Bren gun History and development

[browningautorifle]

The Bren Gun Saga is a very expensive book

You have to hunt around, it's cheaper some places than others. Far MORE expensive if you look in the wrong place...

[Peter Laidler]

Can I be brutally frank again and.......... how can I say this diplomatically and without hurting anyones feelings. If you're thinking of buying the FIRST Bren Gun Saga, then don't even bother. Spend your money on something useful like a chocolate teapot. That version was desperately wanting. The second version was, er....., a bit better. Or what is called a heavyweight book with lightweight content. Only my opinion of course. I realise now that I have now put myself into the same category of people that I was warned about when I first started technical writing many years ago. That is this......... The first person who reads your book/paper/article etc etc immediately knows more than you do. That's because he now known all that you have just written PLUS the tiny amount he knew before'
.
If I had to suggest a good all round book - or books, I'd suggest that you get the Skennerton SAIS booklet and some of the technical handbooks. The Skennerton is the best of the small booklets and the ultimate 'bench book' type ready reckoner in my humble opinion. Then I'd start reading forwards from the last page of the Bren Gun thread on this forum

Sorry if I have upset anyones feelings. But just telling the truth as I see it - or have read it in this case.

[Lee Enfield]

As Peter has said there are a lot of errors but here are a few facts for you.

Enfield made the Mk1, Mk1 (ptn a or M) and Mk3.
Inglis made the Mk1, Mk1m & 2 in .303 and the 7.92mm Mk1 (which was a Mk2 303 style Bren body)
Lithgow made the Mk1, 2 styles of Mk1 (ptn a or M)

All 3 manufacturers made intermediate guns (these are guns on the production line when the Mk1 became the Mk1m) and all Mks will fit the Mk1, Mk1*, Mk2 or Mk2* tripod.

All Mk1 guns use a drum sight not a ladder sight.

There's a few things to get you started.

Let's add to the confusion of Manufacturers...

the WW2 Diamler/Monotype MkII guns, and post WW2, BRNO, Canadian Arsenals Limited & SAF Kanpur MkIII, IA, IB & IC "L4" pattern guns....

Are Daimler & Monotype technically the same, or different assembler, manufacturer?

[Peter Laidler]

Just a minute chaps, Thread 13, para 3 is just widening the ambiguity! The way I interpret it, it reads like CAL made Brens post war and made Mk3's.

[Flying10uk]

Are Daimler & Monotype technically the same, or different assembler, manufacturer?

My understanding is that they are the same but often people get confused by the different markings and so assume that they are different manufacturers. I stand to be corrected.

[Lee Enfield]

Just a minute chaps, Thread 13, para 3 is just widening the ambiguity! The way I interpret it, it reads like CAL made Brens post war and made Mk3's.

There is no indication that CAL ever manufactured MkIII brens (except the captions in BGS- which are shown as wrong in the quoted test reports).
CAL took over left over Inglis componants and manufactured spares and participated in the "rimless" 280, 280/30, t65, 7.62 trials post war.

Whether they manufactured new (Mk2 pattern / 8mm mkI) receivers is open to conjecture, but it seems doubtfully that they did much more than assemble existing Inglis manufactured main componants. Certainly the receivers used in the British "rimless" trials post war and illustrated in "the Bren Gun Saga" show Inglis manufacturer markings.

[CGP1999]

excellent thank you all once again.
just brought the Ian Skennerton book 303-in. Bren Light Machine Gun: Parts Indentification & Lists, Bren L.M.G. Series Notes, Exploded Parts Drawings, Descriptions, Accessories & Fittings. I am also going to get the osprey book on the bren (as an overview), as well as ask my local library if they can order in the brem gun sugar to borrow. hopefully it will be the start of getting on the right track regards to information.

[henry r]

Now if we can just get the milsurps goon squad to pay a visit to peters' (ex)publisher and get all of his original, irreplaceable, source materiel back we might eventually have a good bren book.

[peregrinvs]

My understanding is that they are the same but often people get confused by the different markings and so assume that they are different manufacturers. I stand to be corrected.

Monotype headed a consortium of companies making MkII Bren gun components. As regards the main components, Daimler made the receivers, Climax Rock Drill made the barrels, Hercules Cycles made the bipods and F Tibbenham made the furniture. Final assembly and testing was by Monotype - who also made some small components.

[Flying10uk]

Monotype headed a consortium of companies making MkII Bren gun components. As regards the main components, Daimler made the receivers, Climax Rock Drill made the barrels, Hercules Cycles made the bipods and F Tibbenham made the furniture. Final assembly and testing was by Monotype - who also made some small components.

What I and I think Lee Enfield are getting at is are the MK2 Brens marked with a "D" on the receiver, indicating Daimler (for the receiver), made/assemble by the same group of companies to the MK2 Brens that just have a dispersal code marking on the receiver.