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Thread: 1.5 Mil Carbines Left In Vietnam

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  1. #21
    Contributing Member fjruple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lemaymiami View Post
    -and from what I remember back in 1971... any remaining carbines from Vietnam would give a whole new meaning to the word "funky".... If there were any real value there you can bet that government would be moving mountains to get them on the market and gone... Wonder why I've never seen any speculation on M-16's left behind...
    I remember reading an article about 20 years that the supplied a little over 750,000 M16icon rifles of all versions to the South Vietnamese government. After being seized by the "new" Vietnamese government, the new "owners" also used them in their conflict with Cambodia. I also remember seeing another article that the US Government seized a ship load of M16 rifles that the Vietnamese government was trying to sale on the arms market. The US Government considers all weapons provided as aid as still as US Government property. I also remember that a large numbers showed up in El Salvador and Nicaragua rebel caches after having been smuggled from Fidel in Cuba. The serial numbers had been obliterated. Recently the Vietnamese government had been re-manufacturing a number into shorty type M16 rifles.
    Believe or not this number only represents a mire fraction of the M16 rifles produced.

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  3. #22
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fjruple View Post
    Recently the Vietnamese government had been re-manufacturing a number into shorty type M16icon rifles.
    Really? Do you have anything else on this one?
    Regards, Jim

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  5. #23
    Contributing Member fjruple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    Really? Do you have anything else on this one?
    Jim--

    I have to look for the article. I believe it was in the Small Arms Review or International Defense Journal.

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  7. #24
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by fjruple View Post
    I have to look for the article.
    I'd love to find out more about that. Maybe pics of the finished item...or some testimony...
    Regards, Jim

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    Thread Starter
    I've searched some but have had no luck finding anything about the Short versions being made.
    But wouldn't doubt it.
    Look at how they 'Modified' the M1icon carbines they got their hands on.
    I wouldn't put anything past them, as crafty as they've proved to be.
    Charlie-Painter777

    A Country Has No Greater Responsibility Than To Care For Those Who Served...

  9. #26
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by painter777 View Post
    Look at how they 'Modified' the M1icon carbines they got their hands on.
    That's right, the pics were in one of the late pubs...
    Regards, Jim

  10. #27
    Contributing Member fjruple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    I'd love to find out more about that. Maybe pics of the finished item...or some testimony...
    Jim-- Still looking for the pictures but I did find this article which I translated from a Vietnamese eb site about the continued use of the US made captured "booty" from the "Republic" and some of its uses since then. This following is just a rough Google translation but is quite interesting.

    The spoils of the Vietnam War are still in use
    (Vietnamese Defense) - These are the weapons of Vietnam gained during the resistance war against the United Statesicon, many of which have been modified and used by the Vietnamese Army to this day.

    Ground weapons

    American anti-American weaponry is still used by many people to increase the M41. The M41 bulldog tank, the 1975 booty, suddenly reappeared in the Vietnam Defense Television (VCF) newsletter. It shows the possibility that the People's Army of Vietnam is still limiting the famous light-weight increase produced by the United States from 1950-1960.

    However, the booty considered to be the top value was the M113 armored vehicle. Up to the beginning of 1975, there were over 1,500 M113s in the South Vietnamese Army. After the victory in 1975, hundreds of vehicles were put on the armored reinforcements of Vietnam. Around 500 of the M113 armored vehicles are still in use.After participating in the armored forces of Vietnam, M113 has been added by the Vietnam People's Army DKK-106 mm M40 or DKK-75 mm gun K56. Following that, Vietnam replaced the US 50th Browning 50 with the Russianicon 12.7 mm.

    These armored vehicles were launched on a large scale in the 1977-1979 South-West border war, which overwhelmed the role of other armored vehicles built by the Soviet Union and China. Thanks to the M113, the Vietnamese People's Army quickly won over the Khmer Rouge.

