How many vent holes is too many vent holes???!

[browningautorifle]

like carrying orange in one of your water bottles.

And then the waterbottle tastes like orange forever...

the dreaded Canungra

One of my fondest memories...

[CINDERS]

We are going to be in VN later this year so I will get a taste of what the weather is like, going to do the Cu Chi tunnels well not do them but go out there, now there was a special breed of soldier hunting the enemy on his turf a "Tunnel Rat"......

[mrclark303]

Enjoy it Cinders, it's a country of jaw dropping beauty.

When I first went, Westerners were viewed with suspicion by the authorities, but the people were very friendly Indeed (some of the most friendly I have ever encountered) despite grinding poverty.

Unexploded ordenance was still a serious problem, despite being very careful, I still accidentally kicked a mortar bomb that was sitting in long grass in Hue, so much stuff still laying around...

Its amazing how time cures all. Today Vietnam is thriving, no longer in poverty, the wars been cleared away and the countries doing very well indeed.

The relationship with the US is now close, in fact a few weeks ago the US transferred an ex US Coast Guard ship to the Vietnamese Coast Guard.

This is just the start of what will be without doubt a close Military relationship as Vietnam and the surrounding counties keep a nervous eye on Chinese expansion into the South China Sea and the US carry out their strategic swing towards the Pacific region.

[CINDERS]

True enough words MrClark but it seems N.Korea is at war with the sea of Japan as they keep lobbing rockets in there and having them fail all the time might just be an expensive ruse to make others think they would be better off with a sling shot.....!

[Peter Laidler]

But N Korea should think very hard about taking on the NVA or whatever it's called, certainly if the NVietnamese become allied to anyone. They fought the might of the Chinese Army to a standstill in the 80's

[CINDERS]

I put the Vietnamese tenacity at war along with the Ghurkas the French certainly found out about them well before the USA & Australian troops got among it as for the latter in the Falkland war the Argies evacuated a hill with out resisting or firing a shot when they heard the Ghurkas attacking not wanting to face their Kukri's

[mrclark303]

But N Korea should think very hard about taking on the NVA or whatever it's called, certainly if the NVietnamese become allied to anyone. They fought the might of the Chinese Army to a standstill in the 80's

Like most of these Military Interventions, there is a back story, The Vietnamese had enough of the Khmer Rouge coming over the boarder in the Mekong Delta and attacking Vietnamese Civilians, on occasion these raids turned into sickening massacres, one particularly savage incursion pushed them too far​.

So the Vietnamese absolutely malleted them in 1979 (nobody else lifted a finger to stop the biggest mass murderer since Hitler after all) and toppled Pol Pots insidious regime. The Chinese in turn invaded though the land boarder at Lang Son,
(as Cambodia was a client state), hoping to break out of the area and head for Hanoi, how very wrong they were .. the Vietnamese malleted them too and pushed them back over the boarder with a very bloody nose!

I crossed into China though that same boarder in the early 1990's, it was still a very tense spot (like the inner German boarder but with more tanks, at the height of the Cold War), with many Military facilities on both sides of the boarder.

After having a few beers with a Chinese veteran of the Operation a few weeks later, he recalled it was an absolute living hell to go through, the Vietnamese fought like tigers.

Thing is, I think Uncle Ho and his descendants had been expecting (and planning for) a Chinese invasion, since things turned sour between the two Countries during the Vietnam War, they prepared a well planned defence in depth and the Chinese paid a very heavy price for every foot of ground gained, the crippling Chinese losses mounted, they threw in the towel and headed back over the boarder.

I often wonder what would have happened had their break out from Lang Son been successful, I would surmise they would have found themselves embroiled in the same trap the French and Americans fell into ... another 10 year war..

[Bruce_in_Oz]

mrclark303:

Politics, war and consequences. One view, here:

War of the Dragons: The Sino-Vietnamese War, 1979 | HistoryNet

The whole of Viet Nam has been the scene of wars, empires, collapse and rebirth for a VERY long time. As you travel around the place the "foreign" influences are in profusion.

The "basic" language is full of words "borrowed" from every other culture that "visited" the place; Khmer, Chinese, French, English, etc.

The whole southern / Mekong Delta region was originally a part of the late Khmer empire. A bit of "creative" intermarriage and a few sharp business deals, saw the sleepy Khmer fishing port of Preah Nkor, become Sai Gon. Later, under "new management" it became , officially anyway, Ho Chi Minh City. There has been a very large Chinese "business" and , consequently, political presence in Southern Viet Nam for a VERY long time.

