Australian FTR’d Enfield Question.

I just received an interesting SMLE No1 MkIII*.
1918 BSA that appears to have been FTR’d in Australia in 1943 and 1945.
The stock is marked MA Lithgow 1943 and MAO 6/45.
All if the wood furniture is Slazengers marked with dates from 1942-1945.
Serial number is stamped in the stock.
The bolt and receiver are BSA and matching.
The cocking piece has been replaced and is OA marked (Orange).
The bolt head has been replaced and is BA marked (Bathurst).
The nose guard is BSA but not numbered.
The barrel is OA and dated 6 ‘45 but wasn’t stamped with the serial.
Swivel band and trigger guard are MA stamped (Lithgow).
Magazine is OA marked.
There are BSA and GR proof stamps on the receiver and numerous Lithgow and Orange proof stamps on the barrel and remaining components.

I have read about the Orange arsenal but have never seen anything from there. Nice to have a rifle that appears to have had its final FTR there using a number of components made there.

Any significance or are “Orange” rifles and parts still common?

Orange and. Bathurst where feeder manufacturing plants when they ramped up making more rifles .all are about the same distance from sydney .

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Originally Posted by Thunderstreak

I just received an interesting SMLE No1 MkIII*.
1918 BSA that appears to have been FTR’d in Australia in 1943 and 1945.
The stock is marked MA Lithgow 1943 and MAO 6/45.
All if the wood furniture is Slazengers marked with dates from 1942-1945.
Serial number is stamped in the stock.
The bolt and receiver are BSA and matching.
The cocking piece has been replaced and is OA marked (Orange).
The bolt head has been replaced and is BA marked (Bathurst).
The nose guard is BSA but not numbered.
The barrel is OA and dated 6 ‘45 but wasn’t stamped with the serial.
Swivel band and trigger guard are MA stamped (Lithgow).
Magazine is OA marked.
There are BSA and GR proof stamps on the receiver and numerous Lithgow and Orange proof stamps on the barrel and remaining components.

I have read about the Orange arsenal but have never seen anything from there. Nice to have a rifle that appears to have had its final FTR there using a number of components made there.

Any significance or are “Orange” rifles and parts still common?

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That rifle sounds like it may have been one of the returned replacement rifles lent to G B at the beginning of WW1. Or a bring back by the Aussie army from the war.
Which ever it was it was in bad shape to be left that long before it was FTRd

Yeah guys look the commmonwealty troops didn’t start out with aussie rifles at first a lot where British issued rifles and when they got manufacturing up and running they made it to aussie troops ie 1915 .our early 1913 and 1914 lithgows needed up spread out amongst the commonwealth troops . I have 3 1914 lithgows and they all ended up in different service first one ended up being FTRed in india 1932 they didn’t scrub the receiver and kept the original serial number 3780 on all parts they added to it , then i have 5669 that needed up in british service and had various updates up until 1936 then probably was issued out during ww2 to English forces the third one stayed with aussies and post Ww 2 ended up in Austrian police force . I have several 1915 and 1916s that have a mix of ma/oa/ba parts on them either screws sights and trigger parts all ftred in the 1950s .

I have a 1917 BSA No1 mkIII* that has D Broad Arrow D Australian markings and was FTR’d by Lithgow in 1957 with a new barrel and Slaz Coachwood. The bolt is BSA and the nose cap and stock, etc are stamped with the serial. It has OA and MA parts here and there. Sounds similar to your rifle, Thunderstreak.

I haven’t taken this rifle apart yet but strangely, I don’t see a D Broad Arrow D marking on it. Wonder why that was not done, unless it’s hidden under the stock somewhere.

Here are the receiver markings on my BSA. The D Broad Arrow D and the FTR are very prominently displayed.
Multiple inspector's marks on the stock but no serial number. The nosecap is a Bathurst but was marked with the original serial. The trigger guard is an Orange.
I was mistaken, it is a 1918 not a 1917.

