+ Reply to Thread
Results 1 to 7 of 7

Thread: A Neat .22 Trainer... With Provenance

Click here to increase the font size Click here to reduce the font size
  1. #1
    Contributing Member SpikeDD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last On
    06-21-2019 @ 11:10 PM
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    254
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    02:06 PM
    Real Name
    David

    A Neat .22 Trainer... With Provenance

    How often does one of our acquisitions come with any history? Almost never! Here is a neat little trainer I am hoping to make a trade deal on. It has a very interesting hang tag that indicates where it may have last been used. Oddly enough, as interesting as the hang tag information is, it is not really what I'm after the rifle for. Over the years I have become a big fan of the BSA FTR rifles and have at least a dozen or so examples. Most are No.4's and the earliest FTR date I have seen is 1954. I have a couple of Mk.III's with 1953 dates, but I have never come across a Mk.III with a 1954 date. I know there must be a bunch of them out there but I just haven't seen any. I guess this will also set up a quest for a No.4 with a BSA 1953 date on it

    Other points of interest with this rifle.... It seems to have been FTR'd as a .22. I believe the SHt 22 IV* is pre 1926? There is a view date of 31' next to the safety with a Enfield inspection mark on the receiver ring, just under the serial number. Probably the arsenal which did the .22 conversion? It also sports a No.4 band and modified No.4 buttstock. Also note the post war broad arrow "house" looking inspection marks behind the trigger guard and on either side of the serial number on the barrel.

    Maybe someone can shed some light on the hang tag info.



























    Last edited by SpikeDD; 04-10-2010 at 09:27 AM.
    David

  2. The Following 5 Members Say Thank You to SpikeDD For This Useful Post:


  3. # ADS
    Friends and Sponsors
    Join Date
    October 2006
    Location
    Milsurps.Com
    Posts
    All Threads
     

  4. #2
    Really Senior Member krinko's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last On
    Yesterday @ 08:45 PM
    Location
    Omaha-ha-ha, Nebraska
    Posts
    334
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    12:06 PM
    Very nice, David---see, it doesn't hurt to post pictures of beautiful rifles.
    You should do it more often.
    So there.
    -----krinko

  5. Thank You to krinko For This Useful Post:


  6. Avoid Ads - Become a Contributing Member - Click HERE
  7. #3
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    11-26-2019 @ 10:07 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,240
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    08:06 PM
    devon Army Cadet Force HQ was at Mutley Barracks in Plymouth, now sadly knocked down as I seem to remember. We sold a SWIFT training rifle from there several years ago. There were originally 5 Cadet Battalions down there. Now there is only one, spread out in platoon strength across the whole County. Things change..........

  8. Thank You to Peter Laidler For This Useful Post:


  9. #4
    Contributing Member SpikeDD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2008
    Last On
    06-21-2019 @ 11:10 PM
    Location
    New Jersey
    Posts
    254
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    02:06 PM
    Real Name
    David
    Thread Starter
    Peter, thank you very much. This raises yet another question. It has been suggested that BSA, not being a government facility in the 50's, had done their FTR's for outside of government contracts. It would have made sense that any Britishicon government work needed doing would have been sent to Fazakerly. Do you think it is a "stretch of the mind" in thinking this rifles provenance suggests that BSA was also being contracted by the British government to do work? I'm thinking this had to be the case, at least for the Mk.III rifles, as Fazakerly never made them and wouldn't have had the parts on hand... where better to send one for a FTR than a facility already set up and doing them? I know anything is possible, just wondering if you had heard anything supporting it over the years.
    David

  10. #5
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    11-26-2019 @ 10:07 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,240
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    08:06 PM
    The Army certainly wouldn't have FTR'd old obsolete No2 rifles at that time. If one needed FTR it'd have been scrapped for certainty and a replacement issued. No8 rifles were already in the pipeline then.

    I wouldn't mind betting that this was a Navy rifle who would have used the BSA facility. It would have been issued to Sea/Navy Cadets and then found itself within the pooled resources of the Cadet empire..........

    Old obsolete No2 rifles were certainly in the Cadet system for many, many years until slowly replaced by the No8 but the Public School cadets (the CCF's) had their own until recently.

    Fazakerley were really a one-trick-pony so far as FTR's were concerned with Stens and No4's their bread and butter

  11. Thank You to Peter Laidler For This Useful Post:


  12. #6
    Moderator
    (Milsurp Forums)


    Amatikulu's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Last On
    02-10-2020 @ 11:05 AM
    Location
    USA
    Posts
    1,274
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    01:06 PM
    Is the actual marking "FTR" a military designated mark?

    If so, would a rifle under refurbishment intended for a non-british contract have been marked so?

  13. #7
    Advisory Panel
    Peter Laidler's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Last On
    11-26-2019 @ 10:07 AM
    Location
    Abingdon, Oxfordshire. The home of MG Cars
    Posts
    16,240
    Local Date
    02-23-2020
    Local Time
    08:06 PM
    Yes, in short. We have a .50" Browning, captured from the submarine the Santa Fe in Georgia. That carries FTR 1955 markings from BSA

  14. The Following 3 Members Say Thank You to Peter Laidler For This Useful Post:


+ Reply to Thread

Similar Threads

  1. 1915 Colt M1911 124847 with rig and provenance
    By Scott Gahimer in forum 1911/1911A1 Service Pistol
    Replies: 13
    Last Post: 08-05-2009, 11:42 AM
  2. Two more I though were neat
    By Snafu in forum M1 Garand/M14/M1A Picture of the Day Forum
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 07-19-2009, 08:09 PM
  3. here's a neat one..
    By AKA Hugh Uno in forum Mauser Rifles
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: 04-03-2009, 10:15 PM
  4. Tracking the provenance of a milsurp....
    By Badger in forum Commercial Auction and Sale "Gossip"
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 07-01-2008, 02:28 PM

Tags for this Thread

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts