I found one!
Ever wonder what happens when you blow up an 03 in the Marine Corps? You pay for it!:slap:
Jim
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I found one!
Ever wonder what happens when you blow up an 03 in the Marine Corps? You pay for it!:slap:
Jim
Sounds more like operator failure. I'm sure the rifle was just fine until he jammed mud into the barrel and then discharged it! He lost a third of his whopping $33 a month for three months for his trouble. Interesting to note that 25 years later pay had risen to a generous $50 a month!
What is amazing is that this is from the 6th Regiment in combat, about 1-month before Belleau Wood. Surely under the conditions they lived the Corps would have made an exception; but no, they were still as strict as ever.
Jim
Reminds me of the soldier in Vietnam, wounded and MedEvac'd. Someone threw his gear into the chopper. While the medic was working on him, the medic's foot kicked the rifle and out the door it went. After the soldier recovered he found that he'd been charged for the 'loss' of the rifle. Took the intervention of a US Senator to get the nonsense stopped.
lol that sucksQuote:
Originally Posted by Jim Tarleton
:sos: some one grab me another 03 :lol:
Were there conscripts in the U.S. Marine Corps at that time? If so I wonder if the poor bugger was one of them to boot?
In 1969 we lost a m16 out the door of a chopper,all 6 choppers landed and we found the weapon, ROTC training!
In 1973 a unit from the Canadian PPCLI was training with us at Ft. Wainwright, AK. One their troops lost a C1 submachinegun. They searched but did not find it. He paid for it. However, the next year, same unit, same AO AND the same troop found it. Just had a light coat of rust on it. Story was carried in all the post newspapers. Wonder if he got to keep it since he had already paid for it.
In 1974 we jumped into King Salmon, AK for a field exercise and one of our mortar maggots lost his .45. After the company, on line, made four sweeps of the DZ and we didn't locate it, we continued with the FTX. I think he paid for that also. The DZ was all muskeg so chances of finding it was slim to none anyways.
BEAR
Now gentlemen, with all this furor over lost weapons, be it in combat or no, how on earth was Cpl. Alvin York armed with a 1903 Springfield while the rest of his company was armed with M1917's?:madsmile:
Please do not tell me that the powers that were just "overlooked" his obviously improper unissued rifle.:bow: That just didn't happen. Sharpshooters were a dime a dozen in WWI.:super:
I have never believed that story that Col. York defied military protocol and carried a 1903 that would have stuck out like a sore thumb.:slap: I believe he was carrying his issued 45 and his issued M1917. If you review the path Sgt. Early took that day, York had no opportunity to pick up a 1903, because no AEF unit armed with 1903's had preceded them.:confused:
Jim
PS
I lost an M16 in RVN in combat and I paid for it. I am getting long in the tooth, but I think the price was $333.16.
"Col. York"? That was some promotion he must have got!! :D
Oops! Too much bore cleaner again. It was Cpl. York! The P and O keys are side by side, and it was a typo!
Jim
I purchased a WWI uniform at a Flea Market. Inside one of the pockets was a receipt. Dated 1919 and in France. The military receipt was for a watch.
My guess they guy lost it, and was forced to pay for it.
Jim, The marines were a lot tougher than the army if they made you pay for a rifle lost in combat! I got a jeep trailer load of M14's from a 1st Inf Div engineer bn (turned in for M16's) traded a VC flag and some Ho Chi Minh sandals for them. I had two unsigned for M16's, had the last one unassembled in my duffel bag when I was coming home, but that is another story. Weapons acountability was pretty slack from my perspective.
No one checked my rifle until I left. The serial number on my rifle did not match the one I was issued when I turned it in at Danang. They just took it out of my pay stateside. Through a mixup while I was in the hospital in RVN, I wasn't paid (MPC); but I evidently signed some document saying I had been paid. The amount I was supposedly paid exceeded my normal pay, so I owed the government a lot of money when I left RVN (more than I had been actually earned in RVN). That came out of my check stateside also. I may be one of the few Marines who paid to go to RVN!