    According to unofficial information in 2001, Vietnam has undergone extensive repairs and small upgrades with about 80 M113 armored vehicles. The upgrades and repairs were made with a number of components purchased from commercial sources and utilized parts obtained during the Vietnam War. At present, M113 is still the main force in the armored - armored forces of Vietnam.

    In addition to the armored vehicles mentioned above, the troop of the Vietnamese army also has guns M114-155mm, guns M2A1 105mm. These weapons continue to be modernized to the present day is still the ground-level ground gun campaign of the military forces of Vietnam.

    There are also large numbers of M16, AR-15, M79, and other heavy machine guns.

    The M16 forward rifle was also modernized for continued use. It is interesting that a strange variant of the M16 was "Vietnamized" with the name M18 appeared in the staff of the special forces and the Vietnam Coast Guard at the ceremony to celebrate the 1000th anniversary of Thang Long Long - Hanoi on 10/10/2010. Vietnam has also successfully produced the M79 grenade launcher, which has created an active supply of troops.
    Changes in the Vietnam War content
    Armored fighting vehicles M113.

    Air force - warships

    In addition to the M113 armored car, increased by the M41, the Vietnamese military also seized a number of other modern weapons and combat vehicles from the United States, including the UH-1 transport helicopter helicopters, transport helicopters CH-47, C-130 transport aircraft, LST-1 demilitarized ship, LCU-1466, F-5 fighters, A-37, transport aircraft.

    After the US - US normalization of relations, the chances of restoring US arms became clearer. Currently, UH-1 helicopters are being refitted and modernized with the help of the US, this helicopter is being restored to serve for civil and defense purposes.

    US arms were later converted successfully by the Vietnamese army and used as the C-130 transport aircraft developed by Lockheed for the role of carrying troops and cargo.

    US aid a few dozen this type of VN, but after 1975, the military of Vietnam only seized 7. The rest, some South Vietnamese soldiers fled the country, some destroyed. In service of the protection of the Spratly Islands after 1975, Vietnamese aviation technicians have improved the C-130 bombing mission.
    Last edited by fjruple; 06-30-2018 at 07:08 AM.

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  12. #28
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    Pics are available of the M18, which looks like a Colt SMG or 177...some with a can.
    Regards, Jim

  13. #29
    Contributing Member fjruple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by browningautorifleicon View Post
    Pics are available of the M18, which looks like a Colt SMG or 177...some with a can.
    Jim--

    I found this article on their facebook page. Here's a rough Google translation into English. I will also post several photos of the M18, there appears to be two versions, one with a suppressor and one without. Initially the M18 made an appearance at the 1000 year military parade of Vietnam. The M18 was still in their possession on the 45th anniversary (2015) parade of the fall of South Vietnam. Its appears from what I can tell from my limited knowledge of Vietnamese and English as well. The M16 was the primary weapon of the Vietnamese Militia. The refinishing and upgrades appear to be done at K888 depot in Long Binh in the former South Vietnam. As a side note it appears that some of the management got themselves in trouble by leasing out propriety at the depot and another incident of illegal weapons manufacture of what appears to be .22LR revolvers. Enjoy!! I do apologize to the original poster of this thread for hi-jacking his thread.

    VIETNAM MILITARY PRODUCTION OF M-16?

    "Obtaining enemy weapons" is a guideline throughout the Vietnamese military art. Using this motto, we have improved many of our weapons of mass destruction, making them a means of serving the war of national liberation and protection of sovereignty.

    During the Vietnam War, the AR-15 and M16 modified versions became the standard weapon of the US Army and the Republic of Vietnam (VNCH). So, after the war, many AR-15s and M16s were recovered by the Vietnam People's Army, with estimates estimated at millions of people. These weapons are now the standard weapon for the militia of South Vietnam.

    M16 modified by Colt from the ArmaLite AR-15 gun, is a NATO 5.56 × 45mm gun. Since 1967, the M16 has been a popular weapon of the United Statesicon Army and NATO forces. This is the highest number of guns produced in individual submachine guns.

