What dose a ' L4A1 ' Blank Firing Attachment (BFA) look like?

[nzl1a1collector]

I have a puzzle, that I'm hoping someone might be able to clear up for me.

In British service there were 3 main types of BFA used with the L1A1 rifle.

First was the L1A1 model, very possible these were imported from Canada, as they are the exact same model as their 2nd model C1A1 BFA.

Second was similar in appearance but has a wingnut and a better retaining catch, it was called the L1A2 BFA.

There was a modified version of the L1A2 BFA in which the wingnut was replaced with a spring and nut arrangement. I call this the L1A2(m)

Third model is the L6A1 BFA, its a massive, solid BFA capable of trapping a bullet if needed.


My question relates to a reference in the 1965 training manual, two pages (p123/p124) are dedicated to the description, use, safety etc in relation to the ' THE BLANK FIRING ATTACHMENT (L4A1) '. Unfortunately there is no photo of the detailed BFA and although it sounds similar to the L6A1 I don't think it is, as the description of the L6A1 is different.

L4A1 BFA Description from Pam 3B, 1965, page 123
The blank firing attachment (L4A1) consists of an inner tube, choke pin, knurled sleeve, main spring and housing. The housing and main sleeve are painted bright yellow.

Fitting: Ensure the rear part of the knurled sleeve is covering and flush with the teeth on the housing. Fit the attachment to the rifle as you would fit a bayonet, press the knurled sleeve clear of the housing teeth, turn clockwise until tight, release the knurled sleeve, ensuring the teeth engage. it may be necessary to unscrew the knurled sleeve slightly in order that the teeth can engage.


L6A1 BFA Description from Pam 7, 1975, page 5-1
The blank firing attachment consists of an inner tube, knurled sleeve, a main spring and a housing. The attachment is painted bright yellow.

Fitting: Unscrew the knurled sleeve until the threads on the inner tube are completely disengaged from the housing. Insert the inner tube into the flash hider and position the rectangular hole in the housing over the the bayonet lug (see fig 107). Screw up the inner tube, using the knurled sleeve, until the attachment is tightly locked onto the rifle (the serrated teeth on the housing will begin to engage before locking is complete). When the knurled sleeve is fully tightened, unscrew it two clicks, to assist removal of the attachment after firing. Test the attachment is secure.

As you can see these are totally different BFA's. Dose anyone have a pic of a L4A1 BFA or better still a real one?

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[nzl1a1collector]

Left to Right
Canadian C1 BFA
Canadian C1A1 BFA (also British L1A1 BFA)
British L1A2 BFA
British L1A2 (modified) BFA
British L6A1 BFA
Australian BFA

[nzl1a1collector]

Well I think I've might have found the answer to my question. From what I can see and read from the brochure it matches the L4A1 description above.




Has anyone seen a BFA that looks like the bottom BFA in the first photo. (Right Hand BFA in the second photo)
More importantly dose anyone have one for sale?

[Peter Laidler]

There was a what we call 'safety related' BFA that came after the pressed steel ones but before the big bullet catcher BFA- that wouldn't actually catch a bullet without totally disintegrating, taking with it the BFA, the flash eliminator and the barrel threads, rendering the barrel scrap and splitting the gas cylinder for a good 4" too. BUT, it did severely prevent the bullet doing any more harm. The BFA would travel for a good 25 yards before it fell to earth! You knew something was wrong afterwards because the rifle wouldn't cock - ever again - because the gas cylinder was split to buggery! But I digress......................

The first dumpy BFA which you might be referring to didn't last long because the inner tube, that wasn't bullet trap type but just a gas check went into the barrel by a good inch or so and was square/cupped at the end. The problem was that the gas would blast a big corroded ring inside the barrel around the place where the rod started. It would also carbon itself in place too.

However, having said this, I'm not sure that this BFA equates to what you call the L4A1 type. I never saw one but have read up about them and don't think that they ever made it past Warminster trials. But no doubt someone on the forum will have experience with them. Anything your end Tankie?[COLOR="black"]

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[nzl1a1collector]

The interesting thing is the 'L4A1' BFA is detailed in the Training manual in 1965, but there is no mention of it in the 1975 version, just the L1A2 and L6A1 BFA's.

I also have a entry from a Pam/manual or IPL which I can't remember what it is. But the L4A1 BFA must of been accepted into service at some stage as it got given an NSN: -
1005-99-960-6852
FIRING ATTACHMENT, blank ammunition, L4A1 (for L1A1 7.62 mm. rifle)

The mystery Continues

[tankhunter]

Pete, I never saw an L4A1 version. I am guessing, but I think this was VERY short lived. as I have NEVER encountered an example for sale or in Service. The L1A2's were the norm. With the later L1A6's proflifferating throughout Units here & there.

In fact, this R/O Booklet Photo is the first image I have ever seen of an L4A1 BFA. Interesting, ANOTHER Version to look out for on the Circuit, for my own collection!....

[nzl1a1collector]

Nooooooooooooooooooo the first one found is mineeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee :-D

[A square 10]

so ......is the whole purpose of these to stop a bullet ? or was it also intended to work the action ?

[nzl1a1collector]

A Blank Firing Attachment is ... well a BFA.

Used to restrict the gases from the fired blank round so it can provide enough pressure to operate the working parts like a live round. Used on most repeating weapons and could be an attachment that fits to the muzzle or a restricted barrel assembly that gets swapped over.

Some are designed to simply restrict the muzzle, others will do that but also will capture a projectile if a live round was accidentally fired with the BFA fitted. But like Peter said above it was still very messy and very dangerous.

[nzl1a1collector]

I've just received a very amended copy of the 1959 3B pamphlet and it contains the Amendment with the L4A1 BFA. Here's the important extracts from it.


L4A1 BFA Description from Pam 3B, 1959, APPENDIX C (Amdt 12/May/1965)
The blank firing attachment (L4A1) consists of an inner tube, choke pin, knurled sleeve, main spring and housing. The housing and main sleeve are painted bright yellow.

2. Fitting:
(a) To fit the attachment: ensure the rear part of the knurled sleeve is covering and flush with the teeth on the housing. Fit the attachment to the rifle as you would fit a bayonet, press the knurled sleeve clear of the housing teeth, turn clockwise until tight, release the knurled sleeve, ensuring the teeth re-engage. it may be necessary to unscrew the knurled sleeve slightly in order that the teeth can engage.

(b) To remove the attachment: press the knurled sleeve and turn anti-clockwise one complete turn, remove the attachment from the rifle, as you would remove a bayonet.

5. Stripping
(a) Keep the knurled sleeve clear of the teeth on the housing, by pressing the sleeve towards the housing, and turn anti-clockwise until you can remove the sleeve, inner tube and choke pin, from the main spring and housing.

(b) Remove the inner tube, choke pin and main spring.

7. Assembling
(a) Fit the main spring into the housing.
(b) Replace the choke pin and inner tube into the knurled sleeve.
(c) Place the inner tube through the main spring into the housing.
(d) Push the inner tube against the main spring and turn clockwise, until the thread on the inner tube grips the thread inside the housing; when both threads engage, continue turning clockwise using the knurled sleeve, until the sleeve touches the teeth on the housing. Push the sleeve over the teeth and continue turning until the rear part of the sleeve is covering and is flush with the teeth on the housing.