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I have a new extractor spring I like to install in the bolt. The M1 shop manual shows a fixture (which I don't have) being used to do this job. Just wondering is the fixture absolutely necessary? Has anyone rigged something up using a small vise that works? The shop manual also shows a fixture for compressing the hammer spring but I was able to use a vise and a couple pieces of wood to reassemble the trigger group.
You can use the M10 tool by inserting it in the chamber of your rifle to remove any parts of the bolt while it is still in the rifle. As an armorer, I used this tool quite alot on M1 rifles.
I drilled a 1/2" hole about 2" deep into the side (edge) of my work bench. I insert an '06 case that had 1/2 it's rim ground off. Wrap a rag around the back of the bolt and depress the ejector by pushing the bolt against the case. Once the ejector is depressed, pry the extractor with a screwdriver. The extractor should be lined up with the ground area of the case. You can re-assemble the same way.
You don't need a Bolt Tool.
An M3 or M10 Combo Tool or a screwdriver to pry out the extractor and something to push in the ejector (empty case, dowel rod, finishing nail driven into your workbench, etc) are all you really need.
Two tips:
-Disassemble inside a big plastic bag in case parts go flying
-Don't try to position the ejector perfectly for reassembly. Have the cutout slightly at an angle so the extractor shaft cams it into position
Reassembling the Trigger Group only requires average hand strength and practice.
The illustrated instructions at the "Garand Tech Info" link on the CMP site are pretty good.
Maury
I think that I'll get the bolt assembly tool, but I'll have to assemble parts freshly parkerized. If it weren't for that, I wouldn't probably get one. Most of the other methods not using the tool work pretty well, they are just not as simple or as quick as the tool, but they are cheaper.
Danny
I agree, no tool needed. Not like a carbine bolt! I don't use one for that either but I'm starting to think I should. My eyes ain't so good anymore nor are my fingers :crying:
I bought the tool from the CMP several years ago and never regretted the investment. As others have said you can take the bolt apart with other tools, but you must really watch for flying springs. I used a M3 once just to try it once and only once. It's just too easy with the tool. HTH:thup:
The M-14 Combination tool is the ideal thing to use. It's larger than the Garand tool, can get plenty of leverage. Not sure of the proper nomenclature.
For the Garand, nothing else is needed.
For the Carbine - YIKES!!!! Get a Bolt Tool.
I dun't need no stinking fixture! Used a piece of heavy duty scotch packing tape to hold the gizmo part with spring in place so it didn't fly out and go across the room. Bolt went back together with firing pin and the rifle actually function and didn't explode or anything.
It's fast...
It's quick...
It's simple to use...
Go with the bolt assembly tool...
I would get the tool. The one I have can be used for both the M1 and M14 bolts. It was well worth the price.:super:
I've used a screwdriver, an M10 tool both in the chamber and by hand, and an M14 tool I ordered by mistake. By far the M14 tool is the best, and it only cost five bux. Advantage of the M14 tool is that it has enough leverage to disassemble and reassemble the bolt. It'll keep the ejector depressed until the extractor can be pushed back into position.
Truth is, no special tool is required once ya know how it's done.
..and how is it done?
...vewwwy kerfoowy!
The reason there are few tools around is that there was never any tool provided for M1 bolt disassembly as there was for the carbine. Armorers or ordnance shops could built their own if it seemed worthwhile, but there was no issue tool.
Jim
Roger that last post. :-)
I have photos of the following US Ordnance tools
1) fixture, assembly, bolt 41-F-2987-260
2) assembly fixture bolt FSN 41-F-2987-260
3) Assembling and disassembling tool 7144859 M1 bolt
4) assembling and disassembling tool 7791607 M1 & M14 bolts
Some of these tools are very easy to use, photos are on Billy Pyle's book:
Ordnance Tools, Accessories & Appendages of the M1 Rifle
you don't need one for the carbine just 4 hands
No....you don't NEED an M1 bolt assembly tool to strip and rebuild the bolt....I've done it on the line between strings with a LEatherman....but it sure as shootin' is a tool you'll end up wanting unless you need excuses to exercise your vocabulary of 4-letter words!
I bought a bolt assemble tool right after I bought my first Garand and have never regreted the purchase.
needed...no
nice to have....yes
If you have a new park job you may risk scratching it without the tool. i got a used one for 25 bucks at a gun show a year ago and really like to have it around.
I just R&R'ed mine today. Only tool needed was a screwdriver to pop the extractor out on disassembly and to push the ejector back in on the reassembly. No special tools needed. Save your $$ for more ammo.
Jon
The M10 tool has worked for me. The link posted below shows hoe to use it w/ the bolt in the rifle. Easy.
http://www.rifle-company.com/phpbb/viewtopic.php?t=167
I have used the M10 tool on alot of rifles and to remove the firing pin, you can shake it out of the receiver through the bolt recess, you do not have to remove the trigger housing.
Sure ya'do! When you drop that damned little extractor spring into the action! Always happens!Quote:
Originally Posted by RCS
I use to play this game in the service: that I could remove then replace the firing pin in a M1 rifle without any disassembly of the rifle except for the bolt
Your point being? I can change glowing yellow brake-pads in a race car in less than 45 seconds....doesn't mean I go get things nice and hot before I change pads in the Dakota!Quote:
Originally Posted by RCS
FWIW, I've replaced busted extractors with the bolt in my M14 between strings at Camp Perry because I had to....not because it was the best way to do it, or even a very good idea. I've got a tool to do the job faster and better when I have the choice!
my point being - if you read my postings and were able to understand them -
is that you can disassemble the bolt, replace any parts in the bolt without disassembly of the M1 rifle except for the bolt
Okey Dokey...and my question that you haven't even attempted to answer was WHY? Even on a bedded comp rifle the job is MUCH easier with the bolt out of the rifle...you just pop out the trigger group and pull the bolt! So, unless you've got some other explanation, your little "skill" is in the same logical order as being able to peal an orange standing on your head....interesting but largely useless!Quote:
Originally Posted by RCS
I can field strip my M1 in the dark but I usually turn the lights on.