On the East coast, there is a little region that was its own "empire" for a while. This was the home of the CHAM people, and remains and ruins are still visible off the beaten track. They were a mixed Animist / Hindu/ islamic culture, and were eventually displaced by the Kinh (standard coastal Vietnamese) people and ended up in several regions in eastern and southern Cambodia. Hence place names like Kompong Cham. The word "Kompong" is absolutely related to the similar Malay word "Kampong", meaning "village or settlement".

Occasional Cambodian "Prime Minister", Hun Sen, was born and raised in Kompong Cham, hint, hint. This city is not far up the Mekong from Phnom Penh.

As one should always expect in these cases, the story is "interesting":

Hun Sen started his political life with the Khmer Rouge and was, at one stage, a Battalion Commander in the Eastern Region of Pol Pot's "Year Zero" version of Kampuchea, that being the official KR name. Sometime in 1977, he came under the baleful gaze of KR central, and unlike millions of his countrymen and women and CHILDREN, fled, to Viet Nam, and was not one of the millions slaughtered by "pure socialists". In Hanoi, he was "recycled", and worked with the Viets to make a few changes of their own, in his home country, a few short and bloody years later.

Politics and business as usual.

[Peter Laidler]

Regarding visits (threads 12 & 13), 6 or so years ago my friend from 7 RAR (SVn- 66/7) asked me if I'd fancy a trip back. He said that when he visited the first thing another Aust and NZ visitor suggested that they go simply as visitors and make little mention of their time there as soldiers. On that basis you'll be viewed as tourists with money to spend as opposed to nostalgic returnees - or whatever the word is. My son went two years ago during one of his seemingly never ending gap years and there it was, stamped in his passport, the dreaded and much mortared Tan Son Nuht air base visitors entry stamp! I bet there's still tons of unexploded VC and NVA ordnance there

[mrclark303]

mrclark303:

Politics, war and consequences. One view, here:

War of the Dragons: The Sino-Vietnamese War, 1979 | HistoryNet

The whole of Viet Nam has been the scene of wars, empires, collapse and rebirth for a VERY long time. As you travel around the place the "foreign" influences are in profusion.

The "basic" language is full of words "borrowed" from every other culture that "visited" the place; Khmer, Chinese, French, English, etc.

The whole southern / Mekong Delta region was originally a part of the late Khmer empire. A bit of "creative" intermarriage and a few sharp business deals, saw the sleepy Khmer fishing port of Preah Nkor, become Sai Gon. Later, under "new management" it became , officially anyway, Ho Chi Minh City. There has been a very large Chinese "business" and , consequently, political presence in Southern Viet Nam for a VERY long time.

On the East coast, there is a little region that was its own "empire" for a while. This was the home of the CHAM people, and remains and ruins are still visible off the beaten track. They were a mixed Animist / Hindu/ islamic culture, and were eventually displaced by the Kinh (standard coastal Vietnamese) people and ended up in several regions in eastern and southern Cambodia. Hence place names like Kompong Cham. The word "Kompong" is absolutely related to the similar Malay word "Kampong", meaning "village or settlement".

Occasional Cambodian "Prime Minister", Hun Sen, was born and raised in Kompong Cham, hint, hint. This city is not far up the Mekong from Phnom Penh.

As one should always expect in these cases, the story is "interesting":

Hun Sen started his political life with the Khmer Rouge and was, at one stage, a Battalion Commander in the Eastern Region of Pol Pot's "Year Zero" version of Kampuchea, that being the official KR name. Sometime in 1977, he came under the baleful gaze of KR central, and unlike millions of his countrymen and women and CHILDREN, fled, to Viet Nam, and was not one of the millions slaughtered by "pure socialists". In Hanoi, he was "recycled", and worked with the Viets to make a few changes of their own, in his home country, a few short and bloody years later.

Politics and business as usual.

Hi Bruce,

It's certainly an absolutely fascinating Country and one of breathtaking natural beauty. It's history is rich and for the last 100 years rather fast paced too.

Certainly good to see the astonishing transformation from povity to success in the last 25 years, you can only hope they might one day see democratic change to, doubt that will happen until the Vietnamese Government is entirely populated with people born after 1995 though...

There isn't a snowballs chance in hell of any major changes there while the old guards still in Hanoi..

I'm hoping to get back there next year...