Martini-Enfield Safety and Firing Issues

[Drachenblut]

Hello Milsurp Gents!

This is my first post here, so I thought I'd start if off with a bang (or lack of). I own a Martini-Enfield Artillery Carbine Mk.II converted in 1898 to .303 and issued in 1899 to a pioneer division of the 3rd Lanarkshire Volunteer Rifles (Later to become part of the Cameronians). I stripped and inspected it, the bore is dark, no pitting and strong rifling. The barrel has quite a bit of pitting under the wood, along the knoxform reciever and along the barrel area. I had a friend of mine, a gunsmith, take a quick look at it and he said it should be safe to shoot, but I would like a second opinion on that. I took her to the range, loaded a commercial Federal .303 cartridge and pulled the trigger. Snap. No bang. The rifle dented the primer at the back but did not fire. I removed the cartridge after 30 seconds incase of hangfire. I took it home and have not shot it since. I disassembled the action block, cleaned it thouroughly, and re-assembled it. Apparently the bevelled hole in the action body was pointing the wrong way? I checked with an online manual.

My questions are:

1. Should I take the rifle to a gunsmith and have him inspect it thouroghly, and check the headspacing for me?

2. In your honest opinions, with the pitting evidenced on the rifle in the following picture link, is it safe to shoot? Why would it not shoot before? Any ideas?

Here is a link to the pictures:

Martini Enfield A C II 1898 pictures by Drachenblutt - Photobucket

Thank you,
Drachenblut

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[TheDoubleD]

The pitting is insignifcant.

Post a picture of the the primer strike mark on the primer. Is it striking center?

Not striking center will misfires. This can be adjusted.

What beveled hole in the action body?

Do you you mean by any chance the slot in the striker? Wide side shoud be down.

Disassemble the breech block by removing the striker and striker spring. Re install just the breech block back in the action with out the striker and striker spring. Insert a cartridge in the action a close the action.

With a set of feeler gauges see if you can insert a combination of feeler gauges equalling .006 between the back of the chamber round and the face of the breech block.



If you can't, good! The head space for this carridge is good. If you can, try inserting a combination of .010. If you can then you have excess headspace for that cartridge. The rifle may also be out of head space, but this test only works for this cartridge. Different brands and lots will head space differently. So try a different cartridge.

If head space is correct and striker is right and hitting center, try again and get back to us

[Drachenblut]

Hello,

I cannot take a picture as I disposed of the round. However, the striker was hitting far left and low, almost to the far South Western quadrant of the primer. How can I adjust this? I was told I would need a gunsmith to do metal machining work to correct the issue?
I meant the beveled slot in the striker, yes. I have taken it apart, cleaned it, and re-assembled with the larger side facing down towards the trigger assembly.
I will have to purchase some feeler gauges and try the bolt disassembly and remove the striker and spring, then trying the lock up. What if the feeler gauge I can get in is less than 0.06?
Thank you so far,
Drachenblut

[TheDoubleD]

Feeler gauges come in a set with multiple blades.

You didn't need to throw the round away it could have been recycled and in all likelyhood was still a good round from what you described.

Now that you have the striker correctly oriented, I would try firing the gun again. The gun may function just fine. Before you load the gun, take a magic marker and mark the head of the case with a dot. Load the round in the chamber. Align the dot so it is at 12 o'clock. Try to fire the gun. After firing or trying to fire take a picture of the firing pin indentation and I will tell you if it needs adjusted.

If it needs adjusted, I will provide you witht he instructions to take to you gunsmith for correction. It is a correction and not a major maching project.

Don't throw the cartridges away, put them in the mail and send them to me.

[Drachenblut]

DoubleD,

Where are you located? Merely curious.
Onto the good news, I did as you suggested, removed the striker and spring, re-assembled the block, installed it, and inserted a round, closing the action. I took a newly bought feeler guide and it will not slip in at .006 (0.15mm) but it will at .004 (0.10mm)
Also, when re-installed, the firing pin protrudes from the block-face by 0.30 on a combination of feeler guides (0.25 +0.05).
I appologise for throwing the round, it just seemed to me that a dented primer in a still live round posed a hazard. Perhaps I am merely too cautious with ammunition.
I will try to fire the gun again, with the striker properly set up next chance I get. I will align the dot in the chamber. I will take a picture after that.
Thank you for your time and patience. I am still quite new at this.

Yours,
Drachenblut

[Patrick Chadwick]

1) LIve ammunition should not be thrown away. It should be properly dismantled (bullet pulled, powder removed, primer detonated). to avoid creating a hazard for anyone who picks it up under the erroneous impression that it is harmless.
2) It sounds like the striker is just not moving far enough forwards to detonate the primer. 0.30 seems marginal to me, as some of that movement is lost in pushing the case forwards until it is tight in the chamber. When I first handled my M-H, it would not have detonated a fly's fart.

The totally low-tech solution was to dismantle the block and firing mechanism completely, clean out the fossilized grease and other foreign matter (which included brass fragments!), then grease and reassemble. The firing pin now has a good solid whack instead of a soggy click. Try it, as I think that either your firing pin is too short (worn? broken?) or something is preventing it striking as far forwards as it should (about twice what you have measured).
M-Hs are very tough, so I would guess the latter to be the cause.

Patrick

[Drachenblut]

Hello Patrick,

I have cleaned out the bolt completely, and I think the firing pin tip has been broken off, as it almost looks filed back to a "rounded" point. How could I fix this? Also, at the base of the firing pin is a fat attachment where it was (welded?) onto the plate for the striker. If this is an issue, I could always file a bit of that weld off to make it protrude a bit more. But a dryfire does sound like a heft "snap" and not a soggy "click" as you mentioned now that I have cleaned it. We shall see how it performs next I shoot it. Any other advice fellas?

[TheDoubleD]

Lets cross one bridge at a time.

What you describe was a low left hit on the primer. That will cause a misfire in the Martini. You can't tell anything until it hits closer to center. Lets get that corrected first. Even if protrusion is correct the gun will still misfire if not centered.

.30 protrusion is huge, that over a 1/4 inch!!! My Martini's are more in the range of .085 to .090. Modern smokeless rifles are more like.050 to .065.

Are you sure you are aren't seeing .025 plus .005? Thank might be significant. but lets get it hitting center first and see if there is still a problem.

I am in Montana.

[Drachenblut]

Hello Double D. I lived in Montana for a spot, about 2 weeks in Helena. Nice country, loved it. Rolling glades and high steppes.

I mistook it, yes. It is 0.025 + 0.005. Sorry, buggered up on that one. Seems like it's rather short then eh?

I will see about it hitting center next time I get to the range, hopefully this coming week. I don't have a car but a friend does and I usually go with him, being my week off from University I can go midweek, so we'll see how she works out. Now, question, if the primer is hit off center, and the primer doesn't go, how safe is the round to handle. Last thing I want is to loose my blooming hand. Could it be the striker pin has broken at some point?

- Drachenblut

[TheDoubleD]

Put the round back in the box and save it for later. It is not dangerous to handle.

Got no idea what happend to the striker or that there is even anything wrong with it. Haven't seen it?

Post a picture of it.