No5 Grips

[boristhepig]

Hi
Before I think of putting these up for sale, just wanted to be certain that they are No5 bayonet grips? As there seems to be a generous over allowance of wood, when compared to grips that have been fitted to my No5 bayonets. (grips in question are the lighter wood)

Information

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[Peter Laidler]

Yep, as issued No5 grips. I'd say keep the pale grips and get rid of the dark ones as they'd fail any '6 monthly' as being undersize. Generally speaking, wood should always be slightly proud of the metal it's attached to.

[browningautorifle]

The blonde ones are really huge...didn't know they started life that big.

[Peter Laidler]

It's because that's how they all come when new. It gives the Armourers some leeway when it comes to fitting them to the variables of the bayonet pommels and crosspieces encountered. Gives plenty of meat to work with when refinishing umpteen times in the future too.. Just a guess there BAR, but the dark ones are undersize.

[browningautorifle]

Just a guess there BAR, but the dark ones are undersize.

Seen, guess one too many times through inspection. Thus they end up loose somewhere...

[Lobo RSA]

OK, here is a silly question When the no 5/7 and 1907 are in the scabbard and attached to the belt on the frog it usually is on the left In which direction must the barrel hole be pointing ? forward or rearward?

[Peter Laidler]

Barrel hole MUST face the rear because the scabbard stud is facing outwards and you can only put the bayonet into the scabbard one way. Or am I missing something Lobo?

[Lobo RSA]

Thanks Peter Yes but the 1907 goes both ways. Reason I am asking is that most modern bayonets fit both ways but British do not, the L1A included . The Pakistani G3 has the Bowie blade and British scabbard design but if fitted it will only be with the barrel hole facing forward. I am being asked why they are different and have no answer?

---------- Post added at 05:55 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:47 PM ----------

While we are at it. My no 5 has the scabbard with the small piece braised on at the bottom making it a flat edge What is the history there?

[Peter Laidler]

Just a different method of manufacture. The scabbards are made from a length of tube and the closed end is set between reducing rollers that roll it down until the end virtually closes up. It is then drawn through a set of flat rollers, approx .55" or so apart that crush it to it's flattened oval section. Then a clearance hole is bored into the end. There were a couple of variations of the mouthpieces and springs too. Cast brass, sintered brass, punched steel to name a few.

[Peter Laidler]

Just reading an old 1970 EMER relating to the No5 and bayonet to the effect that some left hand bayonet grips were manufactured to a defective drawing, that were .017" undersize in thickness and therefore making the counterbore for the nut too shallow. These grips were also .015" too narrow/width which would require excessive adjustment to the right grip. Units having these undersize grips should scrap them and demand replacements.

Two points here. If you have a) a dodgy left grip, that's the reason, b) it mentions that the left grip should contain the nut - if you were even unsure which side the nut/bolt should go and c) it only mentions the nut as oppose nuts..... So this might (?) indicate that the problem was only with early single screw grips.

And here's something else. It mentions a SCABBARD Assy, Mk2. I always assumed that this related to the pressed/folded/wrapped steel mouthpiece, but not so. According to the EMER, this scabbard
'.........differs from the Mk1 only because of changed spring and mouthpiece design. The spring is made in two parts differing only in that one (of the springs?) has a hole for the securing screw and one is dimpled to locate in a hole in the mouthpiece. After assembly of the springs and mouthpiece a securing screw is fitted which locates the spring which is drilled (to allow the screw to thread into the mouthpiece...?). The thread in the mouthpiece may be 6BA c/s screw or self formed by a No4 self tapping screw

I've never seen one like this and nor has my pal, the senior examiner! The closest sort-of offering I recall is from a long Indian scabbard. If YOU have one, please let's have a photo. Apparently the actual scabbard is identical. Whether your No5 or L1A1 scabbard has a flat bottom or fully tapered is simply a manufacturers allowable variation.

And if anyone's really interested, the price of a No5 bayonet in 1965 was £2:90p and a scabbard £.50p.
A No9 bayonet £2:20p
No7 bayonet (several prices listed £3.90p
L1A1 Bayonet £1:25
L1A4 bayonet £3:75