Collector restoring SMLE MkIII* HT

[us019255]

I know that Laur Duracoat is often dissed as not being as good as other finishes, but I have used it with good results. They do have a product for filling pits: DuraFil Surface Filler
This is one possibility for filing the pits.

I considered using it last winter on a Savage Little Scout boys .22 that had spent at least 50 yrs in a barn. Finally decided that the fun was in the relining and getting it working so I just blasted, phosphated and sprayed with Duracoat epoxy.

[mmppres]

thanks for the info Aussie reason I ask I acquired a truck load of old military rifle parts from a closed store an would like to try an safe most of them. Most were in 5 gallon buckets an they got wet. Had one bucket of bolts from various rifle that was one large lump of rust. thank you for info mike

[SMLE Aussie]

Hi Mike. I'm sure there are quicker options, but molasses has a couple of benefits - it is fairly much set and forget, you can make up as little or as much as you want, you can use the mixture for a long period, from what I can see it only attacks the rust, it is super cheap. Downsides - it is quite slow where there is deep rust, it is definitely sticky and smelly... if you are in a hurry find another method. I am busy at work so leaving parts for the week and getting to them on the weekend suits me. I would think if you have lots of bits it would work well - dump them in and get to the pieces as you wish. Actually, I think it would probably work well on your bucket of bolts. I'm happy with the results thus far, but I'm also looking forward to trying other techniques.

Cheers
Lee

[mmppres]

thanks i will pick up some today at market

[Seaspriter]

For a bucket of rusted parts, I've had the best luck using the electrolysis method. It's very easy. I bought a variable voltage/amperage power supply on e-bay for $50 (which also is a gem for use for nickel and copper plating because you can vary the voltage/amperage to fit the type of work -- electrolysis rust removal likes higher voltages such as a car battery, whereas electroplating typically likes 3-4 volts).

For rusted/pitted metal (which I've had a lot on boats and cars in salt environments), try using a "rust converter" (see Rust converter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia ), which converts rust (ferric oxide) into a non-rusting oxide which can take a coat of paint without the rust bleeding through. Then wet & dry sand with a sanding block and paint. The advantage of the converter is that the pit is much less deep than if it was bead blasted. I've not done this on guns (had none that were that damaged), but the results on my old cars have been quite good.

[Peter Laidler]

I still have a little gut feeling that as this rifl is - and only ever was - a miltary rifle made to do a job. As such, relistically, it should be treated like every other military rifle that had been used and abused and had a hard service life. Stripped, examined, list of faults detailed on the work sheet/card and sent through the workshop system. Let it come out as an old tried and tested workhorse. Just like the thousands of others before and since.

This rifle is no worse than the old 1965 or so dated L7/GPMG's that have been thrashed to death and refurbished several times and are still in service. They might be a bit pitted and battleworn - just like this No1 sniper. But that's just what it is........

[mmppres]

Peter has a great point when it comes to worn firearms rebuild an re use just keep them alive an in the action. these were in my mind ment to be used not just looked at

[CINDERS]

Good find and well done preserving a certain wreck you have 3 avenues to go down with the restoration A) Try and check the records on this site to see a scope is listed to your rifle and try to find it and the bracket you may be extremely lucky B) Source genuine HT bracket and scope C) Source repro bits for a less expensive option it is all dependent what you want. But as you are probably aware anything remotely connected to the word Sniper seems to be a magnet for shelling out big dollars.
If you are willing and have an endless budget and patience go option A or B but me C is what most of us go with try and get hold of Ian Skennerton or Brian Labudda they may be able to assist with the right parts or at least put you onto the trail Good Luck keep the forum updated as we all like to see projects and it helps with discovered pitfalls saving others from going down the same track.

[muffett.2008]

Don't want to burst your bubble, but to me it looks like it was just a H rifle converted around 1934 on a 1917 action.
If it were a HT it would have the scope mount brackets still intact.
Attachment 62375

[SMLE Aussie]

Ok - please let me start by pointing out a few things as I wasn't intending on getting into a debate, but was hoping to find a bunch of people that had some knowledge to share to help me rebuild a rifle that was in a completely unshootable state and about to get cut up - I was, after all, only after the wood when I found it and bought from a local gun shop for $100 (which tells you what they thought of it - they would sell their grandmother if they thought it would make a quid).

