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Thread: Unit marking on revolver - 2nd battalion Devonshire Regiment?

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    Legacy Member spinecracker's Avatar
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    Unit marking on revolver - 2nd battalion Devonshire Regiment?

    I have come across an interwar Britishicon service revolver with " 2 DVN" stamped on the bottom of the grip with what I assume to be a 3-digit rack number. Can I assume that the "2 DVN" refers to the 2nd battalion Devonshire Regiment? If not, then does anyone have any ideas? I have been researching the WW2 history of the 2nd Battalion Devonshire Regiment (Malta, Africa, Sicily, Normandy, Holland for Operation Market Garden), and the little I have found has been fascinating.
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    Advisory Panel Patrick Chadwick's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by spinecracker View Post
    Can I assume that the "2 DVN" refers to the 2nd battalion Devonshire Regiment?
    the answer is: I don't think so.

    It sounds plausible, except for the observation that DVN is the typical abbreviation for Division, and I have not yet found a DVN abbreviation for a regiment. Indeed, in the lists of abbreviations I have found, Devon does not appear abbreviated. I think you may have to do some deep digging yourself.

    Taking this thread as an example:
    https://www.milsurps.com/showthread.php?t=47453

    such digging may indeed be worthwhile.
    Last edited by Patrick Chadwick; 02-09-2014 at 02:38 PM.

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    Legacy Member spinecracker's Avatar
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    Thread Starter
    I have come across some references to "DVN" being for the Devonshire Regiment, and 1 ofr "2 DVN" being 2nd Battalion Devonshire regiment.

    http://www.arrse.co.uk/military-hist...ark-2-a-2.html

    http://books.google.com/books?id=hkt...giment&f=false (look at page 198 of the book)

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    Advisory Panel Patrick Chadwick's Avatar
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    Congratulations!

    Isn't it amazing what one can find out there!
    As in the case of the SVR disk, little discoveries like this extend our knowledge of how things were actually done.
    Last edited by Patrick Chadwick; 02-10-2014 at 03:29 AM.

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    Contributing Member Gil Boyd's Avatar
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    Battle Map Marking and the inherent abbreviations didn't really get going until after WW1, so it is more than likely that this does mean what has been said as 2 Devonshire Regiment(of 11th Foot).

    However, when UIN's came in and the marking of units were coordinated across the Army, DVN would not have been allowed to mark that unit in that way, because it would have been abbreviated for Division as stated earlier.

    I have seen pistols marked DV and issued to Divisional Vets in WW1 to dispatch horses, and now you can see how unit abbreviations can cause confusion pre coordination of them right across the Army
    Last edited by Gil Boyd; 02-10-2014 at 04:32 AM.
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

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    Contributing Member Gil Boyd's Avatar
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    Meant to ask, is it a Webley, if so what Mark, or is it another make which might date it, with direct relevance to the Unit and where they were at the time?
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

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    Legacy Member spinecracker's Avatar
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    Thread Starter
    Attachment 49760

    The revolver is a 1933 Enfield No.2 Mk.1. The only thing that has been changed on it are the grips, which are the walnut type used between 1935 and 1938. The seller states that the revolver was a bring back by an American officer, and it was given to him by a Britishicon officer. I take that with a pinch of salt, but the revolver does not have any "sold out of service" marks, there are no civilian proof marks and no import mark. The only issue with it is a small amount of surface pitting, as seen in the photo. The bore is described as "mint" (I assume that means good, and that it does not mean green, has been pulled out of the ground, and tastes good on roast lamb). The serial numbers are matching, and it has the usual Enfield inspection marks. I'm just wondering how much this revolver is worth in the US, as I want to offer a fair amount, but I don't want to gouge or be gouged

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    In the UKicon Military Division is abbreviated as Div. whilke DVN was the abbreviation for Devonshire Regt before it amalgamated with the Dorsetshire Reg to become...., you guessed it, The Devon and Dorsets. Otherwise kinown as The Devon and Doughnuts!

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    Contributing Member Gil Boyd's Avatar
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    Peter,
    Div didn't work either with Battle Map Markings and was kicked into touch in the early 60's in BMM because its abbreviation caused serious problems as well, and the abbreviation Div was wanted by many other wannabee units. Used by those upset by this simply in spoken terminology "2 DIV" and so on.

    In 1938 BMM were once and for all sorted into symbols which could cause no issues with anybody's unit ego, and for example:

    . - A squad of men
    .. - A section of men
    ... - Platoon of men
    I - Company
    II - Battalion
    III - Regiment
    X - Brigade
    XX - Division

    Even these simple symbols were argued over, as the SAS and AAC called themselves Squadrons and on it went, and they were added to the Battalion symbol above.
    This was one of my teaching practices whilst serving, which in the detail I have never forgotten.

    The Unit individual symbols then became simple to understand, as they all form around a rectangle with for example an X meeting each corner internally of that rectangle signifying an infantry formation, because the Britishicon Foot Soldier of old always wore that fantastic target or aiming point of a white cross over the front of his bright red tunic...............War of Independence right through to Rourkes Drift. Very convenient for good marksmen!!!

    This rectangle then had the above symbols placed on the outer edge top centre, with the units UIN on the right and left handside when marked on a Battle Map so all could understand it. If it was a mechanised unit a lozenge was inserted inside that rectangle and so on........which made sense to everbody as tracked and small circles at the base to indicate wheeled armour.
    Red markings on BMM signify Enemy, whilst Blue meant Friendly Forces.............visa vee Blue on Blue meaning we have F***** Up and killed our own. Now a recognized NATO philosophy.
    Hope thats as clear as mud.???

    So in short 2 DVN.............. IMHO.......which could also standfor "Indian Mobile Horse Officer" was indeed 2 Devonshires
    Last edited by Gil Boyd; 02-10-2014 at 03:21 PM.
    'Tonight my men and I have been through hell and back again, but the look on your faces when we let you out of the hall - we'd do it all again tomorrow.' Major Chris Keeble's words to Goose Green villagers on 29th May 1982 - 2 PARA

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    Phew....... glad I was in the REME! But when I was at an Armoured Division Workshop, it was just 6 Armoured Div!

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