Printable View
I have a chance to pick up 2 brass 105MM howitzer cases. They're not damaged but show some verdigris and heavy tarnish on 'em. I don't want to overpay but I don't want to rip off the estate either. They were both blank cartridges I believe and post war. What do you guys think would be a fair market value?
Pictures would help, especially as the the level of tarnish.
I had a heck of time loading up the pics but here ya go!Quote:
Originally Posted by Sapper740
i'd say around $50 at a show in the US. Better if an actual WW II dated shell case. Maybe say $65US for both??? I am not sure how hard to find in Canada???
I wouldn't go more than $20 each. They aren't uncommon, especially post war. Antique shops will slap $100 on them and they never sell. Even a WWII stamped one wouldn't bring that much.
I have half a dozen 105's, one casing is wrapped steel, kind of like that one pastry dough container you tap on the counter to open up. I don't think I paid more than $20 for any of them.
I agree with Aragorn, here in Canada they don't sell for much. Even if you look at Collector Source they aren't expensive and his prices are times two or three. You can get one in nice shape from "Tristainium" on Canadiangunnutz" for about $25 each. Don't go more than you need to. I collect that very thing...
If you had cropped the edges off and reduced the image size to just the shell case the pics would have loaded much quicker and easier. When taking photos that I want to upload onto this website I leave plenty around the item that I want to photograph which I then crop off during editing. The image then seems to upload easily.Quote:
Originally Posted by lawrence_n
If you wish to resell those shell cases for a profit you won't want to pay much at all for them otherwise you'll be stuck with them or be forced to sell them at a loss. If I was looking to buy them in the UK for my collection I wouldn't want to pay more than £20 to £25 per case.
I did wonder if that 2nd pic showed a shell case with a live cap but it looks as if it may have been lightly struck. Before buying a shell case I always check to make sure that the cap has been struck as they do sometimes turn up unstuck even in antique shops. I always decline shell cases with unstuck caps.
You might be missing out on a lot of good cases as many were fired electronically. If the interior fuze is fried, it's been fired.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
Those are an electric/percussion primer and they just like that. They're fired, the firing pin doesn't leave the same indent as smaller stuff. If you saw the schematic of the primer, you'd see it immediately.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
Yes thanks, I do examine shell cases carefully, inside and out before, purchase. Unless I am completely satisfied that the item in question, in this case shell cases, is completely FFE and this includes a fired cap, I don't purchase. The last shell cases that I noticed being offered for sale, a while ago, with unstuck caps/primers were a pair of 50 cal cases. In my opinion the caps/primers were still live and therefore I didn't buy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
The point that I was trying to make is that shell cases do sometimes turn up for sale (in the UK) with live primers. That is why I examine carefully and don't buy if they do.
Wouldn't bother me in the slightest. I have live 50 cal rounds. I probably wouldn't want a live large caliber round simply due to the hazard the explosives could be if someone struck the primer but I don't sweat the small stuff.
Likewise, I have a 25mm live TPT but that's the biggest. .50 cal too but just simple stuff. The small stuff is all live but I have license for that presently. All the heavy ord would be too dangerous to have live in any form.
I would assume that a shell case with a live primer is not legal to own in the UK under current UK laws.
I only buy items that I am sure are legal to own in the UK.
Pretty sure you're right there...Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
Why assume, you live there, look it up. From what I understand, it probably is illegal but I'd want to know for sure if I lived there. But by the same token, if you're at a show somewhere and someone is selling a shell casing that has an electronic primer that doesn't look fired, it would be illegal for them to have it themselves if that were the case.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
Just saying you're losing out on a lot of potential collectibles. A lot of my larger shells are fired electrically.
Just because someone is offering an item for sale doesn't necessarily make it legal to own. What other collectors do is up to them but I always examine carefully before purchase and only go ahead with the purchase if I am completely satisfied that the item is safe and also legal to own in the UK. If it's a shell case that has a struck primer then I know I'm ok to purchase but a shell case with an un-struck primer, which don't turn up that often, I don't buy.Quote:
Originally Posted by Aragorn243
The 2nd part of your question, it is also up to the seller of an item to ensure that the item in question is legal to own in the UK and, therefore, legal to sell.
Yes and my point being, an electronic primer is NOT struck. You can tell if it's been fired by looking inside the casing. If it's a small caliber shell, 50 cal or less, they need to be struck so if those are illegal in the UK, then you don't buy. Probably a third of my large shell cases have unstruck primers but all have been fired electrically.
I don't buy shell cases with un-struck primers. Whether a shell case with a fired electronic primer is legal or not doesn't arise with me because I wouldn't buy it if the primer is un-struck in any case.
Most of my shell cases are WW2 or earlier.
It would be interesting to know when electronic primers came into use, anyone?
electronic primers were extensively used by the Germans in WWII. Luftwaffe MG 131 were electrically fired. So, they were in use in WWII with increased changes following. Most large shells today are electrically fired.Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying10uk
So yes, in WWII most shells were still using chemical primers but post war the transition progressed at different rates in different nations.
If in doubt have a look into the shell case and look at the primer tube if its hollow and all the holes along its length are clear then that primer has been fired (Electronically) so is safe the inside will show obvious signs of combustion from the primer & propellant contents.
That's what Aragorn is alluding to that electric primers do not show the obvious indentations a standard primed shell will exhibit.
If you talking WWI ordinance then they were always a standard primer so obviously a look down the inside to see what gone on or not you can soon tell if a the round has been fired by that case I have a lot of WWI shell cases German, English & French all fired safe as houses.
Yes I do examine shell cases carefully, inside and out, before purchase as I explained in post 10.Quote:
Originally Posted by CINDERS
UPDATED; With some better pics of the bases. One of the shells was not a blank and still has the rod in the interior.
Canadian arsenals reloads. They both have the primer present but one has been hammered. Hard to say if it was percussion fired? Both are the percussion/electric primers. The "Rod" inside is the black powder ignition cartridge. They unscrew from the base of the primer, the whole affair can be reconditioned. I don't see where you get that they were blanks.
They were sold to me as blanks. The one with the ignition cartridge for sure was not a blank but I believe the other one was. I'll be putting them up for sale on my table at the Orangeville gun show this Sunday.Quote:
Originally Posted by browningautorifle
Usually blank is marked "BLANK" in either ink or hard stamp. Many are also cut down a bit. 105mm cut down are less than half their original length.
I think I have a blank somewhere in my collection, it is both cut down and marked blank.
Dug this is one out that I have had for quite some time now.
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...27124806-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...27124833-1.jpg
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...27124900-1.jpg