I had my Company Commander and the Camp Pendleton Adjutant try to rectify the matter, but their efforts failed. I lived off base with three other Marines right behind the Oceanside Police Station, and I ate tacos and Boone's Farm Strawberry Hill wine for a year. I developed quite a taste for the tacos. The wine sucked, but it was cheap.
I still have my separations check. I never cashed it. It is less than $2 with travel pay (California to Mississippi). I hitchhiked home. The check is framed with my HD. I think it is $1.43, but to be honest, there is more to that story than I am telling.
Jim
Jim I have to sympathize with you on the pay. I was AirForce and got an extremely early out and hadn't built back enough leave time to make up for what I had used and most of my uniforms had been sent home. So when I processed out most of my last months pay was gone. I left Mcquire AFB on the evening of Nov 28 1971 with less than $10 in my pocket. It was a colfd hitch home.Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Tarleton
As far as lost weapons goes my cousin was a door gunner on a Huey in RVN and they were going into a hot LZ. It was raining and his mini jammed, instead of taking the time to clear it he said he grabbed his 16 and emptied the mag. When he tried to change the mag the wind ripped it out of his hand. When they returned to base he reported it as a combat loss and his 1st shirt said that since he wasn't technically in combat it couldn't be a combat loss and he would have to pay for it. He said that he wondered what his congressman would say about that. It was marked as a combat loss.
When checking out at Phu Bai in 1970, I turned in my 16 and other field gear. Couple of minutes later some supply sergeant was screaming and yelling that my records indicated that I'd never signed FOR the 16. So I simply asked "Does that mean I get to keep it?". He wasn't amused. :madsmile:
I was over at Camp SLO some years back and at the MOUT site I found an M16A2 with a 30 round magazine in it. It was leaning up against the live fire shooting house. The base commander was notified and he didn't want to believe that one of his boys could have left an M16A2 out in the field. I never found out what happened to the poor soul that left it out there.
Ouch! bet that never happened again!
Jim
JimQuote:
Originally Posted by Jim Tarleton
found this thought you might lilke.:thup:
https://www.milsurps.com/images/impo...715b23e4-1.gif
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v2...l/715b23e4.gif
Thanks, Loy. That is cool.
Jim
I don't know but I was told that at Long Bien in 1972 the engineers were digging a big-a$$ed hole for landfilling garbage, and found a burried M60 tank complete with main gun.
In the late spring of 1971, the Marines were dumping weapons and other stuff into the Bay of Danang. I made about three or four 5-ton truck load trips before I rejoined my unit (I was on walking wounded duty). We dumped what appeared to be new weapons including M60 machineguns. Bunch of grease guns. No ammo or M59's. Many of the weapons were still in wooden crates, some in what appeared to be plastic cases. No clue why they were dumped. I was told there were no TO cards for them. I don't know what a TO card is.
Saw no 782 gear, just small arms weapons (M79's, M16's, etc), refridgerators, typewriters, and stuff like that. We did pry open some of the crates looking for 45's. I found none, but one of the other drivers showed up with several 45's one night. They weren't new, and looked pretty old.
We were picking this stuff up from a warehouse very near the airport, because I kept seeing American Airlines planes taking off.
We off-loaded onto barges and the Navy pulled the barges out into the bay and we dumped the stuff overboard. Shot anything that floated with those crummy little grease guns (usually the refridgerators), then threw the grease guns overboard. I remember the grease guns didn't climb as much as I expected. We were only given one clip/magazine of ammo for each one (three men per truck).
One day I got to the dock before the barge, and I met these cheerful little kids who were hanging around. One had a horrific scar on his forehead. I asked him where he got it, and he said when the VC took over Danang (???). One of the kids was about 5 years old and he was smoking an OJ held in his left hand between his thumb and first digit with his little finger closest to his face (first OJ I ever saw). I took his picture and still have it. I asked them where they lived, and they pointed at what appeared to be a dump (landfill). Life was tough over there. I hope those kids made it, and I would love to meet them now as men.
