Lanyard with Magazine?

[Johnny Peppers]

If you accept the premise that the 1911 was designed and built for the cavalry, you also have to take into account that the saber was the primary weapon in a cavalry charge and the pistol was the secondary weapon while the Model 1911 was being developed. Until the Model 1912 holster, all holsters were right side, butt to the front for the pistol to be used in the left hand.
Also you have to forget the Hollywood scenes where the cops shuck out magazines right and left as if they were expendable equipment. Also, at what time would the trooper have attached the magazine to a lanyard. Did he stop, release the magazine, and attached it to a waiting lanyard, or did he wear enough lanyards already attched to the magazines? The magazine pockets were not designed to contain a magazine with a lanyard attached. One lanyard with a pistol and two magazines attached by means of extra snaps would have required some type of special holster to hold everything.
My idea on the lanyard loop on the magazine is that it was a good idea, but had no practical application. The military is slow to change, but by 1915 the lanyard loop on the magazine was considered useless and discontinued.

[badabing]

Yeah, I can just see some poor cavalry guy getting all tangled up in two or three lanyards while trying to control the horse and swing his sabre around. I think it's one of those things that sound like a good idea but don't work out too well in practice.

[Jim K]

I felt the same way, that since the magazine is really part of the pistol, its loss would be a serious matter in combat, especially to cavalry. A trooper who dropped a pistol or a magazine under the feet of a hundred galloping horses didn't just say, "'scuse me" and go back to pick it up.

But I can find no mention of using a lanyard for a magazine, and no pictures of any soldiers of the period with such a lanyard. Pictures of riders at the charge, in fact, don't show any lanyard attached to either the pistol or the magazine. Cavalry manuals don't mention attaching the magazine to anything, although it would have been possible to attach the primary magazine to the pistol so it would not get lost in a magazine swap. It is my suspicion that the lanyard was not much used even for the pistol, except possibly by military police (for the same reason some police still use a lanyard). The scarcity of lanyards would seem to bear that out; if the lanyard was as common as I had once thought, there should be more of them around.

But in the case of the magazine loop, Johnny is right - it was a good idea but its use was not practical.

Jim

[steved409]

As stated the M1902 lanyard did not fit the loop on the M1911 pistol...enter the loop on the magazine which WILL accept the M1902 lanyard. Just a thought. Also the loss of the loop on the magazine correspondes LOOSELY with the adoption of the new M1917 lanyard. Does anyone KNOW EXACTLY when they were adopted.

[Johnny Peppers]

What is the connection with the lanyard loop on the magazine being discontinued in October of 1915 and the adoption of a new lanyard patented February 20, 1917?
The last Model 1911 pistol shipped from Colt with the lanyard loop magazine was serial number 125566, and the new lanyard would probably have appeared some weeks or months after the original patent date in 1917. It does not appear that Ordnance was in any hurry to adopt a new lanyard.

[Jim K]

"What is the connection with the lanyard loop on the magazine being discontinued in October of 1915 and the adoption of a new lanyard patented February 20, 1917?"

Was there any?

Jim

[Johnny Peppers]

"Also the loss of the loop on the magazine correspondes LOOSELY with the adoption of the new M1917 lanyard. "


I ask the same thing.

[steved409]

I thought maybe the lanyard ring on the mags were dropped because of the new M1917 lanyard would fit the pistol---that is why I asked the question in the final sentence: "Does anyone KNOW EXACTLY when they were adopted."

But I wasn't expecting such harsh replies. But thanks anyway, guys.

I almost hate to ask about the actual reason for removing the rings!?

SteveD

[Johnny Peppers]

The lanyard loop on the magazine was removed because it served no useful purpose. The lanyard was to attach to the pistol, and this was carried over into 1911A1 production, where there had not been a lanyard loop magazine made in over 25 years when the new lanyard was issued.