remington A3

So I have a chance to pick up a remy A3 which is not a greek or VFW rifle. It is from an estate, and comes w/ a Raritan Arsenal box, somewhat rat-chewed from storage in a shed (the box, not the rifle), smaller than the CMP boxes now in use. The rifle appears to have original finish, green park receiver and blued bolt, sights, butt plate, etc. Unpinned mag plate, unlike the greek variants. I did not notice any dates on the box which would indicate delivery timeframe, will look closer when I pick it up on Monday. The seller, who is acting as agent for the widow, claims to have cleaned up copious quantities of cosmo from the rifle. It has the FJA and ord wheel on the S stock, all of the little proofs on the underside forward of the magwell, and a rack # stamped on the top side of the rear handguard. My initial inspection showed it to be a very nice rifle.
My questions:

Widow doesnt know the acquisition history. Were these rifles ever sold to the public out of Raritan?

Why would it have been there and not be reworked?

Cosmoline? Is that common on this type of rifle coming out of an arsenal?

I need to gauge the muzzle but it doesnt appear to have been shot a lot, brite and shiney w/ good rifling. Barrel seems to be in the proper date range. What would a rifle as described be worth, realizing a picture is worth a thousand words? I am getting a package deal along w/ an 831k Garand so I potentially dont have but $500 wrapped up in it (1300 for both, I think the Garand is worth more than half of that w/ original barrel, lockbar sites, uncut oprod) but was curious what the going rate might be for a non-CMP rifle.

Thank you in advance for your opinions.

I think for what you described - a more or less original Remington M1903A3 and a original Garand for $1300 total, you made out like a bandit!!

Many M1903A3s saw little, if any service. When they were sent to arsenals, they were checked for function and put into reserve (thus, the cosmolene). I can't speak for DCM-type rifles coming out of Raritan Arsenal, but it wouldn't surprise me.

Post some pictures of the M1903A3 (heck, I wouldn't mind seeing the M1, too!) when you can.

Thanks for the quick reply Rick, you are more like a library than a librarian!
I will post pics when I get them probably middle of next week, we are a little busy @ work.
Sad part is, something will have to go, to allow me to keep a part of this stash. I bought a 1924 Norwegian 45 from the same lady, posted it on the 1911 forum already. As I said there, I certainly didnt want to rip the widow, who knows what a dealer would have reamed her for, but the thought of breaking close to even while having something to show was on my mind, she seemed satisfied w/ the deal, obv as she went thru with it.
Still hanging is an AC42 P38, verrry clean 95+ % gun, w/ what I believe are replacement walnut grips. The guy obviously had good taste in weapons.

PS did the shawl (shudder) make the transition over here?https://www.milsurps.com/images/smilies/lol.gif

Sounds like a DCM gun with the correct shipping box. Guys actually buy those boxes. Hang on to the box. You did very well, good for you.

"...green park receiver..." Caused by long term storage in cosmoline.
"...Is that common on this type of rifle coming out of an arsenal?..." Yep. Like Rick says, out of the factory and covered(dipped usually) with cosmoline for storage. If the guy got all of it out(including the bolt), buy him a beer. He did you an enormous favour.
$1300 for 2 $800ish rifles is banditry. Don't think you need to worry about guaging either.

These rifles were never "sold to the public" out of arsenals. The way it worked was that NRA members would send their paperwork & payment to the CMP, which was a DOD office in Washington, DC. Once it was approved, CMP would send release papers to an arsenal, which would ship the rifle to the customer by Railway Express. 1903's & 1903A3's were sold in the early 1960's.

Folks in the military would sometimes arrange to pick up their guns at the arsenal in person. Also, some guns in quantities too small to offer to the public (1903A4's, target rifles, etc) were sold to those members of the military, government, & shooting groups, if they were "in the know".

For reference, I recently bought a rifle similar to the one you asking about:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...Item=122068122

Hey Neal,

I noticed in the GB description that the bolt is serialized. Does the number match the receiver? Can't see it in the photos.

Thanks,

LB

Yes, the SN on the bolt matches the SN on the receiver. Very strange. But, John Beard says that the bolt is a replacement, not original. I can't imagine that anyone in the US military would have numbered the bolt, maybe it was a previous owner. There's no indication this rifle was ever in the hands of some other country's military.

Very nice rifle Neal, looks like the one I'm picking up tomorrow.
Have to wonder about the auction. obvious from the buy-it-now price he was expecting more for it. I think the price he got for it was a bit low, although a good deal for you. But I wonder how much interest would have been generated if he had started it at a dollar, and left folks some room to fight over it. I have never been stuck by starting low, usually exceed my expectations. But I see alot of reluctance to bid on a "no reserve" auction where the starting price is actually the reserve.
The previous owner of the one I'm buying was a twenty year vet, and supposedly an armorer. Probably why the Norwegian 45 I picked up had a nice new parked P proofed HS barrel in it, dang it.

Hey Neal,

It's not a secret, but not everybody knows that the USMC electro-pencilled complete serial numbers on bolts. I guess some, not all, I mean the bolts. Can we see a photo? Replacement bolt can be a good thing for a USMC rifle. They are very special mixmasters. The serialized bolt is the only USMC characteristic I "Saw" on your rifle, but the Sherlock Holmes of the M1903/A3 might see something more.

Lancebear

OK, here's a photo of the serial number scribed on the bolt.


https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...03A3bolt-1.jpg

Doesn't appear to be electo-penciled.

Jim

agree, not arc engraved.

As to DCM direct sales, they DID take place. During the early 1960s, at the time the DCM was selling M1903A3s through the NRA. I went with my mentor at the time to the U.S.Army terminal, Bayonne, NJ. He was a NRA life member, and they allowed him to go through a pile (I mean in a pile) of '03A3s, pick one out, fill out a form and take it home. No charge for packing and handling, as there was none. Cash and carry. I became a member, went through the NRA, got an invoice, sent my money to the arsenal, got shipment from Letterkenny Depot. $14.50 plus REA collect. Still have it. Lost the box.

go to the photobucket link to see the box and after clean up pics

1903a3 BEFORE pictures by Selmalinapilchard - Photobucket

https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...100_1217-1.jpg

Hey Neal,

Thanks for the photo. The serialized bolt is a puzzle to me. The first four numbers apear to have been applied later than the last three and by a different hand? Have no clue.

LB

Hey Chuck,

Can you tell us what arc engraving is? Is that what the USMC used to serialize bolts as opposed to the electro-pencil? Never looked at my serialized bolt with a loupe, might have to take a look.

Lancebear

OK, this the closest my camera will get to the serial number. But, looking at it with a 10x jewelers loupe, I can see the dots within the numbers. So, that makes me think it was done with a vibrating engraver.

https://www.milsurps.com/images/imported/deleted.gif

Hey Neal,

Thanks for the additional photo. Do the numbers on your bolt feel raised to the touch?

Looked up arc engraving, it involves a battery or electrical hook up and a fine tipped point...guessing that it is a little like welding without adding metal, just moving it. The numbers on my bolt are neatly done. They feel raised to the touch and under a 16X loupe they look like a very fine welding bead. I could be wrong:)

The bolt would have been done in probably 1940 or 1941, that's when my rifle was put together by the USMC.

Lancebear