Ive shown this SA/GAW 1-44 M1 before..its got traces of a black paint, in some places, including the sling brass..
Any ideas? New crowd here?
Andy
SA144 pictures by AndrewG1957 - Photobucket
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Ive shown this SA/GAW 1-44 M1 before..its got traces of a black paint, in some places, including the sling brass..
Any ideas? New crowd here?
Andy
SA144 pictures by AndrewG1957 - Photobucket
What kind of response are you looking for? And what do you mean by the term "original"? That word can mean different things to different people.
Looks like a honest original gun (less black paint) and I wish it were mine. When refering to M1's, I can take the word "original" in only one way.
I was just wondering what the members think of the rifle? Why would the black finish have been there, and does it effect the value?
Andy
Here we go one more time. Rather than concoct my own definition of "original", I went to an online dictionary for the definition: belonging or pertaining to the origin or beginning of something, or to a thing at its beginning: The book still has its original binding.. Andrew's rifle looks like it has all the components of an M1 produced in 1944. Is it original? Well, the addition of black paint should serve to settle that question. But even if the paint were not there, who can certify that this rifle has not been altered since it was produced 65 years ago? It has passed through many hands since then.
I don't know if anyone can answer the question as to why the paint is there. It could have been applied by most anyone. It is obviously not original to the rifle. Does it affect the value? Most likely, but how much is difficult to say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Garandrew
Andy, First off, nice looking example of WW2 rifle. Barrel date of 1-44 is correct. As best I can tell from the pictures the other parts look to be period correct. One thing I might question would be the gas cylinder lock screw. In Duff's book S/N 2466215 has the poppet valve style.
As far as it being "original", as rongee already said, that's hard to say. If all parts are period correct and wear patterns match it becomes an educated guess for anyone. The more M1s a collector has examined and the more "known" originals rifles he has seen ,the better the guess, but, in most cases, a guess never the less. Either way, still a nice rifle most would love to own.
Oh, the paint. Who knows ? All you know for sure is that it don't belong there. Maybe you can remove it.
Semper Fi, Joe
Single slot lock screws can be found on original guns made in mid 1944. I have an original 2.9 with a single slot screw. I think most were changed to the Poppet style because it was necessary to use with grenades and the change was so simple.
The description by war correspondent Ernie Pyle of a Normandy rifle armory told me everything I needed to know about wartime rifle originality. It used to be on Jousters but I found a page containing it HERE. It starts half way down on page 187.
Bob
I doubt there were few if any "original" rifles that saw combat. There are original rifles however that were issued to non combat personnell and did not go through a rebuild.
Difficult to say, this SA 2.7 mil with a SA 4-44 bbl came out of an estate sale from a remote area about twenty years ago. My friend bought the few rifles and was able to sell everything except this M1. The left side was without any finish and the bottom of the front handguard was chipped-up and the rear handguard cracked. The stock had dents but nothing broken. Nobody would buy this rifle, the bore was nice but the TE was 4.5. I did a data sheet on this rifle - everything was correct. (examples bolt -12SA heat lot S-A1<>, op rod rev 9 SA uncut, trigger guard milled, hammer -5 SA, safety SA_11, gas cylinder screw single slot. Stock has a very faint SA GAW.
I fired ten clips of mixed 1954 ball and AP, everything worked fine
Two obvious things to look for: Chrome on gas port pads, bright breach, and lock bar sights. One less obvious thing often overlooked is a bright accelerator pin.
This rifle did not have any chrome at the gas port, rear sight had the type 2 lockbar.
Your right about that, in fact, looking at "SA Statement of Expeditures for Fiscal years 1944 and 1945", in Duff's WW2 book, SA manufactured 687,592 solid gas cylinder lock screws vs only 94,693 of the poppet valve type. I see Scott Duff states that it is " probable that SA continued to build new M1 rifles with the solid screw throughout most of the WW2 period."Quote:
Originally Posted by Devil Dog
Guess I should have read this before commenting. I most likly did, but the old retention span is not as it once was.:help: Semper Fi, Joe