No “FTR” stamp and no “D Broad Arrow D” on mine.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...b3d95d_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...da0714_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...8c3d4c_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...95eea1_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...777c42_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...808881_z-1.jpg

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...909c92_z-1.jpg

Very similar, although FTR’d quite awhile apart!
I believe they didn’t start marking FTR on the receivers until after WWII. I’m sure someone more qualified than me can verify that. ;)

I believe the first use of the FTR mark at Lithgow was in 1950. Prior to that, refurbished rifles usually had the moth and year stamped into the butt. Example R over MA over 7/45 for a rifle refurbished in July 1945. Placement of the serial number on the barrel and rear sight had been omitted in Australian production by 1945, even on new rifles. A lot of refurbished rifles will be void of serial numbers except for the bolt and receiver. The MAO stamp relates to Orange (name of the town) production. The plant at Orange was originally set up as a feeder factory for parts however new rifle production/assembly was moved there during WWII and didn't move back to the main Lithgow plant until around the end of the war. Might have been just after the war, can't recall the exact year. Most refurbished rifles I've seen have the R over MA and year stamp, indicating repairs at Lithgow. I'm taking a guess that your rifle may have been refurbished at Orange? Someone with more knowledge may chime in to clarify. It's totally normal to find refurbished rifles from English manufacturers as well as a mix of Australian and English parts used during repair. I have 1944 Lithgow SMLE that went through FTR in 1950 where an English barrel was fitted. The barrel was then marked with Lithgow acceptance marks.

At the tail end of WW2 OA had quite a substantial workforce that would have to be re employed in other industries once wartime small arms production ceased.

Following representations from various parties, it was decided that rather than flood the employment market, the release of employees would be done gradually.

To keep the retained staff occupied, an unofficial FTR program was implemented bringing rifles that were formerly deemed not financially viable for repair up to a serviceable standard using whatever parts were available. As the program was unofficial, in addition to reducing costs, standards were lowered so that many parts that would have been replaced during a proper FTR were re used.

When Bogan Gate was emptied out in the late '80s many of these rifles came onto the market and whilst a dedicated collector would turn their nose up at them as most didn't conform to the norm, they were perfectly good rifles.

If you come across a tidy example with staked screws, a late wartime OA barrel, a scraped English butt and top wood, a late wartime SLAZ fore end and a mix of new and old smaller parts such as sights, trigger guard, cocking piece etc. don't write it off as a backyard put together. It could well be one of the OA refurbished rifles.

It's one of the 101,000 rifles sent out in 1919-1921 under the 'Imperial Ordnance Program'. These were sent out to replace rifles that Australia had used in WW1.

I note some little inaccuracies in some of the other comments;

- "rifles lent to G B at the beginning of WW1" There was no such thing done. Australia took over all its stock of SMLEs from Nov 1914 until Oct 1915.
From Oct 1915, Britain took over the issuing of rifles to Australians when they landed in Egypt. In early 1916, those heading to France handed in their rifles for newer HV rifles and those older Mk.VI sighted rifles (Lithgows too) were then sent back to Britain for refurb and handing back out to whom needed them.
At the end of WW1, Australia handed in all its rifles and returned empty handed and from 1919 onwards, new rifles arrived and were handed out to the MDs (Military Districts).

- "didn’t start out with aussie rifles at first a lot where Britishicon issued rifles and when they got manufacturing up and running they made it to aussie troops ie 1915"
The AIF certainly did take Lithgows with them to Gallipoli etc. It wasn't until 1915 that production was in a decent enough state that the troops training in Australia were able to be armed for training. Prior to the decision to keep sending rifles overseas, Australian stocks of SMLEs were that low that there was a danger of
running out of rifles here. That's why Britain said they would take over the issuing of rifles in Egypt after pleading from Australia to help out.

I have my theory about the FTR marked rifles. Here's my theory - - - The D^D and A^F were marked as such as they were being allocated to specific service for National Service. It's just my theory but the 1950 - 1959 refurb dates match perfectly with National Service and subsequent huge ordnance efforts to get rifles refurbed for that at Lithgow due to a lack of ordnance staff capable of equipment maintenance in the newly established CMF units.

mattyboy82 thank you, very nice to know how, why and when it made it’s way from the UK to Australia .
At what stage were the wartime rifles stamped with the D^D?
Any significance to my rifle not being stamped?
The 6 ‘45 stamped barrel looks “new” inside and out suggesting to me limited use after it’s last rebuild.
Perhaps just stored away instead of going back into service?
It definitely has an interesting mix of Australian parts with very few remaining British components.

Great info from all, thank you!