Experimental Canadian 1943-1944 Scout Sniper's Rifle, serial number ASC-85-4 saved

[Seaforth72]

I am happy to announce that another 1943-1944 Canadian Experimental "Scout Sniper's Rifle", serial number ASC-85-4, has been saved. Canada made 20 experimental sniper rifles in 1943-1944, and 10 of these were Scout Sniper's Rifle (SN ASC...) The other ten were Section Sniper's Rifle (SN ASE...) Of the 20, one was captured by the Germans and two were destroyed in action. I believe that three others are known to survive and mine would be the fourth. This very rare rifle was found in New Brunswick and is now in my collection in British Columbia.

Luckily the sporterization that had been done to it was not too bad and the rifle is now undergoing a restoration. The body and bolt serial numbers match. The unique swing out front sight system is intact as is the barrel and the special 90-degree safety lever. Sadly the windmill rear sight, scope , scope slide (upper mount) and scope base (screwed to the body) are missing. The original hand guard is present but the butt and fore-end had been replaced by generic sporterized No. 4 wood.

I also acquired another rare Canadian Long Branch sniper rifle and scope at Poulin's Auction in the USA this Spring (2017) while I was negotiating for ASC-85-4. The Poulin rifle, 80L8006 is also rare as it is one of those 1944 dated sniper rifles which had originally been equipped with a C No. 32 MK. 4 / C No. 67 MK. I scope. It is also the actual rifle used to illustrate the type in the Canadian E.M.E. Instructions C 500 (C.A.) Issue 1 (6 May 1946) and Issue 3 (21 Apr 53). This rifle and scope are also illustrated in THE BRITISH SNIPER by Skennerton page 180. It had been in the Pattern Room in England until the 1950s and it ended up in the late Bob Faris' collection, with a mismatched Canadian R.E.L. experimental 3.5X Gimbal scope, predecessor of the C No. 32 Mk. 4 / The Canadian 3-1/2 Power / C No. 67 MK. I scope. The slide (upper mount), serial number "9", is numbered to Scout Sniper's Rifle number ASC-85-3, the rifle immediately before my Scout Sniper's Rifle. The scope and slide have now been moved to ASC-85-4 using an Italian made copy of the base, which although not being identical, does enable me to mount the scope for display purposes until I can have an accurate replica base made.

I have located a proper butt and fore-end for the Scout Sniper's Rifle, but the owners do not wish to part with them. I am presently using a very similar civilian "Monte Carlo" style butt with the built-in cheek rest and I am carving a fore-end from a No. 4 fore-end.

For the 1944 No. 4 MK. I* (T) 80L8006, I have a 1944 dated R.E.L. C No. 32 Mk. II scope to put on her (once I find a slide) until such time as I can acquire a C No. 67 scope.

My biggest wants at the moment are: a windmill backsight; a "Bracket, Telescope, C MK. 3 CGB420A" long base for Canadian Griffin & Howe type scope mount; Canadian military issue marked Monte Carlo style butt with built in cheek rest and pistol grip; and a Scout Sniper's Rifle fore-end. For No. 4 MK. I* (T) 80L8006, I need a C No. 32 MK. 4 / C No. 67 MK. I scope, ideally in the slide (upper mount). Military issue "sniper" wood with the built in cheek rest for 80L8006 would be nice.

REFERENCES TO LOOK AT:

In the Milsurps Thread: "Photograph of rare Canadian Telescopic Rifles from WWII (Expert opinions wanted)" there is a photo of a Canadian Army Sniper Course at Camp Borden in January 1945. The second rifle from the right is identical to the way that my rifle, ASC-85-4, would have looked whilst in service, and indeed, the chances are 1 in 3 that it is the same rifle, as mine is one of only three Scout Sniper's Rifles were made with no bayonet fittings.

"Without Warning" by the late Clive Law. The rifle shown on page 60, which I believe is ASC-85-2 with scope EXP.0443, is identical to what mine would have looked like except that the rifle in the book does not have the lightening cuts in the body or the sling swivel in front of the magazine. pp. 57 - 62 This particular 3.5X Gimbal scope EXP.0144 is on the list on page 58 as then being on rifle ASE-40-3 and was shipped to the UK in February/March 1944 and it may have been one of the four sent to France for combat testing in 1944.

THE LEE-ENFIELD by Ian Skennerton (2007) pp. 317-318 My 3.5X scope EXP.0144 is listed on page 317 as being on rifle 38L1957 at one time during 1944 testing in the UK.

THE BRITISH SNIPER by Skennerton. Page 180 shows three photos of my scope EXP.0144 and rifle 80L8006, when they were in the Bob Faris Collection.

In the MKL .. 1943-44 Enfield No.4 Mk1* Experimental Long Branch Scout Sniper Rifle Serial # ASC-43-3

Information

Warning: This is a relatively older thread This discussion is older than 360 days. Some information contained in it may no longer be current.

[browningautorifle]

Love to see pics of this when you have time Colin, even if it's a work in progress...just for interest's sake.

[Lee Enfield]

Colin, I do not believe that a no32scope scope will fit in c67 (windage on right side on the scope) rings due to the no32 recoil ring fouling the side rail of the Rings.

[Seaforth72]

Very good point. I agree that there would indeed be problems of fit and indeed it might be impossible. Turret position and tube diameter difference etc. A sniper rifle without a scope just looks so forlorn. I can only hope that one of the owners of one of those C No. 32 MK. 4 / C No. 67 MK. I scopes will take pity and put me out of my misery. :-)

[Surpmil]

Well done Colin, congratulations.

Were you able to get any provenance or "story" with the rifle from the Maritimes?

[Seaforth72]

No provenance sadly.

[Roger Payne]

I wish you well on finding a CNo32 Mk4/CNo67 Mk1 scope Colin. I am in the diametrically opposite situation in that I have had a scope, rings & mount base for many years, but so far a rifle has always eluded me. I have come close on two or three occasions, the last time being the under bidder on a scopeless rifle that turned up in NZ about three or four years ago. Fortunately I suspect we are both very patient men!

[Seaforth72]

Roger Payne - I recall a cartoon of two vultures sitting on a cactus watching a man crawling along on the desert sand, obviously dying of thirst. One vulture said to the other "Patience my a*s!"

[Lee Enfield]

Roger Payne - I recall a cartoon of two vultures sitting on a cactus watching a man crawling along on the desert sand, obviously dying of thirst. One vulture said to the other "Patience my a*s!"

Hhhmmmmnnnn, I know I'm several years younger than both of you guys.....

Sadly most of our cherry pieces are sourced through estate sales, that's just the way it is....and has always been.

[henry r]

I have the perfect solution for you two... send both "halves" to me.