2F or 3F?

[Dave]

Can FFF be used in rifles? I have had conflicking opinion. If so would you reduce the load? thank you.

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[Embalmer]

I use 60 grains 2f for live fire and 65grains 3f for blanks. I have fired 3f live with 55 grains, with no illeffect.

[Teleoceras]

Dave:

What caliber is the rifle?

Generally a lot of people as a rule use 10% less 3Fg powder compared to 2Fg. That is because 3Fg being finer grained burns faster generating more pressure in the breech. The upside of that is that there is generally less fouling using 3Fg.

Since smaller caliber barrels have greater tensile strength, they can better handle the stronger pressure created by the ignition of 3Fg powder.

The different burn rate between the two powder sizes will also affect accuracy. I find it best to work up the load in 5 grain increments until you find the best accuracy. If you have both grain sizes, you can then compare your rifle's perfect load with each grain size and then stick with what works best.

That is the great thing about this passion of ours is that you can work up your loads on the fly while at the range.

Good luck!

[Johnny Peppers]

I shot 60 grs. of 3F for years in my 54 caliber Sharon Rifle Barrel Co. which I put together from a kit. Our club only had a 50 yard range for years, and the above load was extremely accurate and shot very clean.

[Embalmer]

whoops forgot to add that those loads were for .58 cal 1858, 1861, 1863 enfields and springfields that I have.

[Patrick Chadwick]

I use Swiss powders Nos 2, 3 and 4 (FFF, FF, 1 1/2 F) as follows:
Finer powders produce harder fouling, but there is a certain trade-off by using less powder.

Enfield 1858 (military), 100 meters, 48 gn FFF (a very light load for a very heavy bullet). "Lobs" the bullet into the target.
But for 200, 300 meters, where you really need more energy to avoid howitzer-like trajectories, 68 gn FF. The same load of FFF produces too much hard fouling for military competitions where you are not allowed to clean between shots.

Sharps Long Rang 45-70 (sporting) at all distances 68 gn FFF (as much as I can pack into the case). OK because you are allowed to clean between shots. If you do not, the 2nd shot may be OK, but the 3rd shot really falls off.

Mauser 71 (military). No cleaning allowed. Use 68 gn No 4 (1 1/2 F) for soft fouling. Needs plenty of lube. Faster powders bend the system (single side locking lug) and reduce accuracy.

That's my personal choice. Hope it helps!

Patrick

[Dave]

Thank you guys! I only use the rifle for hunting and have had a hard time reloading, can load 2nd. with effort, 3rd is impossible to get bullet down bore without pounding (I am not as strong as I used to be). Rifle is a 54 cal. Thompson center, I think called a New Englander. Been using Pyrodex, have tried defferent bullet types. I now have some Amer. Powder Co. stuff which is supposed to be non-fouling. If so, I will be able to experiment without swabbing every 2-3 shots.

[Dave]

Thanks guys. I only use rifle for hunting deer. It is 54 cal Thompson Center 'New Englander'. Have had much trouble reloading, #2 goes bullet goes down with much effort, #3 is impossible without pounding down. Have tried different bullets, using Pyrodex. I have now aquired some Amer Powder Co. substitute which is supossed to be non-fouling. If so, I can now do allot of experimenting without swabbing bore every couple of shots.

[MEHavey]

I think you are fighting a losing battle in trying to avoid swabbing the bore for a patch&ball rifle between (multiple) shots.

In fact I would suggest you go take a look as some very fine rifled-musket designs (generally Enfield/Springfield) if that's your goal. They were designed for that very purpose--repeated/no-clean firing--and can be very accurate at longer ranges using the Lyman old-style/thin-skirt Minnie ball. [Ask any N-SSA shooter]

[Embalmer]

my springfields/enfields usually can get 8 shots off before the barrel gets too fouled up to get balls down with difficulty. Wish someone would make one of those "cleaner/scraper" bullets issued in the civil war.