Firstly - the rifle was significantly more worn than anything I had issued out of the armoury to me (with due respect) - there is, indeed, a great difference between an end of life F1 or L1A1 that I can assure you I had issued to me when I wore a set of starched greens and this hunk of rusty junk - in fact, I can honestly say that my no.10 boot would have gone so far up the rear end of any Q-store Staff that had tried to issue me with something in that condition that he would have been untying my boot laces through his nostrils. Worn is one thing, having been left in storage after floods, covered in water and mud is another. The only positive about its condition when I bought it was that it was so bad (and its origin was so obscure) that I got it for $100. A bonus indeed... Bottom line - without restoration it was not even a museum piece, but a hunk of junk. Most of the collection ended up cut up, only the timber saved it!

Secondly - conservation vs restoration. I spent nearly four years in the Qld Museum. During that time I assisted the History and Technology section conserving part of their firearms collection. I do understand the debate between conservation vs restoration. Every piece was considered with the assistance of the conservators in regard to what level conservation was appropriate. This rifle, as far as I know, has no historical significance and therefore the discussion in regard to conservation vs restoration is somewhat mute. Unless someone can show it was used by Billy Sing, then its conservation value is insignificant. My goal, then, is to restore it to a point where it can be safely shot - indeed, I would like to get it to a state where it can once again shoot better than I can (which probably isn't that difficult)! This isn't like the old MG in the shed, it's like the one that has spent 10 years out in the paddock!

You can burst my bubble if you wish - in many ways I really would have preferred it to be simply a hunk of junk. I would have re-used the timber with a good condition sporter and turn it back into a full wood SMLE. Easy. Anyone who knows the fabulous gun laws in Aus would know that you can do a like for like swap of an action without going through the drama of a Permission to Acquire (PTA). That had been my original intent. Unfortunately (in respect of simplicity), the serial number indicates that the rifle is indeed a MkIII* HT - well, at least according to Skennerton. The stock indicates it was taken back in for refurbishment 2/45, which also coincides with the records... and the beloved nose cap matches as well, so I would suggest it is more than likely not just an H rifle converted around 1934 (??) on a 1917 action. If only it was - I would have simply swapped it out.

OK - have I covered everything? Probably not. But I was simply after some friendly advice and information... the condition of the firearm was such that the rust needed to be removed. I can't justify buying a bead blasting cabinet for a single project (my wife would be less than impressed, as much I would like one), or believe me I would have bead blasted it. So I had to find another solution to remove the corrosion (the rust was such in the action that the bolt had to be hammered out after soaking in penetrating oil for three weeks, and it would not have been able to be cycled without the rust in the receiver being removed). Hence the molasses... I am sure electrolysis would work as well - probably better (I do understand the chemistry having taught it in high school). Bead blasting - if only I had access... I might add, the jury is still out on the action - off to a gun smith tomorrow for an opinion now that the rust has been removed.

Cinders - I agree - it seems anything to do with sniper, H, HT etc seems to stir significant comment and debate (and seems to implicate large $$). My goal (as I can't justify spending a fortune) is to try and do as much as I can to get it shooting again without spending a fortune! Yes, it is a challenge... I really don't care that much if I get a scope on it or not, but I really would like to do it justice. I have a real problem seeing firearms end up in such a condition. They were designed and built to shoot, and I really would like to see this one get back to a shooting state. Also, I'd like to do some justice to the poor fellow who had previously owned what was clearly a wonderful collection, pay him some honour - he had become ill and had to store the collection with the Qld police while in hospital, and during that time their so called 'secure' storage was flooded, and his entire collection sat in mud and water for over a year before he passed away and his family claimed it. Nearly all of the collection has now been destroyed, but based on what he had I dare say it was a great collection that he had spent years and many dollars acquiring. Surely that is good enough reason to try and salvage this firearm and do it justice?

Anyway, that is really all this is about. The finish was fairly much shot, so whether I file it, blast it, soak it, electrify it - whatever, I would like to at least use a similar finish to the original. As I indicated before, I know the action and barrel were painted as was the practice. I can tell by observation that the inside of the nose cap, trigger guard, rear sight protector and outer band were also painted. The corrosion was such that I couldn't tell if the outside of these parts was simply blued or also painted drab... (same question in regard to the rear and forward sight). I was hoping that someone could let me know so I have some guidance as to how to best finish these components? If not, I guess I will simply blue them.

Peter, I understand that you have lots of information also on the 1918 pattern scope. I actually have one (no pads or mounts), but someone has 'modified' the rings, so I need to remove them (they have cut the claws off and drilled/tapped them!). I am guessing this requires some dismantling of the scope. If you have any instructions on how to do this, or you could point me to some, I would be most grateful.

Guys, I simply want to try and get this rifle back to a reasonable shooting state - that's all... any help would be very appreciated.

With thanks (and due acceptance and tolerance of differing views)
Lee