Experimental Ross Rifle?

[Badger]

Here's an interesting thread that appears on Experimental Ross Rifle- CanadianGunNutz.com

Story goes that it came out of the Savage Factory ....

Regards,
Doug

Information

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[buffdog]

This is definitely an interesting rifle, and it made use of an original 1910 Ross rifle as a start.

In any purchase of a firearm, unless there is a lot of documentation, the basic premise anyone should have is "Buy the rifle, not the story." Without documentation or provenance, you have to look at the cautious side of identification or purchase.

While it is possible that the conversion of this Ross to semi-automatic might have been done as an Engineering study by some Savage Engineers, or maybe it was done by someone and purchased for study by Savage, it is a questionable story.

I would think that this rifle was made AFTER WW2, or 1945. I could be wrong, and could be corrected on this, but there is one very obvious glaring photo that would suggest that the only connection Sir Charles Ross had with this rifle was to make it as an Original Mark III just before or during WWI.

However, I have learned that when it comes to the Ross Rifle, one should not be surprised at anything, and here is an example of that. Certainly, Ross did experiment with semi-automatic rifles, and there is a faint possibility that this could be one experimental model. With the placement of the trigger, it must have been awkward to fire.


I would like to see some close-up detailed pictures of the markings on the barrel, to see if any commercial proof marks are present.

On the right side of the Butt Stock is stamped the letters " H G ". This is a marking for the HOME GUARD, and would not have been present on a rifle that Sir Charles Ross would have requested Savage to make shortly after WWI.

While the Story is suspect, the rifle certainly exists. It is an interesting conversion of the Ross rifle to a semi-automatic, and certainly has a value to a Collector of such items as a Curiosity. An advanced Ross Rifle Collector would certainly be interested, and since the value of an original Ross M-10 Mark III is hovering in the $1000 range, I would say that this rifle, as a Curiosity, should bring a premium over that amount, possibly $1500 or more.
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[tiriaq]

H-dot-G-dot also appears on Canadian 1914 Home Guard rifles. It would be interesting to note if there is a HG srial on the left side of the barrel breech.
Had a better look at the photos. I do not believe that the receiver is adapted from a Mk. III Ross receiver; it was new made for this project. I cannot see a Ross receiver there.
The machinework on the receiver is well done, professional quality.
The lock is a slightly inclined sliding block, behind the bolt, working vertically. Looks to be non-ferrous. I believe the rifle is a delayed blowback prototype, using the Blish system. I know that there was experimentation using the Blish system with rifle calibers.
Ross barrel, front part of the stock, part of the butt, handguard and magazine, but that's about it. Its not really a converted Ross rifle, its a rifle made using some salvaged Ross parts.
Who did it? Darned if I know. If it is indeed a Blish experiment, I'd suggest the 1920s.

[smellie]

Tiriaq, I quite agree as to the time frame.

There was experimentation with the so-called Blish Principle for some years. Also, it took very different forms.

This rifle is closer to a 1921 Thompson in operation than it is to the later Thompson Autorifle which fared so poorly in the US Government trials.

There IS a possibility that this is an earlier Thompson experimental, when they still were experimenting with the sliding wedge, before abandoning that in favour of the self-rotating bolt as in the Trials rifles.

In its way, it is the grandfather of all the modern delayed-blowback military and commercial rifles, G-3 included.

WISH we knew more about it!
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