Stripping the bolt while still in the rifle is (for me) easier than w/ the bolt out. The rifle sitting in a rest functions as the 3rd hand I often wish I had.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Kepler
And a bolt assembly tool makes a second hand nearly unnecessary, let alone needing three! Also, a bench makes finding the nearly inevitable dropped/ejected extractor spring a lot easier to retain and find. However, lacking a bolt assembly tool, you are quite correct....in the rifle is easier than out.Quote:
Originally Posted by Old Schoolr
From the world's most cluttered garage, I was showing dissassembly to a buddy and, sure enough, the extractor spring goes sailing past the inert Triumph Spitfire and into the unknown.
I impressed the heck of my buddy [and myself] by finding that little old thing in two minutes. If I had not of found it then, it would of still been there when I gave the Spitfire away two years later.
Next week that buddy came over to help with something. Called me and suggested he might have a buyer for the Spitfire......He didn't realize it was gone!
All the times I stripped rifles after that event were in a closed room.
In high school ROTC some of the guys laid a helmet over the reciever when dissassbing bolts.
Paul
************************************************** ********Quote:
Originally Posted by RCS
Quote:
Originally Posted by John Kepler
Okey Dokey...and my question that you haven't even attempted to answer was WHY? Even on a bedded comp rifle the job is MUCH easier with the bolt out of the rifle...you just pop out the trigger group and pull the bolt! So, unless you've got some other explanation, your little "skill" is in the same logical order as being able to peal an orange standing on your head....interesting but largely useless!
************************************************** *******
What is the matter Mr. Kepler. You can't do this so you resort to sarcasm in an effort to belittle someone elses' skill. He never said it was the best way, he just said it was a game he played.
Of course I can do it....said so if you ever bothered to read what I wrote! It's just that outside of some fairly specific and relatively unique circumstances, its a DUMB and largely useless skill/trick that he was using to "impress" a Novice asking a legitimate question about needing to buy a bolt assembly tool!Quote:
What is the matter Mr. Kepler. You can't do this so you resort to sarcasm in an effort to belittle someone elses' skill. He never said it was the best way, he just said it was a game he played.
C clamp and a piece of 357 sig brass easy like cake:)
Actually I have seen a lot more useful information from RCS than I have from you. In fact he has been around Garands for 50 years. He has been collecting far longer than most of us and some of his information has been published in the GCA Journal and other well known reference books. I think his knowledge is a step above yours and I think it wrong to disrespect him just because he posted a tidbit he thought some of us would be interested in and you think it is DUMB and useless. The original poster got the information he was looking for a couple of pages back so it's not as if he was being mislead. Nothing wrong with disagreeing with someones post, but a little courtesy goes a long way.Quote:
Originally Posted by John Kepler
No special tool needed. If you just "have" to throw some $$ away you can throw it my way.
Jon
If you do A LOT of bolt disassembly, then get the tool. not needed if you're just doing onesey-twosey type disassembly.
Mike Doerner
Well I guess there are a couple different schools of though on this subject. Thanks to all who replied. Being a rookie with the M1 I think I'll pony up for one of the tools mentioned in this thread.
I think you need to step back for a bit John and look at how you answered. Maybe you were having a bad day and just stuck to your first post but it honestly was very rough when not needed. I have been friends with RCS for many years and have never seen him upset. I have seen him help many and do allot of good in the Garand world.
He is a founding member of the GCA and was featured in my article on the Barn Wood as a key player. He by far is not a idiot nor did he imply his way was the only way or best. He was talking of another way most do not know of and it works fairly well honestly. I hope you can understand where I am coming from? Rick B
Rick....You I know, him I don't. Nothing pejorative, just a statement of fact. This is a limited medium, all that's there is what's written. If it reads "condescending answer" to an obvious Novice question, waddaya do? If I misinterpreted what he wrote, then I humbly apologize. But Rick, you and I have met and talked on numerous occasions at Camp Perry...and I've also seen how often what you write is terribly misinterpreted by folks that only read you without knowing you. Like I said, this is a limited medium.
Can you disassemble the bolt in the rifle? Hell yes and I said so! Is it the "optimal" way to do it? Just as emphatically, no! A bolt assembly tool is a better alternative, particularly for a Novice from a couple different directions. Note....I said "better", not "only", not even "best"...though that's my own personal opinion.
"Field Assembly" as was being proposed risks mis-assembly (as in not quite getting the extractor spring seated correctly in the extractor notch, thereby launching the increasingly expensive and hard to replace extractor/spring/ejector into the Nether Regions shortly after firing begins....ask me how I know!), not to mention launching said parts into equally unpredictable places during the process (I mentioned that opening the trigger may as well happen at the start, since you'll need to open it anyway looking for the extractor spring you've inevitably dropped into the mangle!). Recommending bolt assembly in a controlled (contained) environment, using a device that replaces the "multiple" hands that the gymkhana being proposed does simply HAS to be the goal when answering a Novice question, wouldn't you think?
Hey, if you guys are going to keep this now useless thread open, you need to take it over to the 2nd Amendment and Politics Page.
That's where the Argue and Bicker forum is located. You guys can snipe each other there to your heart's content. You can even tell some tasteless jokes there too.
Moderator!!!!! Close this thread and lock it up tight. All questions have been answered.