Jim
Jim
One of my contractors was a Marine in nam. One day he said they were out on patrol and he said they ran across a very nicely dressed, fully armed dead nva officer. He said they proceeded to pick souvenirs off him and I guessed what was about to happen before he told me..the nva had zeroed in that spot with a mortar. He said he had smelled a rat and had just started to back away just about the time the first mortar hit, wounding the whole squad.
Hey Jim,
Sounds sorta' like an almost fun detail. Never shot an automatic weapon, but those crummy little grease guns could throw out a decent amount of .45 ACP. That had to be a little bit of fun. Shame ya'll didn't have ammo for the M60's.
Have read many books about the Viet Nam war, and several reference the use of grease guns. Seems to have been a popular weapon in three of our wars, I could be wrong though:).
I could see the USMC dumping the grease guns, not have to worry about them gettin' snuck home? New M60's that's something else?
As I said I have never fired an automatic weapon, but did have a Mauser Broomhandle pistol start cookin' off rounds at the local indoor range one day. Shot a bunch and loaded a ten round stripper clip. Pulled the trigger two to three times and I was empty. Couldn't touch the barrel. Didn't feel a thing, and the cooked rounds were on target. Maybe the front heavy "Broom" did that.
What is an "OJ" ? Does that mean opium joint?
Remember seeing a show about WWII PT boats. At the end of the war they were all rounded up and burned. Think there are about three or so left in collector hands.
Interesting story, yours I mean.
Regards and death to bad guys,
Robert
Yes, an OJ was an opium joint, the bane of the fighting Marine. In the bush I never saw any drug use, but I wasn't a doper either. While at Danang(FLC/China Beach), I saw constant drug abuse. Heroin was as common as a pack of Marlboros. It came in a small plastic vial. I found one once and picked it up. Another Marine came over and told me not to get caught with that vial. He told me what it was. I pitched it as far as I could. I was as nervous as a cat around those guys. They made daily runs with the drug dogs. I watched a Marine hide a 100-pack of OJ's in a stack of sandbags. The dog found them in a heartbeat. To this day, I can't understand why anyone would want to do drugs in a combat zone. I never liked the movie "Platoon" because they made the druggies look like the cool guys, and the hardcores look like murderers. It wasn't that way where I was.
The grease guns were the TO weapon for tanks and amtraks, or so I was told (still don't know what TO means). I was at Albany before my tour, and my job was cleaning out the incoming amtraks (on rail cars) from RVN before rebuild. Among some of the more interesting items I found in blasted amtraks was a human foot still in a boot, a 45, a crucifix, and one of those grease guns with a fully loaded magazine (in the driver's compartment). A lot of them burned, and there was a very distinct smell in those.
We used to send in any newbie first, then we would hit the CO2 fire extinguisher system (doorway switch) and the newbie would come out looking like he had just returned from the artic. Marine humor at work. And yes, they did it to me too. There were a lot of those rail cars.
As for automatic weapons, I fired the M60, the M16, the AK47 and the Ma Duece. My favorite auto weapon was the M16. A hand held M60 with its assault pack was a handfull, which is why most machinegunners were big guys that we protected like he was our mother. Bad part was that he attracted a lot of heavy fire, good part was he could return it as long as his fellow Marines got the ammo to him. I tried to stay as far away from machinegunners, radiomen, and platoon commanders as I could. All three had a huge attrition rate. I will say this, Marine officers in combat are truly impressive to watch. To a man, they were fearless.
We had a sargeant try to sneak an AK47 home in a fridge, and the last time I saw him he was in handcuffs, staring at the ground.
Jim
"TO" is short for Table of Organization and Equipment. Essentially it's the bible of what a unit is to have. How many men of each rank, what their issued equipment is, what their organizational equipment is. Some bean counter somewhere has lists upon lists for each level from fire team, to squad, to platoon, to company, etc etc.
Thanks, Dan. That acronym has stuck in my mind for 35+ years and not once have I tried to discover what it meant. I always suspected it was something close to what it is. Being a big tuff Marine, I didn't want anyone to know I didn't know what the heck they were talking about. Now I am old and don't care.
Jim
Thanks Jim,
Always enjoy your stories and real life information.
Death to bad guys,
Robert