4 (T) Sling Storage in No. 15 Transit Chest

I've found only minor discussion about whether the M1907 sling should be attached to the 4 (T) while in the transit chest, but if it's attached the rifle doesn't fit in the cradles. Hope somebody here has the true gen on this matter--not earth-shattering, but interesting.

The Artiozen website (The Collection for No4T Sniper - CES (Complete Equipment Schedule). and CESSI (Complete Equipment Schedule Supplementary Issue) - Going Beyond the Chest...) has what he states are the CES lists for Apr 42, Oct 44, and Aug 45. The 1942 and 1944 lists specifically state the sling was to remain attached, while the 1945 list drops the requirement.

Logically it makes no sense for “transit” chest to be considered a “combat" or “operational” piece of gear, particularly given how much that sucker weighs when fully loaded! Therefore one would think there was no operational need to keep the sling actually attached to the rifle while in the chest.

BUT. Logic and military practice are...sometimes...rather far apart (ahem).

Apr 42 CES:
Attachment 138108

Oct 44 CES:
Attachment 138107

Aug 45 CES:
Attachment 138106

The Aug 45 list may or may not be “postwar” since the shooting stopped in the Pacific that month. Maybe reduced readiness meant it was no longer felt necessary to keep the rifle in "readiness," but this is pretty idiotic reasoning.

When the sling is configured for the shooter's correct length then coiled and stored at the bottom of the Transit Chest, everything fits. Furthermore, reattaching the sling takes all of 5-8 seconds, which doesn't sound too troublesome if the Chest was not carried into combat(!)

Anybody have the unvarnished truth about what WW II snipers really did with their slings?

Quote:

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Originally Posted by tj214

The Aug 45 list may or may not be “postwar” since the shooting stopped in the Pacific that month.

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Can't help with the original question, but the Aug 45 list is definitely wartime, since it takes forever for such documents to work their way through the system. It was probably drafted in January!

You are right, the block that holds the rear of the gun down definitely won't clear with the sling underneath. I didn't want to spend too much time on loosening up my sling as I keep it as tight as possible, but I think there is room to tuck the sling in on the side such that the block will drop down flush?

Not in my chest. I tried all sorts of contorted configurations and none worked; on top of that I don't want to put my in-good-shape original 1918 sling through too many gyrations.

My current solution, until somebody proves I'm "doing it all wrong" is to simply disconnect the two hooks and coil the sling before placing in the bottom of the chest. As mentioned, reconfiguring on the rifle takes only a few seconds.

Trog: Agree it's almost impossible for the Aug 45 CES to have anything to do with the end of the war, but it's interesting the "requirement" to leave the sling attached was dropped some time in late '44 or early '45.

I've also wondered whether the CES "requirement" was one invented by the stores troops or whether the operational snipers were consulted. God knows that in my two decades plus of service I NEVER saw a requirements disconnect between the rear echelon types (REMFs) and operators!

All versions of sling have been found to foul the partition blocks - Original slings have been observed coiled in the right hand partition pocket - along with other odds and ends - these had been out service and in the customer market a long time tho. Some collectors leave the sling on the butt swivel and coil under the rifle into the right partition pocket.
H

Good timing to see this question. I don't have a transit chest for mine, but my friend has them for his two. I'm going to borrow one and copy it to make one for mine. Since I won't care about perfect authenticity, I can make sure I have room for the sling.

If you don't care about authenticity, the mod should be super simple. Just cut a flat-bottomed "U" shaped cutout at the bottom of the curved portion of each batten (cradle) that's slightly wider than your sling (presumably M1907 or knockoff) and deep enough to accommodate the thickness of your sling, which will depend on how you have the sling configured. Account for the thickness of the padding that will be glued into place to protect the rifle's stock and you should be good to go. Since the battens are removable, you can even make a mistake or two and simply cut new ones until you get the correct fit.

Also remember the batten top and bottom pieces are designed to hold your rifle securely in place when everything is closed up. Cutting a slot for your sling could affect this rigidity, but again since the battens are removable you can experiment to get the results you want.

Note that by cutting a sling slot, you will almost certainly be creating four pressure points against your rifle's stock (two on each cradle) with the potential to mar the wood. This may not bother you, but be aware of the possibility.

Also, thanks to forum member Badger, plans for the chest can be found at https://www.milsurps.com/content.php...S.A.-No.15-Mk1. Several places online sell modern or repro metalwork, handles, and padding for the chest, so your woodworking project shouldn't be too difficult.

Artiozen has detailed instructions for constructing a chest (Recreating SANo 15 Transit Chest Components), and I heard he also sells a full-up repro if you want to avoid all the work.

I got my repro chest from Kerry Barker, and it's gorgeous. He makes them as a hobby so don't know whether he has any available or will be making more soon. He's on this site so you might be able to contact him here.

I let the sling out and if the rear strap is positioned centered under the buttstock, the rifle fits into the chest fine. If you double it up by keeping the sling tight on the rifle, it won't fit. I've had a quite a few No.4Ts through here and never saw the problem. I've never had to remove a sling to get the rifle to fit in the chest.

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Originally Posted by Brian Dick

I've never had to remove a sling to get the rifle to fit in the chest.

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I should have been more precise in my comments. I remove the sling since it's an original 1918. In rather good condition, but I don't want to stress it any more than necessary. Loose coil to fit under the rifle in the right pocket won't overstress it so I'm satisfied.

I keep the aftermarket M1907 sling by Hunter in the chest removed but configured for stable firing as I learned half a century ago (ouch). I could remove it from the front swivel and coil under the butt, but I just...don't.

Hunter for shooting, original 1918 for display.

In the REAL: world of Armourers shops and armouries, the rifles were usually kept in the chest, however the user/sniper wanted it ti be....., sling on or off! If he wanted it left on, positioned for him, he'd get the box altered, usually by slimming down the top of the obstructing 'chock'. Neither he nor the Armourers worried too much about the authenticty of collectors 70 years later it has to be said.

And in the armoury, tonly the arms storeman woud have the key to the chest that would be opened so that the weekly orderly Officer arms check could be undertaken

Eureka! Now we know. Thanks, Peter. You were there and (most of) the rest of us weren't.

[QUOTE=Peter Laidler;544451] he'd get the box altered, usually by slimming down the top of the obstructing 'chock'.


Anybody have any examples of this to share?

Nothing to see really. The top of the front and/or rear chocks were filed down with a rasp until the lid closed down. Remove the string that prevents the chock being lost first though.

I seem to remember that the same applied to certain 'calibrated' Bren guns too. These were the certified guns used for overhead fire during battle inoculation that would fire over the crunchies. The guns were certified as 'FIT FOR OHF' so that no rounds would fall short due to gun defects. These guns were locked in the chests and not used in normal training. Only for OHF.

The last Vickers in use in the UK were also certified for OHF use until they were replaced by the L7/MAG58's after a long trial to see whether the L7/MAG58 was up to the job and replace the maestro of OHF.... The Vickers