This actaully start's about 4 years ago; I was told of a WW2 willy's Jeep that was part of a collection; the owner had died and the son who inherited it was going bankrupt. the guy who told me about it was helping with the estate sale.
He also did work for my boss occasionally; which is how I knew him. So every time I saw him I'd ask when the auction for the estate was going to be on.
Then covid turns up and I don't see him for 6 months; when I ask about the Jeep, he looks rather embarrased and say's it's sold! I ask why he didn't tell me about the auction; replies it didn't go to auction, it was sold privately.
He then admitted that it was my Boss who bought it. I was a bit ****ed off to be honest. So I go and see my boss and ask if he'll sell it to me; explaing that I'd been chasing it for 2 years. No he didn't want to sell it. Stuck it in a lock up and it stayed there not turning a wheel until now.
My boss died of Covid in May 2021. So in summer I spoke to his wife and said asked if I could buy it. She has inherited a large collection of Aston Martin's worth probably over 5 million Euro's plus the business, so she's not short of a penny.
I offered what was a couple of thousand more than what my boss paid, which is what I could afford. Initially she agreed, saying it would have to wait because the inhertance was being sorted. No problem, I asked her to let me know when, as I could wait no problem.
So last October she starts selling some of the Aston's; so I go and ask if I can now buy the Jeep. The reply "No it's worth far more than we bought it for so I can't let it go at that price. It's worth double and I need the cash flow!" "It's going to Auction with some of the Astons".
I've worked my gut's out for over 16 years for these people! I was hoping to have the opportunity to enjoy driving the Jeep with my daughter. but now it'll end up in some rich guy's collection gathering dust.
She's also selling the company; which I'm hoping will be a good thing; because I'm done.
My advice is to definitely go to the auction and see what happens. It may not reach the hammer price that the seller is hoping for and you may still have a chance to buy it.Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Three
Most of us here have probably been promised things for sale, at one time or another, that has ended up being sold to someone else behind our backs. I know from personal experience that it can make one feel "seriously P****d off".
The other side of it is I personally have been burned by doing someone a favour just for them to take advantage of it. I remember selling one rifle to this one guy who was very interested in it. He didn't have much for funds but it was the same time of rifle his family used back in WWI and was very interested in the history of it so I sold it for what I had in it (even though the price had gone up significantly). Not even two weeks later he had it up for sale for twice what I sold it to him for. Leaves a bitter taste in your mouth afterwards.Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Three
Sounds familiar and as I am only a few miles from you I wonder if it was the same guy.:clap:
He could not live without a rifle I had so when I did finally did sell it he sold it to a guy waiting in a car at the end of the street.
How's them apples.
I understand that possibility; but I was always taught that it is important to keep your word.
During the same period, I agreed to sell my 1973 Kawasaki Z1 to a friend of my brother in-law, who lives in Ireland. We agreed on a price 2 years ago just as Covid was kicking off. So he could not travel to France and get it. He hasn't paid a deposit, and I've been offered more for it locally.
But I gave my word, so I will wait. I'll give him a fair chance to complete when Covid esses off to allow travel. If it gets to the point where I think he's taking the ****. I'll tell him. But I won't be changing the price agreed. That may seem dumb to some people; but there's more to life than money.
I wouldn't have thought that putting the Jeep in an auction would achieve significantly more than you originally offered for it. If the owner has decided to put it in an auction then I would try and buy it from that auction, if I really wanted it. If the owner ended up being out of pocket, which could happen, due to seller's premium etc and no-one else wanting it, it will be their hard luck. If you can't get to the auction then you could probably be able to phone/internet bid.
I may go to the auction, I am waiting to see the catalogue. But the auction is Retro mobile Paris. It's one of the big classic car auctions. So attracts millionaire buyers for the multi million euro cars on sale. The Jeep will probably be the cheapest thing there. But probability of some rich git buying it just so his 5 year-old and sit in it and play soldiers is high!
I would have parted with one of my Dukes to secure a Jaffa!
Well I got some good news today!
I spoke to my boss today regarding the Jeep; because the auction has been postponed.
I raised my offer and she has accepted. So I'm really happy about that. :dancingbanana:
Now we need to sort out the paperwork etc.
Looking forward to getting it home! it needs a little bit of work but is complete.
Delighted for you.........that's great news. Now get it home in your garage asap!
Winner!! Congrats to you and the Jeep since it is going to a good home!
... and make sure to post pictures once you got it :beerchug:
Oh dear, how sad, never mind.Quote:
Originally Posted by 30Three
That's excellent news that you got the Jeep. I thought that you still had a chance of getting it provided that you "stayed positive".