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Thread: Winchester Model 1917 with very early unique serial number

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  1. #1
    Advisory Panel breakeyp's Avatar
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    Winchester Model 1917 with very early unique serial number

    Attachment 91243When production was shifted from Pattern 1914 to US Model 1917, Winchester was ahead of Remington and Eddystone in converting their production line and actually began production ahead of government acceptance. With no direction as to serial numbers, Winchester followed what they had done for the Britishicon and prefaced their serial number with a W. Of course initiative was punished and the serial method was changed. This gun is one of the last produced before the change.

    Attachment 91163Attachment 91164


    I later found this rifle, W3521, in the pile.
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    Last edited by breakeyp; 03-06-2018 at 02:50 PM. Reason: added additional rifle photo and comments

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    A Collector's View - The SMLE Short Magazine Lee Enfield 1903-1989. It is 300 8.5x11 inch pages with 1,000+ photo’s, most in color, and each book is serial-numbered.  Covering the SMLE from 1903 to the end of production in India in 1989 it looks at how each model differs and manufacturer differences from a collecting point of view along with the major accessories that could be attached to the rifle. For the record this is not a moneymaker, I hope just to break even, eventually, at $80/book plus shipping.  In the USA shipping is $5.00 for media mail.  I will accept PayPal, Zelle, MO and good old checks (and cash if you want to stop by for a tour!).  CLICK BANNER to send me a PM for International pricing and shipping. Manufacturer of various vintage rifle scopes for the 1903 such as our M73G4 (reproduction of the Weaver 330C) and Malcolm 8X Gen II (Unertl reproduction). Several of our scopes are used in the CMP Vintage Sniper competition on top of 1903 rifles. Brian Dick ... BDL Ltd. - Specializing in British and Commonwealth weapons Specializing in premium ammunition and reloading components. Your source for the finest in High Power Competition Gear. Here at T-bones Shipwrighting we specialise in vintage service rifle: re-barrelling, bedding, repairs, modifications and accurizing. We also provide importation services for firearms, parts and weapons, for both private or commercial businesses.
     

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    Legacy Member RC20's Avatar
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    I would not say punished as much as they just had to change to the appearance deemed right per the US Army.

    Granted it was pretty silly, but the 1903 has a pattern they liked.

    Winchester also jumped the gun on parts conformity and got smacked a bit.

    That is more problematical to me. They needed arms in the hand of troops and I think they should have done a mark (star or astricks) to indicate not compliant and then worked to compliance.

    Despite some of the reports that not all parts ever did fully interchange, having had mix masters, they all worked fine.

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    Thanks for the picture! Winchester got hit pretty hard on these rifles. Even to the point that General Pershing would not permit any Winchester M1917 into the AEF in Europe due the Compatibility issue since the early guns were not built to US Ordnance specification. The goal of compatiably was supposed to be achieved by January 1, 1918. The one part they could not get compatibility on was the fitting of a new firing pin due to the design of the rifle. Winchester even complained to the US Ordnance Department about the Winchester M1917 still getting a bad rep after the problem was fixed.

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    I own Winchester M1917 with serial #1xxx, it of course also has this style of marking. Yours is "quite high", compared to this. Do you know approx. when they switched to the final marking?

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    Legacy Member Melanie_Daniels's Avatar
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    The only book I found to this serial numbers said: After 3000 rifles.

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    I never tracked when the W change happened, my friend of many years wrote done the number of every rifle we encountered. He has since passed on and the information lost with him.

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    Contributing Member Promo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Melanie_Daniels View Post
    The only book I found to this serial numbers said: After 3000 rifles.
    Obviously wrong if his rifle has a serial above 4000.

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    General John T. Thompson who came back on active duty after working as a civilian at the Eddystone plant mandated the change to Model of M1917 and the full name of the manufacturer in a letter. I will see if I can find the letter with its date.

    --fjruple

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    Legacy Member Melanie_Daniels's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Promo View Post
    Obviously wrong if his rifle has a serial above 4000.
    That`s the reason the rifle is so interesting for me.

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    Its interesting but without all the twists of subtlety of the 1903 (to me)

    Also a lot of mis information like the 303 barrel was used and a 30-06 rattled down it.

    The Post WWI reman has a gap with some markings no one can ID as well. GM on the stock? Definitely not General Motors.

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