    The characteristics of the M16 are quite light (3-4 kg), parts made of steel, alloy, aluminum and hard plastic (fiberglass or polymer). Gantry, loaded from the ballistic feeder with a barrel-shaped locking mechanism.

    There are three different series in the M16 production process. The first series: M16 and M16A1, used in the 1960s, fired M193 / M196 (or Remington 223), which could be fully automatic or semi-automatic. Two XM16E1 and M16A1 models were used in Vietnam.

    The M16A2 series was used in the 1980s, firing M855 / M856 (Belgian inventor of the FN Minimi), capable of firing individual pellets or firing three series of pellets. The last series was the M16A4, the standard US Marine Corps rifle in the Iraq war. M16A4 and M4 Carbine rifles are gradually replacing the M16A2 which is slightly outdated and less usable. M16A4 and M4 / M4A1 have removable handles for viewfinder, laser target, night vision, grenade launcher and light.

    "Vietnamese version" of M16

    During the Vietnam War, the AK-47 and M16 did not stop racing for the No. 1 position in the assault rifle category. Each type has different weak points. Although the M16 has faster firing speed, longer range and higher accuracy, the AK-47 is perfectly suited to guerrilla warfare in Vietnam thanks to simplicity, reliability in everything. Harsh conditions and strong power in close range.

    One drawback with the naked eye is that the M-16 has a long barrel. To overcome this disadvantage, in the Vietnam War, an improved version of the M-16 was the XM177E2 (formerly known as the Colt 629 Comando, belonging to the CAR-15 family. ) has been specially designed for special forces, with two improvements, mainly adjusting the length and long headlamps, which both function to reduce shock and fire. The specifications of the XM177E2 are similar to those of the M16, except that the shorter barrel length is 292mm compared to the 508mm of the M16, and the gun is also lighter.

    XM177E2 was introduced into Vietnam in 1966 as part of the US Army's Test Pilot Program, first equipped for American troops in the United States Military Command (MACV) and a number of units This is a special form of the ARVN. After the testing program ended, with the official name M177E2, this gun was widely available to the ARVN.

    After 1975, the People's Army of Vietnam obtained a large number of these. Recognizing the advantages of XM1772, Vietnam has equipped a certain number of special forces for the Coast Guard.

    Along with the process of using, the people's army of Vietnam has carried out many major repairs. During the repair process, the gun must be repaired to make many replacement parts. This replacement process has helped Vietnam master the technology of manufacturing M16.

    In particular, during the 1000th anniversary of Thang Long - Hanoi, a strange gun model called M18 appeared, attracting great attention for military analysts. Earlier, the M18 was observed for the first time during General Phung Quang Thanh's visit by the Minister of Defense to parade exercises.

    Although no official information has confirmed the exact origin of the M18, but based on the short-barrel characteristics, the length of the muzzle and some other characteristics, the M18 was identified to be similar to that of the M18. XM177E2. In many respects, the M18 can be considered a "Vietnamese version" of the M16.

    As observable, the M18 is compact in size, which is suitable for combat situations in narrow spaces or in missions requiring soldiers to be flexible in secrecy when approaching targets in response to the task of the task force, the marine police.

    In particular, the use of new materials technology (using a variety of light alloys, parts made of synthetic resins), using small size bullets, M18 does not consume the energy of the soldiers on the move.

    It can be seen in the hands of the soldiers of the Vietnamese People's Army, arms originating from Russiaicon or America, Western Europe are exploited effectively. The evidence for this is that a series of booty weapons after 1975, which Vietnam obtained after the United States and South Vietnam, all contributed greatly to the defense of the independence and territorial integrity of the country. That is the traditional "cunning, creative" of our Army.
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  15. #30
    Advisory Panel browningautorifle's Avatar
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    Yes, those were the pics I saw too...

    Regards, Jim

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