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Afternoon all, what do we make of this?
I've only ever seen one other Faz made L1A1 and that was converted into an instructional action.
https://www.enfieldguns.com/l1a1-fazaerley
The receiver appears original, I think the TMH is a renumbered replacement. I'll guarantee the bolt group isn't original either, electro penciled replacements.
£7,500!!
Now that's 'a lot' of money for what only really amounts to a Faz receiver, even if it's very rare...
The serial number indicates that 53,118 L1 rifles were built at FAZ by 1959...
I would suspect that if the F59 marking at the magazine well is real, that someone at Enfield F'd up the E in the serial number coding.
Although the F59 at the serial number looks different than the rest of the serial number.
This is the same company that blatantly forged an L42 a couple of years ago and, when outed on here, ground the stamping down and re-did it to try an make it more convincing.
Caveat Emptor
Unfortunately, we all know what happened to the boy who cried wolf!Quote:
Originally Posted by Roy W
It makes you cast doubt on everything that comes from the same source....
---------- Post added at 09:03 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:56 PM ----------
That's a very good point, although the Faz markings look correct, you have to seriously doubt that many rifles being made..Quote:
Originally Posted by Lee Enfield
I doubt they assembled more than 100 examples...
Waiting for KtK and PL to pitch in, looking increasingly doubtful though....
What are the odds of an example surviving in perfect condition from the early years of a weapon that had a long and VERY busy service life. (Of course there are exceptions, but still....)
And I have never even heard of a UF-marked TMH turning up over here in the US. If any existed, I expect word would have gotten around, even as simple as a picture of one posted on a forum asking "what builder is UF??"
I haven''t read all of the guff that the advert puts out. The dates just do not stack up. Fazakerley were incapable of producing the rifle to any sort of timed schedule and BSA were approached to take up the slack. Production was to be an all ROF matter - like the pirated Sterling! BSA were approached early on regarding possible production if Faz failed to make any headway. They failed and by 1958 BSA production started in 1958 (UB 58A 121xxx was mine) so it begs the question that if BSA were already successfully taking over the the Fazakerley production AND the Faz L1A1 rifle manufacturing tooling was already on its way to Lithgow, why on earth would Faz be making L1A1 rifles in 1959.
There are no government records of ANY L1A1 rifle production at Fazakerley. And I never saw one either. A rifle was considered produced as an accountable item when the body - the master component - was numbered, in the white, just prior to being sent for proof and phosphating
FAZ did continue production of many parts and for many years, the UF or F58 marking could be seen on Lithgow made rifles along with some FAZ parts. ALL early cracked gas cylinders came from the doomed FAZ factory which was known to us as ROF-6
Cheers Peter, isn't it interesting...Quote:
Originally Posted by Peter Laidler
Somewhere here ( if someone cares to look) there's a picture of a skeletonised L1A1, with Faz markings on the receiver I came across on the web a while ago.
It's the only evidence of a (possibly) complete Faz example I ever came across.
I wonder if this started as an unused Faz marked body and it's been built up and marked as such for 7,500 good reasons?!
Allegedly, the same dealer had a magically renumbering L42 a while back, so it doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to put 2 and 2 together..... Again, allegedly......
Is it this post of yours John? Sadly the picture on here is no more, I imagine disappeared as part of the great image loss problem suffered here.
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=62407
That's the one Kev .... I'm away at the moment, I'll see if I can find the image on my office Pc when I get back mate...Quote:
Originally Posted by desperatedan
I have the picture in question, just no way to upload it. I also have at least one photo of an undated Faz receiver that was completed as an Enfield rifle.
Also, I've seen a fair number of Faz small parts here in the States over many years, some furniture, and some magazines (I have three or four), but I think I've seen no more than three marked barrels at most.
The first line of the advert does state "Unbelievable Rare and almost certainly the one only in existence".
Faz small parts and woodwork are commonly found, charging handles and forends in particular.
I've never seen a Faz barrel and gas block, that would be interesting to upload for the group...
Make of that what you will Geoff....:rolleyes:Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
I finally found the SKN Faz cutaway L1A1 after a little web searching.
Take a look down in the pics, left side close up of the receiver, there is an unmistakable F60 stamp...
Cut away L1A1. | GunLab (KnownHost)
Same dealer was recently trying to sell a No.4T with some BS background story of it being a D-Day Royal Marine Commando used No.4T.......but saying it was a RM unit that wasn't even in Normandy on D-Day :lol:
Taking a quick glance at the pictures I would say museum quality is somewhat of an exaggeration.
The wear (shiny exposed metal) on the carrying handle and the various axis pins on the body do not fit with the rifles body/TMH wear.
The safety catch has had a somewhat poor weld repair. The repair in its self was common, just this is not very tidily executed, perhaps we always had very skilled and competent metal smiths. If this rifle is as it states it would be unlikely to have a repaired safety catch.
The body locking catch is poorly fitted, suggesting it was plugged and played without the normal fitting one would expect. I would not expect it to leave the factory like this.
In front of the body locking catch you can see a darker area where the body locking catch once covered, indicating a refitted catch.
The rivet, to the side of the S on the TMH has been worked. When leaving the factory the rivet head would have have been invisible, however with time some of the rivets loosened and were re-tightened as evidenced here.
From the photograph it looks like there is a trace of a previous serial number, certainly a previous marking.
In the 1st photo the upper TMH rivet shows signs of loosening.
As both TMH rivets show signs of loosening I would conclude that this TMH has seen more life that perhaps suggested.
The hand guard screw doesn’t look correct, though it maybe.
The butt plate is poorly fitted.
The front sight is situated very high, if zeroed, I would be questioning a slightly bent barrel, possibly the sight just put in randomly.
The nut gas cylinder shows signs of having been done/undone, possibly indicating a gas cylinder repair/replacement or carrying handle replacement.
In the 4th photo it looks like the body hinge pin is in backwards.
I would love to get my hands on this and conduct a proper examination.
this is for sale in the UK as a section 1 firearm,, any original L1A1 would be section 5 !
So the barrel must be new made with no gas vent,
And in theory the receiver remains section 5 unless it was never made into a complete L1A1 within the UK
Any Section 1 L1a1 in the UK must be made from a parts kit to be legal
Now where have I heard that before............ I haven't even bothered to look on the associated site, as stated in one post , the L42 that was in question some time back didn't really do that business any good and said it all in my eyes.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
Many years ago some members may remember the Rifle I bought from a dealer (see link for that post) ,
https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=24836
I returned the rifle as it was a complete lash up and got my refund, it was from a collection of the late Chris Barber that a Northern dealer was trying to sell on behalf of the family, after a lot of re search the collection was mainly fake, forged etc, a few members here contacted me with further details of other such rifles that were sold from that collection.
So roll on a few years, I had an email from someone (who now runs the company with the rare L1A1 for sale) who had just started working for an established "Enfield " company at the time , regarding the rifle that I posted about, I give all the information I could which was quite a bit and it basically proved what a pile of shite Chris Barber had ....... but all this fell on deaf ears and the rifle was for sale with an extra 0 on the end.
Roll on a lot more years and I banned the said person from any correspondence or any buying from my ebay account early in the year, due to something I was selling .......but thats another story.
Why such dealers go to such great depths of typing up so much crap to sell something is beyond belief............ making a few ££ fair enough, but a straight pull L1A1 made from a parts kit for £7500 someone is pulling something .......